"It is important to keep in mind that we are not dealing with a case of violating doping rules for the use of prohibited substances or methods, this is a simple, predictable, often used method of hiding in my basement, desperately hoping my full-body glow does not emanate from the window wells as the testers repeatedly ring my disabled doorbell. This often allows for a full cycle of PEDs 3 times a year (11 months really), and has been proven to cover the athletes' derrière sufficiently for at least a year of appeals so I can drag this on,and continue to compete, all the way through the Olympics and make the IOPC and AIU look like complete clowns."
Katir continues, "It is important to note that I am an advocate of clean sport, have been tested 6 times a day and never failed a test, and I've never even heard of the 3-strike rule until yesterday. I lost my 10 year old 2nd cousin removed, I think, to a drug overdose 12 years ago, or something like that, and I had a really close call when I took too much cold medicine and got drowsy this one time, so how could you possibly think I would take PEDs ?"
"Well, I would like to highlight that at no time do we talk about bumping, okay? One gets carried away and reads things that are not like that, there is not even any lack of control, we talk, I insist, of a localization failure of the system itself, clarified and made evident, I want to highlight in this case Fernando as well.
"Cycling these athletes have to be located 365 days a year and they are aware of this issue, but there may also be problems in those instruments that measure these failures as previously reported were locatable.
"At the moment he has passed around 25 controls in 2023 and that is why it must be made clear that he is not under any suspicion of using any type of doping substances. That will be the line of defense that his lawyers provide.
"Well I believe that the truth is above everything, right? So in these matters, if it is something that the athlete himself has said, if it is something that the athletes themselves have reported, I believe that it should be taken into account fundamentally."
El director general de deportes defiende la inocencia del atleta muleño que podría ser sancionado por saltarse tres controles de dopaje. Escucha sus declaraciones.
"Well, I would like to highlight that at no time do we talk about bumping, okay? One gets carried away and reads things that are not like that, there is not even any lack of control, we talk, I insist, of a localization failure of the system itself, clarified and made evident, I want to highlight in this case Fernando as well.
"Cycling these athletes have to be located 365 days a year and they are aware of this issue, but there may also be problems in those instruments that measure these failures as previously reported were locatable.
"At the moment he has passed around 25 controls in 2023 and that is why it must be made clear that he is not under any suspicion of using any type of doping substances. That will be the line of defense that his lawyers provide.
"Well I believe that the truth is above everything, right? So in these matters, if it is something that the athlete himself has said, if it is something that the athletes themselves have reported, I believe that it should be taken into account fundamentally."
However, while Kitty's words offer a valuable contribution, they cannot be the sole basis for determining the truth. It's by balancing Kitty's first-person accounts with critical thinking and additional evidence that we gain a more well-rounded understanding of the situation. The critical thinking + additional evidence = failed to show where he said he'd be.
A whereabouts failure only means he missed a test, or committed a filing error.
Not wanting to be reckless, I wouldn't read anything more into that than there is.
"Only means he missed a test" - actually he missed three in a given period - or "committed a filing error" (correction: 3 "filing errors"), when in fact he committed an antidoping violation by not being available for testing as required and has therefore been suspended. But "not wanting to be reckless" you wouldn't want to read into it what everyone else does, including the antidoping authorities who have suspended him. "Clean" athletes will meet their testing requirements. Those who don't are dopers. He is just the latest added to this growing list in the sport.
I agreed with "jacksprat" who said "he missed three tests". Then I gave a summary definition of a "whereabouts failure" which can be a missed test or filing failure.
I agree with you in part: "I wouldn't want to read into it what everyone else does". People will believe what they want to believe.
Is that much different than fisher going from 13:02 to 12:47? Nico going from 13:15 indoors to 12:57? Ritz going from 13:16 to 12:56? Wheating by goi n from 3:38 to 3:31? Murphy going from 1:54 to 1:50 and then 1:45?And so on. For a lot of elite athletes there is that one big breakthrough year where they take a huge step forward. The difference between them and the also fans is that one more big step. Maybe they are all doping. Maybe a lot just had some issues(injuries, lack of the right opportunities) and then everything lined up. It is a bit more believable when talking about a sub 23 year old versus some 27 year old.
Is it that much different? Yes it is. Nico - one of the all-time great US HS talents. Ritz, even more so. Wheating? Massive talent as well who improved a ton right away when he was super young.
The issue is Katir did it a) later than most b) without being a teen prodigy and c) has Moroccan ties.
C may upset some people but I wish I remember who it was but I once talked to a guy - I think a Brit - who trained in both Ethiopia and Morocco. He said in Morocco guys would just put syringers in them out in the open. Not a big deal. Everyone did it.
