Do the benefits of COVID-19 vaccination outweigh the risks of vaccination for all demographics?
Good. Here’s mine:
Regardless of the probability of Covid vaccination adverse outcomes and the cost of getting a vaccine (no, not the cost you’re thinking of 😉), do you personally believe there is a probability of adverse outcome from Covid that is above zero for an individual where it is acceptable for that individual to forgo full vaccination and boosters?
Meet at high noon in the center of town with your answer. If you don’t show, you’re a yellow-bellied, lily-livered coward.
Does the quoted statement not imply "COVID-19 vaccination outweigh the risks of vaccination" for the demographic as (at least) a lower bound for recommending vaccination?
Do the benefits of COVID-19 vaccination outweigh the risks of vaccination for all demographics?
Good. Here’s mine:
Regardless of the probability of Covid vaccination adverse outcomes and the cost of getting a vaccine (no, not the cost you’re thinking of 😉), do you personally believe there is a probability of adverse outcome from Covid that is above zero for an individual where it is acceptable for that individual to forgo full vaccination and boosters?
Meet at high noon in the center of town with your answer. If you don’t show, you’re a yellow-bellied, lily-livered coward.
1) Sure, it’s always acceptable to decline vaccination. No one is going to show up with guns to force you (in the US). However it’s not smart; I will think (a lot) less of your decision making skills given the risk/cost/benefit for all populations.
2) There are extreme edge cases of highly immunocompromised or very sick people where vaccination has significant cost or zero benefit.
Well, partner, it's a mighty fine thing that most any folk can decide to abstain from gettin' vaccinated, round these parts in the good ol US of A. Ain't no band of sheriff’s men and deputies gonna come a knocking, six-shooters blazin', forcing that sleeve of yours up for the jab. But I do reckon that such decisions aint the smartest choice for a young cowpoke like yourself. I'll reckon I'll think a fair bit less of your decision making skills, especially after a man does consider the risk, cost, and benefit for all groups and manner of folks.
Regardless of the probability of Covid vaccination adverse outcomes and the cost of getting a vaccine (no, not the cost you’re thinking of 😉), do you personally believe there is a probability of adverse outcome from Covid that is above zero for an individual where it is acceptable for that individual to forgo full vaccination and boosters?
Meet at high noon in the center of town with your answer. If you don’t show, you’re a yellow-bellied, lily-livered coward.
Does the quoted statement not imply "COVID-19 vaccination outweigh the risks of vaccination" for the demographic as (at least) a lower bound for recommending vaccination?
Not following the “vaccination outweigh the risks of vaccination.”
In this hypothetical the cost of vaccination is assumed to be zero which includes zero adverse outcomes from vaccination.
Regardless of the probability of Covid vaccination adverse outcomes and the cost of getting a vaccine (no, not the cost you’re thinking of 😉), do you personally believe there is a probability of adverse outcome from Covid that is above zero for an individual where it is acceptable for that individual to forgo full vaccination and boosters?
Meet at high noon in the center of town with your answer. If you don’t show, you’re a yellow-bellied, lily-livered coward.
1) Sure, it’s always acceptable to decline vaccination. No one is going to show up with guns to force you (in the US). However it’s not smart; I will think (a lot) less of your decision making skills given the risk/cost/benefit for all populations.
2) There are extreme edge cases of highly immunocompromised or very sick people where vaccination has significant cost or zero benefit.
You sure know how to not be able to answer a question. 🤦♂️
1) Sure, it’s always acceptable to decline vaccination. No one is going to show up with guns to force you (in the US). However it’s not smart; I will think (a lot) less of your decision making skills given the risk/cost/benefit for all populations.
2) There are extreme edge cases of highly immunocompromised or very sick people where vaccination has significant cost or zero benefit.
You sure know how to not be able to answer a question. 🤦♂️
Then please demonstrate how to do it. Answer his question, and then your question with a level of detail equal to or greater than the detail that was provided in the answer to yours.
To date you have provided no answers and no data. I feel slightly foolish for wasting the time to post this.
You sure know how to not be able to answer a question. 🤦♂️
Then please demonstrate how to do it. Answer his question, and then your question with a level of detail equal to or greater than the detail that was provided in the answer to yours.
To date you have provided no answers and no data. I feel slightly foolish for wasting the time to post this.
1) Who the fvck are you?
2) He had a question? I’ll have to check that out.
Do the benefits of COVID-19 vaccination outweigh the risks of vaccination for all demographics?
Oh here it is.
A: My research (where I got two co-authors btw 😉) was on the infection side, not with the vaccine, so I’m not as much of an expert on the vaccine data. However, from what I do know, I would say ‘yes’ for the vast majority of demos and sub demos. Now in a few groups the difference may be negligible or more aptly, insignificant. But for the vast majority of people, ‘yes.’
