Kip Keino and six other senior Kenyan officials charged with corruption

Bad Wigins wrote:

KripKreeno wrote:

the 1968 Olympics. Everyone was tested - drugs were not illegal at the time. ALL of the Jamaicans and Kenyans were on drugs.

Yes they were illegal, since 1928. No, they did not test everyone in 1968, and they only caught one guy, and not for a PED but for being drunk. Anti-doping wasn't even about performance enhancement, it was about image. A lot of people were flipping out about drug-using hippies at the time.

Ryun, like most milers since the late 1930's, probably raced on amphetamines. There is no more effective PED in the world; since their introduction, the mile WR dropped 15 seconds in barely 30 years, after dropping only 6 seconds in the previous 50. In-comp testing eradicated them nearly immediately 50 years ago, and the record has dropped only 8 seconds further.

If amphetamines were legalized, the 1500m wr would soon be 3:22.

Ryun? C'mon Wigins...where did you come up with that?

Are you sure? wrote:

Bad Wigins wrote:

Yes they were illegal, since 1928. No, they did not test everyone in 1968, and they only caught one guy, and not for a PED but for being drunk. Anti-doping wasn't even about performance enhancement, it was about image. A lot of people were flipping out about drug-using hippies at the time.

Ryun, like most milers since the late 1930's, probably raced on amphetamines. There is no more effective PED in the world; since their introduction, the mile WR dropped 15 seconds in barely 30 years, after dropping only 6 seconds in the previous 50. In-comp testing eradicated them nearly immediately 50 years ago, and the record has dropped only 8 seconds further.

If amphetamines were legalized, the 1500m wr would soon be 3:22.

Huh?...3;22? Are you sure amphetamines are that performance enhancing? On the flip side with side-effects they carry a significant cardiovascular risk....definitely poison to the heart!

+1 Bad Wiggins is very knowledgeable about the history of doping, but I'm still waiting for him to explain why nearly all the top 60's runners (save for the Soviet Bloc athletes) are now in their eighties, alive, and mostly in good health.

Here's the full race from '68. If Ryun was in the shape to go with Keino, he's entirely to blame for letting him out of his reach. But something tells me Kip wouldn't have lost to anyone that day no matter what.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q_9AAy7yZTc

Coevett wrote:

Keino (and the other top Kenyans - including Rudisha's father) were having dreadful seasons in 68 after ousting the Dutch doctor who had singlehandedly turned Kenya into a distance running powerhouse. There had apparently been a clash of egos with Kip accusing the Dutch guy of colonialism and taking all the credit. Nevertheless, just before Mexico peace was restored and Dutchie got his job back. The rest is history.

I posted this in another thread several months back - it's a Sports Illustrated article published in 1968 a few weeks before the Olympics. Very interesting.

Charlie Francis was the one pushing the case from 1968. The truth was that Mexico was the Saudi Arabia of steriods in 1968 (and still is). I would suggest that Mexico City was where steriods were used in events longer than 100m for the first time. Who was using them? Not sure.

I was only interested on the independent source to back up the claim because I haven't seen it stated elsewhere and not anyone even quoting it from Francis's book. There must've been more people aware of the retesting if such and incident took place.

One Finnish sports doctor wrote already in 1972 that it was almost a consensus view that every shot put/discus etc. finalist of the 1960 Rome Olympics was already on steroids, so the situation was worse in 1968 if anything.

But I am not interested in assessments but in the source, because it is interesting, if true.

Here's an interesting read, most of it you will have already seen.

https://thinksteroids.com/articles/history-anabolic-steroids-sports/

Some on 1968. If I recall correctly the Soviets started pumping it into their athletes at the 1956 Olympics.

Kenyan officials have a long history of corruption and stealing money from athletes or wherever it may come into their coffers. They feel they have a right to it. If you have ever worked with the federation you would know this.

Little is done internally because its so deep across the organization. Everybody wants a cut of the money.

The whole lot needs to fired and rebuild from scratch.

Wow, so Saint Keino oversaw Kenyan running during it's dirtiest chapters. El Moranio is on suicide watch!

