Manangoi Tweeted a picture at that time of himself and Rudisha sitting on the bed together.
That's his Maasai tribesman. Of course they're close. But they've never trained in the same group. Bro Colm, did however notice Elijah Manangoi's potential and predicted he'd be favourite to win gold at the Olympics in 2020.
Kipruto is as innocent as the tennis player Simona Halep, who has now also been cited for biopassport irregularities - like Kipruto - after a previous doping bust.
Simona Halep, the two-time grand slam champion and former world No 1, has been charged with a second, separate anti-doping rule violation while provisionally suspended following a positive doping test last year
Coevett, Brother Colm didn't have anything to do with Elijah Manangoi. Elijah never trained in Iten, and Colm never went to coach in Ngong.
And to continue to think that EPO can give advantage of 5 min in a marathon is something only people without any specific knowledge can think. The same thinking the new shoes can give advantage in a Marathon of more than 3 min.
In 2012, I had athletes like Moses Mosop who ran 2:03:06 in the first marathon and 40 days later bettered the WR of 30 km on track (1:26:47) using shoes with the sole of 1.2 mm.
In the same 2012, Jonathan Maiyo, good athlete but not in the group of top champions, ran the marathon in 2:04:56 using Mizuno practically flat, without taking not only doping, but legal supplements. This means that, with new shoes (earning 3 min) and with EPO (earning other 5 min) he could have run in 1:58 !
It's ridiculous to see, today, how fake infos, repeated day after day in all Media (newspaper, television and social) become the TRUTH, and are guided by the interests of multinational groups (brands of shoes, big pharma and also WADA and AIU), without any scientific evidence.
To think Brother Colm can be involved in something illegal can only be the thought of people not knowing the person and the ambience around him.
Dr Canova. You speak what is apparently the truth and how I've been right there at the same Patrick's Iten High School and I've mixed with those apprentice athletes (Adidas) last year but when I was there last year (May 2022), Rhonex Kipruto was not there, but everybody talked to me about him and mentioned what a great guy he was and how pure, honest and generous he was to everybody including the little kids around the camp that he would give sweets and snacks to.
I really also think it is sad that Brother Colm O'Donnell is involved (by default) in this saga and that it reflects poorly on everyone within the same Patrick's High school when it is the bastion of honesty, clean living and hard working living leading to higher levels in athletics.
However I'm not quite on the same page as you when it comes to your thoughts about super shoes and the advantage they confer on distance and marathon runners. Running 208 209 who were previously in the 213 to 2:16 bracket so I believe there is a tremendous advantage in wearing super shoes especially for those elite athletes who are not quite at the top level. French elite athletes themselves have told me what a great advantage these super shoes confer. These athletes include Manu Levisse (2:11), Bour (2:11), Carvalho (2:10), Chahdi (2:08), and others.
TBH if the ABP doesn't work and flags innocent guys (or even just one) it has to be amended, period.
Hold on. This is actually publicized: the ABP flags athletes above highly unlikely thresholds. Statistically we know that most blood doping cheats do never get flagged because those thresholds are so high.
There may be once in a while an innocent athlete who gets flagged - but that never gets published. The next step is always an expert committee which decides whether or not it's likely doping. If it is, they either ask the athletes for comments or recommend target testing.
We know it was the former in this case here. After receiving the comments from the suspected doper, the AIU then asks a second independent expert committee for a judgment. (There may be some additional back-and-forth.) Only in unanimous cases of a 3:0 vote, a provisional suspension is handed down and the case goes to the DT. That's where we are at right now. It's highly unlikely that the DT will overrule that experts' vote.
That also means that the excuses from Rhonex that we just read were unanimously discarded by the independent experts, regardless of how convincing they may sound to some of us here who have neither seen the measured values nor the actually submitted excuses.
Keep that in mind when claiming the ABP does not work.
Great post! - I see you know something about the ABP.
The ABP has been accepted in CAS Jurisprudence as a reliable and accepted means of evidence to assist in establishing anti-doping rule violations.