See how easy that was to actually answer the question that was asked. I’m not going to bite your head off if you actually answer mine. I asked an opinion question. There is no right or wrong answer.
Do the benefits of COVID-19 vaccination outweigh the risks of vaccination for all demographics?
Oh here it is.
A: My research (where I got two co-authors btw 😉) was on the infection side, not with the vaccine, so I’m not as much of an expert on the vaccine data. However, from what I do know, I would say ‘yes’ for the vast majority of demos and sub demos. Now in a few groups the difference may be negligible or more aptly, insignificant. But for the vast majority of people, ‘yes.’
See how easy that was to actually answer the question that was asked. I’m not going to bite your head off if you actually answer mine. I asked an opinion question. There is no right or wrong answer.
Your question was
Regardless of the probability of Covid vaccination adverse outcomes and the cost of getting a vaccine (no, not the cost you’re thinking of 😉), do you personally believe there is a probability of adverse outcome from Covid that is above zero for an individual where it is acceptable for that individual to forgo full vaccination and boosters?
It just relies on too many assumptions to answer in a single word.
But under the assumptions that
a) you KNOW the risks for you personally are extremely low
b) vaccination confers no benefit to others
then yes, it’s acceptable/reasonable, to skip vaccination. It’s no different than no mitigating other small risks, there’s no uncertainty or non-linearity.
However I assert that knowing a) and b) to sufficient accuracy are too hard in the current situation and so… can’t say it’s acceptable/reasonable. (I think you meant reasonable anyway).
A: My research (where I got two co-authors btw 😉) was on the infection side, not with the vaccine, so I’m not as much of an expert on the vaccine data. However, from what I do know, I would say ‘yes’ for the vast majority of demos and sub demos. Now in a few groups the difference may be negligible or more aptly, insignificant. But for the vast majority of people, ‘yes.’
See how easy that was to actually answer the question that was asked. I’m not going to bite your head off if you actually answer mine. I asked an opinion question. There is no right or wrong answer.
Your question was
Regardless of the probability of Covid vaccination adverse outcomes and the cost of getting a vaccine (no, not the cost you’re thinking of 😉), do you personally believe there is a probability of adverse outcome from Covid that is above zero for an individual where it is acceptable for that individual to forgo full vaccination and boosters?
It just relies on too many assumptions to answer in a single word.
But under the assumptions that
a) you KNOW the risks for you personally are extremely low
b) vaccination confers no benefit to others
then yes, it’s acceptable/reasonable, to skip vaccination. It’s no different than no mitigating other small risks, there’s no uncertainty or non-linearity.
However I assert that knowing a) and b) to sufficient accuracy are too hard in the current situation and so… can’t say it’s acceptable/reasonable. (I think you meant reasonable anyway).
What would be the highest probability of adverse outcome from Covid to make vaccination irrelevant to you? 10%? 5%? 1%?
Again, vaccination has zero cost in this scenario.
Regardless of the probability of Covid vaccination adverse outcomes and the cost of getting a vaccine (no, not the cost you’re thinking of 😉), do you personally believe there is a probability of adverse outcome from Covid that is above zero for an individual where it is acceptable for that individual to forgo full vaccination and boosters?
It just relies on too many assumptions to answer in a single word.
But under the assumptions that
a) you KNOW the risks for you personally are extremely low
b) vaccination confers no benefit to others
then yes, it’s acceptable/reasonable, to skip vaccination. It’s no different than no mitigating other small risks, there’s no uncertainty or non-linearity.
However I assert that knowing a) and b) to sufficient accuracy are too hard in the current situation and so… can’t say it’s acceptable/reasonable. (I think you meant reasonable anyway).
What would be the highest probability of adverse outcome from Covid to make vaccination irrelevant to you? 10%? 5%? 1%?
Again, vaccination has zero cost in this scenario.
I dont know. I don't think humans can generally make rational decisions under such isolated contexts, we notoriously underestimate the likelihood of rare events - and all real decisions have costs and external impacts. For me? Maybe 1/100,000,000?
But, If the vaccine is truly "zero cost" (i.e. no time/money/pain cost) then I guess anything > 0 I would just get vaxxed.
Again... it's hard to operate in mental fairytale land.
What would be the highest probability of adverse outcome from Covid to make vaccination irrelevant to you? 10%? 5%? 1%?
Again, vaccination has zero cost in this scenario.
Me: Male, age 60 when the vaccines became available in December 2020.