In Ethiopia, he said he saw now hint of drugs. He said it was kind of like on an NCAA team where if someone was having a good day in practice his buddies would joke with them "What did you take last night?"
If this story rings a bell and you are that guy, I'd love to talk to you. Email me
Actually 2 decades or so ago, I met a Moroccan guy by the name of Mohammed online and we became friends. I wanted to learn the trade secrets of Moroccan distance running and thought it was all hard work and pure sweat and blood. When he told me Hamza Driouch and Mohammed Al Garni, both Moroccan friends were all taking drugs at a training camp in order to perform the way they did back then, I almost fell off my chair damn it!!! I asked him multiple times if he was for real and he said YES YES YES YESSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!
He emphasized that things are not always what they appear to my eyes on the surface!!! When Hamza dropped a 53 second 3rd lap to win the 2012 World Junior Championships 1500m did his words ring through in my head!!!! Hamza beat 3-4 Kenyan and Ethiopian teenage studs to win that gold!!!!!
Rojo, you are so right!!! I love you loads!!!
But dear Rojo, pls cut some slack for El G, he is clean AF!!! Don't ever doubt that, it's the younger Moroccan generation born in the 1990s that are hungry for quick success that are the bad eggs, not El G!!! You must believe me!!! El G is clean!!!!
This post was edited 2 minutes after it was posted.
"Well, I would like to highlight that at no time do we talk about bumping, okay? One gets carried away and reads things that are not like that, there is not even any lack of control, we talk, I insist, of a localization failure of the system itself, clarified and made evident, I want to highlight in this case Fernando as well.
"Cycling these athletes have to be located 365 days a year and they are aware of this issue, but there may also be problems in those instruments that measure these failures as previously reported were locatable.
"At the moment he has passed around 25 controls in 2023 and that is why it must be made clear that he is not under any suspicion of using any type of doping substances. That will be the line of defense that his lawyers provide.
"Well I believe that the truth is above everything, right? So in these matters, if it is something that the athlete himself has said, if it is something that the athletes themselves have reported, I believe that it should be taken into account fundamentally."
Is Nordas 3:36.23>>3.29.47 at an older age and no shoe advances plausible? What if his coach had another athlete who went from 3:38 to 3:32 at like 23 and was named in a doping report?😂
And reality is picking arbitrary numbers like this is stupid. Wheating going from 3:38 to 3:31 isn’t really any different than 3:37-3:30. If Jacob had super spikes in 2018 and ran 1.2s faster would his improvement be any different? You can make up stories if you want (Jacob was like 18, Wheating was an 800m guy) you want to believe they were clean. Katir story would be something like 2020 was messed up and he was going to run 3:34. And then the super spikes got him another second.
now if any of these stories are believable is the tough part. We haven’t really had a Tour de France style expose (well besides the Kenyans) that suggests everyone is doping at the top level but that thought has been in the back of everyone’s mind for a long time.
10/10 for the masterclass in skilled doping apologism. The most obvious doper in history has been caught and not only do you attempt to show that jumping from 3:36 to 3:28 is nothing unusual, you imply it means everybody is doping so we shouldn't care anyway. Even Rekwash could learn from you.
Katir did not have a messed up 2020. He went from 7th at the national championships in 3:46 in September 2020 to the Spanish record of 3:28 and second fastest European in July 2021, at the age.of 23.
Nordas was a 5000/10000m runner moving down to the 1500m.
All these points and more have been done to death. It's ridiculous that we have to repeat them now he has been suspended.
I notice how you have no problem apologizing for Nordas clear doping. Any reasonable person knows Gert was out to show up Jacob and started giving Noras the good stuff. Nobody wakes up and drops 7s off their 1500m in their mid 20s right?
and what does 2021 have to do with the effects of COVID on training and racing in 2020?
Progression are rarely evidence of doping. Well unless you are that one Irish guy dropping like 2 mins off your 10k. But WeJo also says you can do that as a clean athlete. Well other than caffeine…
"Only means he missed a test" - actually he missed three in a given period - or "committed a filing error" (correction: 3 "filing errors"), when in fact he committed an antidoping violation by not being available for testing as required and has therefore been suspended. But "not wanting to be reckless" you wouldn't want to read into it what everyone else does, including the antidoping authorities who have suspended him. "Clean" athletes will meet their testing requirements. Those who don't are dopers. He is just the latest added to this growing list in the sport.
I agreed with "jacksprat" who said "he missed three tests". Then I gave a summary definition of a "whereabouts failure" which can be a missed test or filing failure.