The ABP hematological module is based on the adaptive model that looks at HGB concentration, RET% & OFF-score that are outside of the athlete's usual values.
Abnormalities must be at a 99.00% specificity (entails a statistical rate of a false positive of 1 in 10,000) - ruling out the likelihood of environmental, medical & analytical effects as causes of the abnormalities.
Here's great overview of the hematological module of the ABP published by Dr Olaf Schumacher:
The increase of the body's capacity to transport oxygen is a prime target for doping athletes in all endurance sports. For this pupose, blood transfusions or erythropoiesis stimulating agents (ESA), such as erythropoietin, NE...
Olaf Schumacher is one of the world's leading experts in the hematological module of the ABP and has served on the anti-doping expert panels of numerous CAS hearings for both athletics & the UCI. He also published many papers on the effects of altitude training, prolonged exercise, dehydration on the ABP.
If you want learn as much as you can about the ABP - Schumacher is the expert to study under.
There are also published CAS hearings as PDFs for hematological cases involving Kiptum, Chepkirui & Wanjiru that anyone can access & read.
In addition, the ABP is also used quite extensively for target testing.
God Fearing Christian, a good sheep, who just drinks a lot of alcohol. Maybe, indeed, it was an altar wine ; ) Or maybe he was feeling guilty and sinful because of EPO injections and drank to soothe the remorse?
I do not care about irish priest, but being a priest is not a proof of anything. On the contrary, I just pointed, that irish church is responsible for multiple children murders in Ireland - and it is a fact.
There is no valid argument why Kipturo could be innocent. Being a christian is not an argument and he himself admits that he was a heavy drinker. It shows he doesnt care too much about christianity and all this sin/morality business. He is suspended and there is very, very little chance that it will change.
I suppose, he will not return any stolen money (despite declaring it) and will just complain that it is so, because he doesn't feel guilty. It's typical.
I just don't get it Ghost - why are you defending all this obviuos cheats?
Dr Canova. You speak what is apparently the truth and how I've been right there at the same Patrick's Iten High School and I've mixed with those apprentice athletes (Adidas) last year but when I was there last year (May 2022), Rhonex Kipruto was not there, but everybody talked to me about him and mentioned what a great guy he was and how pure, honest and generous he was to everybody including the little kids around the camp that he would give sweets and snacks to.
I really also think it is sad that Brother Colm O'Donnell is involved (by default) in this saga and that it reflects poorly on everyone within the same Patrick's High school when it is the bastion of honesty, clean living and hard working living leading to higher levels in athletics.
However I'm not quite on the same page as you when it comes to your thoughts about super shoes and the advantage they confer on distance and marathon runners. Running 208 209 who were previously in the 213 to 2:16 bracket so I believe there is a tremendous advantage in wearing super shoes especially for those elite athletes who are not quite at the top level. French elite athletes themselves have told me what a great advantage these super shoes confer. These athletes include Manu Levisse (2:11), Bour (2:11), Carvalho (2:10), Chahdi (2:08), and others.
On supershoes, yes they are great but 3 minutes for an elite athlete running 2:05 or under is a lot. The data would not suggest that much -> 1-2 minutes depending on the level of responder feels more realistic. Do we really think Paula Radcliffe would’ve challenged sub-2:12? I do not.
Coevett, Manangoi, such as the most part of the best kenyan runners (with the ecception of marathon specialists), were used to train together, when still juniores, for 3 weeks during the periods of holidays from the school (in the kenyan system April and 3 weeks in December).
In 2011, Elijah was 18 years old, and joined the training camp of Brother Colm for 3 weeks only. That was the period when Manangoi (400m runner) changed event, preparing 800m (distance that abandoned after 2 races only, for moving to 1500m when recruited by Police, when started to train together with Tim Cheruiyot followed by Ouma).
I advice you not to invent situations NOT real, based on some kenyan pictures or articles in kenyan newspapers, without knowing the REAL facts.
Is it so difficult for you to inform yourself about Kenyan facts, instead to write everytime something not true, only for corroborating your obsession for kenyan doping ?
