Kenster5000 wrote:
In addition to the WR and having 3 of the fastest 4 times on the planet, Radcliffe has gold medals in the 5000M, 10000M, the half-marathon and XC. She's a beast.
What golds does Paula have in 5000M and 10000M? Sorry, European Championships don't count.
Gggggfgb wrote:
Scorpion_runner wrote:
that's just laughable!
she was out there race walking for the fist half of the race. man, once they reached the half marathon point....I knew it was over.
This was a training run for her...
13.1 mile jog warmup than 13.1 mile tempo
She could probably race again next weekend if she had to. The lead pack should have gone out in at least 70-72 minutes. It’s like they didn’t even want to try and race her.
Agreed, this was nothing more than a workout for Keitany. Her fitness must be top notch right and this effort perhaps was not too taxing. If I were her, I would think about a quick turnaround and taking a shot at the world record in Dubai or Tokyo rather than waiting until London.
Scorpion_runner wrote:
Won by 4 freaking mins! and ran a NY PR.
Talk about a a beat down. NO one can hang with this woman.
She would probably be undefeated had she run all of her races, where she blazes in the second half of the race, instead of chasing WRs.
Shame on the field for not testing her and pushing the pace....to let a 2:17 runner chill for the first half of the race is just insane.
Beast Mode!
Yes, it makes perfect sense to set the pace for someone faster than you are.
It doesn’t really matter how the race unfolds... the most physically fit individual wins the race the vast majority of the time. Look at El G on the track all the way to Kipchoge in the marathon. All strategies were used against these guys and they still win because they are the most fit.
Tt46 wrote:
Even more mind boggling is Radcliffe doing a 67:23 after a 68:02 half.
Tow different things. One had male pacers, the other was a solo effort.
Really people wrote:
It doesn’t really matter how the race unfolds... the most physically fit individual wins the race the vast majority of the time. Look at El G on the track all the way to Kipchoge in the marathon. All strategies were used against these guys and they still win because they are the most fit.
How did that play out for El G and Bekele in the WC 5000 m 2003? Certainly one of them was the most physically fit (or chemically fit) in that race but they both got beat. The fittest guy will still have the best chances in most strategies, but underdogs can at least improve their chances of winning by running a certain way.
Scorpion_runner wrote:
Shame on the field for not testing her and pushing the pace....to let a 2:17 runner chill for the first half of the race is just insane.
Yes, clearly they should have tried to run away from a 2:17 runner instead.
george oscar bluth wrote:
Scorpion_runner wrote:
Shame on the field for not testing her and pushing the pace....to let a 2:17 runner chill for the first half of the race is just insane.
Yes, clearly they should have tried to run away from a 2:17 runner instead.
It wasn't about running away. It was about making the race faster than what it was in the first half. That was a jog. Mary is a 64 min half marathoner. It was just a terrible tactics all the around.
Molly is still inexperienced, but Shalane, Viv and the others should have been pushing around 1:10. The first half of the race was run in 1:15! Women usually keep the race honest, and the race last year was more honest than this years.
They raced the way men usually race.....very unusual to see that from the women. The men raced a more honest race this year, where the top runners pushed it out, and the race was close at the end between them.
No way am I going to sit back and let a 64 min half marathoner/ 2;17 marathoner just jog for one half of the race......just saying.
The year after Radcliffe ran 2:15:25, she ran 2:23:10 at NYC. Her best time is a 2:23:09 set a year or two after her first NYC win.
Keitany just ran faster than both of those times with an almost 9 minute negative split. She was easily in shape to go sub 2:20 on this course, if not even sub 2:19.
I still think Mary has a shot at the outright record for the marathon, although I don't think she has anymore than a year or so to do it.
Oh Please wrote:
The year after Radcliffe ran 2:15:25, she ran 2:23:10 at NYC. Her best time is a 2:23:09 set a year or two after her first NYC win.
Keitany just ran faster than both of those times with an almost 9 minute negative split. She was easily in shape to go sub 2:20 on this course, if not even sub 2:19.
I still think Mary has a shot at the outright record for the marathon, although I don't think she has anymore than a year or so to do it.
I don't know. She is unstoppable and unbeatable when she does not go out at WR pace, because no one in the field can hang with her. She is prone to blowing up when she goes out at an insane pace, and when that happens, the other women just sit back, because they know she will come back to them.
She currently has 2 world records( 30k, marathon), and broke the WR at the half. No need to put extra wear and tear on the body. With the way that she ran New York, she can continue to destroy all runners for the next 2 years.
The fact that she is a 64 min half marathoner, is a crazy weapon to have. She can run 2:18 in her sleep.
Pacer or no pacer - I just can’t see Mary managing to hold 67:42 pace twice during a marathon.
Don’t get me wrong, yesterday was completely awesome to watch, but that insane second half - only 44s quicker than Radcliffe’s average, remember - was only possible thanks to the ultra slow start.
Was she wearing the Adizero Adios?