I was at an age where my risk was about the same as the overall risk to the public: 0.6% Infection fatality rate, or about 5 times greater than the typical seasonal flu. (Source: Amesh Adalja, Johns Hopkins, Sept. 2020)
Risk of an adverse outcome from a vaccine: Unknown. mRNA was an entirely new chemical and biological formulation being used for the first time in a mass vaccination campaign.
My decision to remain unvaccinated turned out to be the correct decision.
What would be the highest probability of adverse outcome from Covid to make vaccination irrelevant to you? 10%? 5%? 1%?
Again, vaccination has zero cost in this scenario.
Me: Male, age 60 when the vaccines became available in December 2020.
I was at an age where my risk was about the same as the overall risk to the public: 0.6% Infection fatality rate, or about 5 times greater than the typical seasonal flu. (Source: Amesh Adalja, Johns Hopkins, Sept. 2020)
Risk of an adverse outcome from a vaccine: Unknown. mRNA was an entirely new chemical and biological formulation being used for the first time in a mass vaccination campaign.
My decision to remain unvaccinated turned out to be the correct decision.
Death isnt the only undesirable outcome. The vaccine protects against brain damage that can occur even in subclinical COVID cases…. Sadly it seems you are a victim.
Me: Male, age 60 when the vaccines became available in December 2020.
I was at an age where my risk was about the same as the overall risk to the public: 0.6% Infection fatality rate, or about 5 times greater than the typical seasonal flu. (Source: Amesh Adalja, Johns Hopkins, Sept. 2020)
Risk of an adverse outcome from a vaccine: Unknown. mRNA was an entirely new chemical and biological formulation being used for the first time in a mass vaccination campaign.
My decision to remain unvaccinated turned out to be the correct decision.
Death isnt the only undesirable outcome. The vaccine protects against brain damage that can occur even in subclinical COVID cases…. Sadly it seems you are a victim.
Just getting sick is a negative outcome. I think that in most cases it is inadvisable to train through the infection so that will set you back, and when I got sick right before a planned, return home, I delayed my flight back to reduce my chance of infecting everyone around me. That was decidedly undesirable.
This post was edited 2 minutes after it was posted.
Imagine seething and coping for 3 years straight that young, healthy individuals with natural immunity don't want to get a shot for a virus with a 99% survival rate.
Death isnt the only undesirable outcome. The vaccine protects against brain damage that can occur even in subclinical COVID cases…. Sadly it seems you are a victim.
Just getting sick is a negative outcome. I think that in most cases it is inadvisable to train through the infection so that will set you back, and when I got sick right before a planned, return home, I delayed my flight back to reduce my chance of infecting everyone around me. That was decidedly undesirable.
Yeah I agree. It’s amazing that minimizing illness is not seen as an acceptable outcome by many. It’s a huge benefit!
You seem to be unable to understand that dividing two small numbers can result in a large number.
this is called a “ratio” and I guess they don’t teach it in marketing classes
I love how you keep calling me the “marketing guy” like that’s some kind of insult.
I’ll admit I went into it as a data nerd, but there was something fulfilling about working on the data analysis, developing a plan based on that analysis and then implementing that plan in the real world.
You are 16. You did not do jack that affected the real world, regardless of what your supervisors might have told you.
Imagine seething and coping for 3 years straight that young, healthy individuals with natural immunity don't want to get a shot for a virus with a 99% survival rate.
Nobody is coping and seething. We are just rightly calling the people who can’t do simple math dumb.
The antivaxxers get their feelings hurt and whine.
Imagine seething and coping for 3 years straight that young, healthy individuals with natural immunity don't want to get a shot for a virus with a 99% survival rate.
Nobody is coping and seething. We are just rightly calling the people who can’t do simple math dumb.
The antivaxxers get their feelings hurt and whine.
It’s my constitutional right for my intellectually empty statements to be taken seriously!
What would be the highest probability of adverse outcome from Covid to make vaccination irrelevant to you? 10%? 5%? 1%?
Again, vaccination has zero cost in this scenario.
I dont know. I don't think humans can generally make rational decisions under such isolated contexts, we notoriously underestimate the likelihood of rare events - and all real decisions have costs and external impacts. For me? Maybe 1/100,000,000?
But, If the vaccine is truly "zero cost" (i.e. no time/money/pain cost) then I guess anything > 0 I would just get vaxxed.
Again... it's hard to operate in mental fairytale land.
Wow! 1/100,000,000? That would be like everyone in the world getting Covid and 80 people having adverse outcomes. People do overestimate small probabilities as well. For example, probability of adverse outcome from vaccination.
1 in 100,000,000. Are you this cautious in all aspects of your life? You must have really been freaking out when Covid spread prior to the vaccine.
What about when we had Ebola or monkey pox cases reported? Did you have the same mindset?