Because Ghost is an apologist and is in denial. The ruse is over.
Sir, I'm no more in denial than the other camp stating that "all or most Kenyan athletes are doped to the gills." That is just absolutely ridiculous and without solid foundation.
There are clear doping cases and whereabouts violations which are undeniable, but the Rhonex K. case is far from clear.
Do you really think that Brother Colm O'Donnell, the genial rotund Irish ITEN legend, would risk his reputation and legacy by coaching and associating himself with a cheating athlete? Highly doubtful. Professor Canova has also confirmed that O'Donnell is blameless and above board.
Mr Canova. Can you explain why so many kenyan distance runners of all levels have tested positive and banned for taking performance enhancing drugs if they have no real effect? Also, what do you think is the role of European coached and managers in the proliferation of PEDs in Kenya. Thank you.
Why would a priest risk their reputation by sexually assauting a young boy? Respectfully.
Priests who engage in that type of behaviour have no relevance or connection to Brother Colm O'Donnell who has led an exemplary life in Kenya for over 40 years.
In these days, there is a very interesting debates in Kenya about this argument. Particularly, there is a free and open forum dedicated to promoting discussions on important topics in sport. health and recreation. It is made up of members from a variety of fields, including sports, media, medicine, academia, health and recreation.
The name of the forum is SPORTS PLUS AGENDA (SPA).
SPA doesn't support or promote any individual agenda, but has the aim to create a grassroots sports mentorship and skill development program.
All people writing in this Forum are against doping, well aware the continuous cases of doping are a big problem for the clean athletes. There are members with scientific knowledge, and members totally ignorant about training, physiology and medicine, who ask WHY many athletes look at doping, and at legal supplements, which are considered the first step for building a mentality that is at the base of the belief in doping.
I started to coach Kenyan athletes in Italy from 1990. I went Kenya for the first time as IAAF lecturer in 1998. I can assure that, till 2012, never I heard some athlete asking for legal supplements or doping, and myself had athletes WR holders and the level of my activity was at the top, so my athletes never had suspicions about other athletes.
Everything started to change in 2012. I can blame some European manager and some Western coach (not only European) for introducing the idea of LEGAL SUPPLEMENTS in Kenya, not for introducing doping. The change of mentality was clearly managed by local doctors and chemists, who started to offer illegal substances asking the same percentage (15%) of the managers for every prize athletes could win.
In this process, the most part of athletes falling into the net were of low/medium level, normally looking at domestic competition only, because in Kenya there was a big increase of the number of road races with good money. Some of them, after winning local races without any manager, found a small contract with European or American managements, and started to run abroad in competitions of second level (mainly in South America and Asia), without any antidoping control. For that reason, there was a period of about 5 years (from 2012 till 2017) where many winners of good prizes around the World were doped, but they were caught only when the small road races too started to have the antidoping.
I think that the effects of doping on the performances is clearly overevaluated. This evaluation is the first stimulus for starting to dope when athletes (who were able to achieve good results clean) become old, or are coming from some injury, thinking possible to build again using doping the same general strength they had when young or before the injury.
The attempt to cut the time for rebuilding her aerobic level in short time was, for example, the reason of the doping of Rita Jeptoo, after a car accident that didn't allow the athlete to train for 3 months. People don't think these athletes were clean when still young or when were able to achieve their best results, because the normal belief is that a doped athlete 30 years old, who ran his best when was 23, started to dope when 18. This is absolutely not true, but I can0't blame who thinks in this way, without personal experience of the Kenyan athletics world.
In these days, there is a very interesting debates in Kenya about this argument. Particularly, there is a free and open forum dedicated to promoting discussions on important topics in sport. health and recreation. It is made up of members from a variety of fields, including sports, media, medicine, academia, health and recreation.
The name of the forum is SPORTS PLUS AGENDA (SPA).
SPA doesn't support or promote any individual agenda, but has the aim to create a grassroots sports mentorship and skill development program.