Scorpion_runner wrote:
george oscar bluth wrote:
Yes, clearly they should have tried to run away from a 2:17 runner instead.
It wasn't about running away. It was about making the race faster than what it was in the first half. That was a jog. Mary is a 64 min half marathoner. It was just a terrible tactics all the around.
Molly is still inexperienced, but Shalane, Viv and the others should have been pushing around 1:10. The first half of the race was run in 1:15! Women usually keep the race honest, and the race last year was more honest than this years.
They raced the way men usually race.....very unusual to see that from the women. The men raced a more honest race this year, where the top runners pushed it out, and the race was close at the end between them.
No way am I going to sit back and let a 64 min half marathoner/ 2;17 marathoner just jog for one half of the race......just saying.
Thinking that Shalane should have pushed to make the pace honest is downright silly. Source: 2014 Boston marathon and 2017 New York marathon.
Tt46 wrote:
Pacer or no pacer - I just can’t see Mary managing to hold 67:42 pace twice during a marathon.
Don’t get me wrong, yesterday was completely awesome to watch, but that insane second half - only 44s quicker than Radcliffe’s average, remember - was only possible thanks to the ultra slow start.
...
Forget the fact that New York is a much tougher course, especially the 2nd half. The perfect reason she could definitely improve on her 2:17:01 pb/wr and definitely scare Paula's WR if she failed in a perfect race (which may not ever happen for her: WAY too fast first half then next marathon weather too warm,) Mary simply havent gotten the perfect race like Paula's
george oscar bluth wrote:
Scorpion_runner wrote:
It wasn't about running away. It was about making the race faster than what it was in the first half. That was a jog. Mary is a 64 min half marathoner. It was just a terrible tactics all the around.
Molly is still inexperienced, but Shalane, Viv and the others should have been pushing around 1:10. The first half of the race was run in 1:15! Women usually keep the race honest, and the race last year was more honest than this years.
They raced the way men usually race.....very unusual to see that from the women. The men raced a more honest race this year, where the top runners pushed it out, and the race was close at the end between them.
No way am I going to sit back and let a 64 min half marathoner/ 2;17 marathoner just jog for one half of the race......just saying.
Thinking that Shalane should have pushed to make the pace honest is downright silly. Source: 2014 Boston marathon and 2017 New York marathon.
Yeah, just like getting blown out by 4 mins after going ultra slow for the first half of the race. Just letting a speed demon warm up to blow you out. ...Trying to Even split would have been a better choice in my clearly.
A 1:15 half just makes no sense whatsoever....
Scorpion_runner wrote:
george oscar bluth wrote:
Thinking that Shalane should have pushed to make the pace honest is downright silly. Source: 2014 Boston marathon and 2017 New York marathon.
Yeah, just like getting blown out by 4 mins after going ultra slow for the first half of the race. Just letting a speed demon warm up to blow you out. ...Trying to Even split would have been a better choice in my clearly.
A 1:15 half just makes no sense whatsoever....
She got blown out by 4 minutes because Keitany was that much better on Sunday. The slow first half worked last year. The pushing the pace strategy resulted in Flanagan getting something like 7th in Boston 2014.
Scorpion_runner wrote:
Won by 4 freaking mins! and ran a NY PR.
Talk about a a beat down. NO one can hang with this woman.
She would probably be undefeated had she run all of her races, where she blazes in the second half of the race, instead of chasing WRs.
Shame on the field for not testing her and pushing the pace....to let a 2:17 runner chill for the first half of the race is just insane.
Beast Mode!
Yeah this race reminded me strongly of the 10000m women’s race at the London worlds. - Dawdling to halfway and then getting annihilated by a devastating front runner.
Good tactics by Keitany as nobody wanted to push ahead of her. We tend to look at Keitany as a one trick pony - always pushing hard for the world record and therefore possible fodder for the chasing pack in the latter stages if the wheels fall off.
If Cheruiyot hadn’t had a hamstring issue I’m sure she would have made it a closer battle. But facts are that at halfway it was already a done deal.
Scorpion_runner wrote:
xc# wrote:
Which runner in the field was fast enough to test her without blowing their own race?
Vivian has the chops, so does Shalane.
Can I have what you're smoking?
george oscar bluth wrote:
Scorpion_runner wrote:
Yeah, just like getting blown out by 4 mins after going ultra slow for the first half of the race. Just letting a speed demon warm up to blow you out. ...Trying to Even split would have been a better choice in my clearly.
A 1:15 half just makes no sense whatsoever....
She got blown out by 4 minutes because Keitany was that much better on Sunday. The slow first half worked last year. The pushing the pace strategy resulted in Flanagan getting something like 7th in Boston 2014.
Agree, if Shalane pushes the pace early she doesn’t make the podium yesterday. In fact with such a slow start I think the field was probably running for 2nd or 3rd.
Didn't Keitany have a female pacer for first part of London? If that is the race I'm thinking about it looked more like it was Mary pushing the pace and dropped the pacer.