HS Distance kings.
HS Distance kings.
#197 is a true champion!
Anybody who knows me knows I'm nuts ... but not in a way which would be detrimental to my judgment on how much to run. Re-read the first sentence of my previous post: "Running high weeks for months on end isn't the best strategy for teenagers." When I say that a HS guy can do 120 miles in a week, that means ONE week. For the record, the highest week I've ever had a HS runner do during a preseason was 111 miles. That was done by a guy who went on to have a breakthrough season (went from a modest 16:28 X-C 5,000 PR to 15:39 and 11th in FL Region) in which he AVERAGED just UNDER 60 MILES PER WEEK. Only one other time in HS did he run over 100 (103). Did he "burn out"? Well, he went on to be the number one runner on his Div. I college team by his Sr. year (a team which won its conference title), and he made it to NCAAs as an individual that year (the rest of the team blew it at District). And he only felt cashed when he was doing lots of hard track training, not when he was running higher mileage. So you tell me if he burned out. You can see how he was EXPOSED to high mileage WITHOUT actually BEING a year-round "high mileage runner" in HS. I've only had three other HS runners who have hit 100 miles in a week and they were prepared to do it, having made a gradual climb through the years. As with the guy in the previous example, they didn't STAY at high mileage very long once the regular seasons started, actually dropping to average weekly totals in the 60 range.
So, again, it's DABBLING in high mileage which prepares HS runners for more prolonged future excursions into SERIOUS training. The lion's share of the training should be MODERATE mileage at that age. Certainly if a guy runs over 100 per week all the time in HS, he's liable to paint himself into a corner as far as having anywhere to go with his future mileage (all that would be left is higher intensity, which WOULD probably lead to burnout). Among elite Americans, Rudy Chapa is the only guy I can think of who ran high mileage (up to 130) all the time in HS. It didn't seem to hurt him for later, but I think his training was more continuous threshold running. Other guys like Eric Hulst and Jeff Nelson might have run high too often and had nothing left to do but to start hammering their workouts harder than before, which left them at the same (or worse) performance levels they saw in HS (and Nelson might have had a great future if he hadn't raced his teammates in training as a Freshman at Oregon).
For most HS runners 50MPW would be considered 'high mileage' ... Hell 50 miles per summer would be more than what 75% of what HS kids do. I have seen more kids running in the last week than I did the ENTIRE summer. 2 weeks ago I overheard ... "well, I've only got 2 weeks to get in shape for cross" ... pathetic. To make matters worse, I live on the fringe of Boulder, the supposed distance running mecca of the US.
Wow! The only time on the list in the 2 mile from the mid-1990s was Meb in 8:54. He has definitely developed well, but this list is incredible evidence for the weakness of mid-1990s distance running.
During my prep days, it was rare to have more than one guy under 9:00/4:08 each year; now it is the norm again. It's all about the mileage and the Internet. In the early 1990s, we were still in the dark ages (only place you could get results was track and field news AFTER THE SEASON), but I remember how the performances of Sanchez, Powell, etc. burned out across the old e-mail lists and got everyone fired up, college kids included!
FACTORS FOR RISE AND FALL
the rise of track had a correlation to the USA vs Soviet meet. heck gerry lindgren ran in it -
the fall
carter boycots the olympics! -- stupid @ss
the soviets boycott the olympics in return
drug testing, sport looks bad
the small rise lately
-- the internet -- the information is wonderful, learn how to train, learn what others are doing and see your running in persceptive. heck a 4:25 miler in the 80's thought he was the shit, now u go online bragging rights are for the sub 4:10's at least.
I agree with the mileage bit as I averaged between 25-30 miles/week in high school. I went to college and tried to walk on. The first thing that the coaches did was raise my mileage to 60 miles/week. After about a month, my 10K PR went down by 3 minutes. Over the course of the year, I raised the mileage to 70. As long as I was above 70/week, I ran well. Once I let my mileage go down, my times have suffered.
However, I think another reason needs to be addressed, and that's the big influx of soccer. Not too long ago, it was said that our best distance runners were wearing umbros and kicking soccer balls. We're starting to see these kids come back to track, and they're bringing a high aerobic base with them from club soccer. I watch my 13-year-old, and I notice that he's getting 5+ hours of fartlek each week from playing soccer. If he's in a tournament, he'll get 5-6 hours of running just on the weekend. Add in a couple of 2 hour practices, and he's closing in on 10-hour weeks. With all the fartlek runs, I had him just running easy during track practice. I felt that intervals on the track might be too much stress on his legs.
Several of the top finishers in high school track and XC this past season were club soccer players.
I definitely agree with the mileage (or time on feet) being a factor in this resurgence. It may also be a question of how they're putting that time in.
Why are people scared of high mileage in high school? When done correctly, as in JK's schedule example, good things do happen!
Does anyone see a contradiction between two of the biggest complaints about American running: 1)We (as a country) do not have nearly the depth of skilled distance runners that we used to and 2)We have to be careful with our precious high schoolers.. they need to be wrapped in bubble wrap each day before they go out on there 30mpw runs.
Its ok to increase mileage and run 70-100 miles in high school. Sure its not for everyone, but running high mileage during a base period doesn't automatically equal a burned out runner with multiple stress fractures and messed up joints.
Other sports push the envelope a bit, look at high school football etc, so why can't cross country/track. High school sports are a learning experience, but they are also an imprtant part of cultivating athletic skill in this country.
Most people in this thread seem to see a relation between training methods and race times in our country's running history. Higher mileage in high school under the proper coaching will benefit runners (and our country's distance prowess) not only in high school, but down the road in college and beyond.
Actually, it's 3200 meters, not 2 miles. 3200 is about 9 meters short of 2 miles.
Try 18 meters.
Quaker wrote:
Try 18 meters.
D'oh! You're right. 9 meters is the difference between 1600 and one mile. 18 meters is diff. between 3200 and two miles. Thanks for catching that!
Don't mention it :)
are you the guy on the quaker oats box?
are you that fat Texan no-nothing who has his tongue firmly stuck up Oprah's fat tushy?
I guess so!
I blows de oats from mah big fat ass all overs Dr. Phil and Quaker, and they be lappin' it up after they runs in the park.
Oprah wrote:
I blows de oats from mah big fat ass all overs Dr. Phil and Quaker, and they be lappin' it up after they runs in the park.
You pupacious pundit of putrified puke!
See, da man's likes me! Next time he come over fo' goodies, he can crawl bitweenz mah legs and get hisself a mud pie!
3 York runners on that list, 2 in the top 35 and the other Marius Bakken. Didn't Jim White also go sub 9? I have a faulty memory on this, can anyone help?
Newton must be doing something right. Other top school- Mead, of course.
Interestingly, Sage and Ritz ran their record times on exactly the same day, I believe. We came home from Sage running 8.42 to find that Dathan had gone 8.41 for 3200. "Course, Sage also ran 4.08 that day. And Tim Keller had run sub-9 something like 7 times that season.
i ran 9:15 in 98, i was proud of myself. i wanted to run 8:50, but it didn't work out. sob sob, its reality.