All people writing in this Forum are against doping, well aware the continuous cases of doping are a big problem for the clean athletes. There are members with scientific knowledge, and members totally ignorant about training, physiology and medicine, who ask WHY many athletes look at doping, and at legal supplements, which are considered the first step for building a mentality that is at the base of the belief in doping.
I started to coach Kenyan athletes in Italy from 1990. I went Kenya for the first time as IAAF lecturer in 1998. I can assure that, till 2012, never I heard some athlete asking for legal supplements or doping, and myself had athletes WR holders and the level of my activity was at the top, so my athletes never had suspicions about other athletes.
Everything started to change in 2012. I can blame some European manager and some Western coach (not only European) for introducing the idea of LEGAL SUPPLEMENTS in Kenya, not for introducing doping. The change of mentality was clearly managed by local doctors and chemists, who started to offer illegal substances asking the same percentage (15%) of the managers for every prize athletes could win.
In this process, the most part of athletes falling into the net were of low/medium level, normally looking at domestic competition only, because in Kenya there was a big increase of the number of road races with good money. Some of them, after winning local races without any manager, found a small contract with European or American managements, and started to run abroad in competitions of second level (mainly in South America and Asia), without any antidoping control. For that reason, there was a period of about 5 years (from 2012 till 2017) where many winners of good prizes around the World were doped, but they were caught only when the small road races too started to have the antidoping.
I think that the effects of doping on the performances is clearly overevaluated. This evaluation is the first stimulus for starting to dope when athletes (who were able to achieve good results clean) become old, or are coming from some injury, thinking possible to build again using doping the same general strength they had when young or before the injury.
The attempt to cut the time for rebuilding her aerobic level in short time was, for example, the reason of the doping of Rita Jeptoo, after a car accident that didn't allow the athlete to train for 3 months. People don't think these athletes were clean when still young or when were able to achieve their best results, because the normal belief is that a doped athlete 30 years old, who ran his best when was 23, started to dope when 18. This is absolutely not true, but I can0't blame who thinks in this way, without personal experience of the Kenyan athletics world.
Taking it a step further your thesis would tend to show that Kenyan junior athletes who are still in high school would be very unlikely to dope. This would indicate that Kenyans and Ethiopians have tremendous talent for distance running based not only on their physical profiles but also on their lifestyle and the culture which promotes distance running.
Football or soccer is by far and away the favorite sport in Kenya but Kenyan sports people, especially the Kalenjin in the Rift Valley, realise that running is a ticket to make a decent life. Pragmatics.
Mr Canova. Can you explain why so many kenyan distance runners of all levels have tested positive and banned for taking performance enhancing drugs if they have no real effect? Also, what do you think is the role of European coached and managers in the proliferation of PEDs in Kenya. Thank you.
Part of the answer to your question is "belief". Many people believe in the potential power of performance enhancing drugs to take athletes to the next level, or for athletes past their peak, to recover their peak, or to reduce the decay -- not only athletes, but managers, coaches, agents, doctors, pharmacists, fans, husbands, friends, etc.
The other part of the answer is that there are so many Kenyan distance runners who perform well. Looking at distance events ranging from 1500m to the marathon, in 2022, Kenyans competing as Kenyans accounted for 27% of athletes with elite performances (in the "alltime athletics" listings). If we theoretically assumed an average prevalence and doping detection rate, we should predict many Kenyans testing positive.
Another part of the answer is that organizations like the AIU spend more of their resources target testing athletes who perform well. Nations with underperforming athletes will be tested less and subsequently underrepresented in positives tests. This actually skews detection rates towards those who perform well, as they are overrepresented overall.
Another part of the answer is lack of awareness, on the part of the athletes, doctors, pharmacists, who prescribe banned substances as standard remedies for real ailments, or who don't fully appreciate the athlete's obligations and constraints, or who don't realize that certain supplements may also contain banned ingredients, either labeled or unlabeled.
Another part of the answer can be accidental ingestion. For example, nandrolone is a common positive test result, and unlike many Western countries, like the USA and Canada, Kenya is not a nation that routinely castrates its pigs.
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