Bad Wigins wrote:

KripKreeno wrote:

the 1968 Olympics. Everyone was tested - drugs were not illegal at the time. ALL of the Jamaicans and Kenyans were on drugs.

Yes they were illegal, since 1928. No, they did not test everyone in 1968, and they only caught one guy, and not for a PED but for being drunk. Anti-doping wasn't even about performance enhancement, it was about image. A lot of people were flipping out about drug-using hippies at the time.

Ryun, like most milers since the late 1930's, probably raced on amphetamines. There is no more effective PED in the world; since their introduction, the mile WR dropped 15 seconds in barely 30 years, after dropping only 6 seconds in the previous 50. In-comp testing eradicated them nearly immediately 50 years ago, and the record has dropped only 8 seconds further.

If amphetamines were legalized, the 1500m wr would soon be 3:22.

Where do you get your "information??" Certainly no facts are available to even suggest Ryun was on anything. You are a total, useless human being who needs to stop posting.

Aragon wrote:

I was only interested on the independent source to back up the claim because I haven't seen it stated elsewhere and not anyone even quoting it from Francis's book. There must've been more people aware of the retesting if such and incident took place.

One Finnish sports doctor wrote already in 1972 that it was almost a consensus view that every shot put/discus etc. finalist of the 1960 Rome Olympics was already on steroids, so the situation was worse in 1968 if anything.

But I am not interested in assessments but in the source, because it is interesting, if true.

Quite possible, but almost entirely for the throws as runners thought that steroids would make them too big and bulky. It wasn't until 1972 that this point of view changed dramatically and runners saw the benefit of PED's .

There was a lot of talk in 1968 where athletes wanted to justify the move to taking drugs based on the Russians and East Germans were doing it so that was they only way to stay competitive. This thinking became even more prevalent in 1972.

How do I know this? I was there.

correct, new boss same as the old boss, there is no hope for reform of these 100% cancer cell units. = ioc = wada = ustaf = etc. there is hope if you shut them down and let the coaches and athletes run things...

So did Ryun forget his meth in Mexico city?

My #1 candidate for methamphetamine use was Rudolph Harbig. Amphetamine use/abuse was rampant in Nazi Germany at the time.

Are you sure? wrote:

Bad Wigins wrote:

Yes they were illegal, since 1928. No, they did not test everyone in 1968, and they only caught one guy, and not for a PED but for being drunk. Anti-doping wasn't even about performance enhancement, it was about image. A lot of people were flipping out about drug-using hippies at the time.

Ryun, like most milers since the late 1930's, probably raced on amphetamines. There is no more effective PED in the world; since their introduction, the mile WR dropped 15 seconds in barely 30 years, after dropping only 6 seconds in the previous 50. In-comp testing eradicated them nearly immediately 50 years ago, and the record has dropped only 8 seconds further.

If amphetamines were legalized, the 1500m wr would soon be 3:22.

Huh?...3;22? Are you sure amphetamines are that performance enhancing? On the flip side with side-effects they carry a significant cardiovascular risk....definitely poison to the heart!

amphetamines.... back in the day, babe ruth amped on cocaine, … the way of the fanatic, the way of the addict, is the way of the of the athletics hero, the ego driven be some body, have my legacy and have a statue, and have everybody remember what a great stud and guy I was.... it is what it is... but i't ain't enlightened... perhaps the champions realize that their path was a fun game to play, and get real in the end, humble, ….. still running and competition is a fantastic thing to do,.... but it all gets so weird, when the al salazars of the world chime in ….. in the end it's interesting, this messy world.

Wow!

You have lost your marbles.

I've always suspected that you were insane but I didn't think you were this insane.

Sprintgeezer wrote:

Wrong. My wife is above temptation, absolutely.

She is pure as the driven snow. Sometimes it drives me nuts.

I meant to state that my nuts are pure. They have not been touched by my wife in years.

He was a Kenyan cop, "nuff said. They push prostitutes and shake down girls from good families who are just trying to be young. Everything they do is backwards, if it can make money.

You may remember that they Banned the South Africans from sport due to apartheid. It lasted from 1964 to 1988 with regard to the Olympics.

Didn't impact the corruption one bit

No marbles to lose.