I agree with you in part: "I wouldn't want to read into it what everyone else does". People will believe what they want to believe.
No, only you do that. Most people see it for what it is.
I notice how you have no problem apologizing for Nordas clear doping. Any reasonable person knows Gert was out to show up Jacob and started giving Noras the good stuff. Nobody wakes up and drops 7s off their 1500m in their mid 20s right?
and what does 2021 have to do with the effects of COVID on training and racing in 2020?
Progression are rarely evidence of doping. Well unless you are that one Irish guy dropping like 2 mins off your 10k. But WeJo also says you can do that as a clean athlete. Well other than caffeine…
If you are consistent you treat Nordas and Katir exactly the same. For me that is with suspicion, but innocent until proven guilty. Katir will have a chance to argue his case, but it is hard to not lean guilty at the moment considering a vague explanation that doesn’t jibe with his previous tough talk on doping. We’ll see if he has the receipts to prove some errors by the AIU
I notice how you have no problem apologizing for Nordas clear doping. Any reasonable person knows Gert was out to show up Jacob and started giving Noras the good stuff. Nobody wakes up and drops 7s off their 1500m in their mid 20s right?
and what does 2021 have to do with the effects of COVID on training and racing in 2020?
Progression are rarely evidence of doping. Well unless you are that one Irish guy dropping like 2 mins off your 10k. But WeJo also says you can do that as a clean athlete. Well other than caffeine…
If you are consistent you treat Nordas and Katir exactly the same. For me that is with suspicion, but innocent until proven guilty. Katir will have a chance to argue his case, but it is hard to not lean guilty at the moment considering a vague explanation that doesn’t jibe with his previous tough talk on doping. We’ll see if he has the receipts to prove some errors by the AIU
Of course which is why progression isn’t guilt. Missing 3 tests on the other hand just screams amateur hour. And if you want to go down all Americans/morrocans/spanish/kenyans/… are cheats you are free to do so. It might even be largely correct. But we can debate how fair that is.
I notice how you have no problem apologizing for Nordas clear doping. Any reasonable person knows Gert was out to show up Jacob and started giving Noras the good stuff. Nobody wakes up and drops 7s off their 1500m in their mid 20s right?
and what does 2021 have to do with the effects of COVID on training and racing in 2020?
Progression are rarely evidence of doping. Well unless you are that one Irish guy dropping like 2 mins off your 10k. But WeJo also says you can do that as a clean athlete. Well other than caffeine…
If you are consistent you treat Nordas and Katir exactly the same. For me that is with suspicion, but innocent until proven guilty. Katir will have a chance to argue his case, but it is hard to not lean guilty at the moment considering a vague explanation that doesn’t jibe with his previous tough talk on doping. We’ll see if he has the receipts to prove some errors by the AIU
Why should they be treated the same?? Only one of them is currently facing a whereabouts failure
I notice how you have no problem apologizing for Nordas clear doping. Any reasonable person knows Gert was out to show up Jacob and started giving Noras the good stuff. Nobody wakes up and drops 7s off their 1500m in their mid 20s right?
and what does 2021 have to do with the effects of COVID on training and racing in 2020?
Progression are rarely evidence of doping. Well unless you are that one Irish guy dropping like 2 mins off your 10k. But WeJo also says you can do that as a clean athlete. Well other than caffeine…
If you are consistent you treat Nordas and Katir exactly the same. For me that is with suspicion, but innocent until proven guilty. Katir will have a chance to argue his case, but it is hard to not lean guilty at the moment considering a vague explanation that doesn’t jibe with his previous tough talk on doping. We’ll see if he has the receipts to prove some errors by the AIU
Nordås' coach had success getting athletes to 3:30 or lower. Katir's coach had none prior to this. The comparison between the two athletes isn't really strong.
Why should they be treated the same?? Only one of them is currently facing a whereabouts failure
Referring to their status before the ban. Obviously now, Katir is far more suspicious. And I'm not buying the coach thing below: Gjert wasn't some renowned coach, but he adopted a lot of Bakken's principles and he/his sons adapted and learned. It appears a training system is what Katir does as well under the direction of his coach. And yes perhaps some doping as well.
Nordas opens up in a pretty good 1500 in Lieven which should be a fun one.
This post was edited 33 seconds after it was posted.
I agreed with "jacksprat" who said "he missed three tests". Then I gave a summary definition of a "whereabouts failure" which can be a missed test or filing failure.
I agree with you in part: "I wouldn't want to read into it what everyone else does". People will believe what they want to believe.
No, only you do that. Most people see it for what it is.
I can't really control what you believe most people see.
I prefer to stick with how WADA documents describe "whereabouts failures".
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