Struggling at Half Marathons...why?

TMC92 wrote:

typically running 50 to 60 miles a week. .

Here's why, run more.

Hi!

It`s easy to see what the probem is. It can be summarized in three words: Wrong individual paces!

Your normal easy pace is too fast. And the intervals are also too fast up to your present individual capacity.

Sand Dunes wrote:

TMC92 wrote:

typically running 50 to 60 miles a week. .

Here's why, run more.

Mileage is not the issue. 50-60 is plenty and I know guys running 40mpw running much better 13.1's than the OP. This guy is not doing the bread-and-butter distance workouts needed to run under 90 minutes. Sounds like he's 800m guy trying to run long distances and hitting the wall because he can't control his pace, or for that matter, even know what it should be.

Stick with the mileage just do some longer tempos around 7-flat. Also, if you are running a Marathon, make sure to get a few 22 mile long runs.

I'd aim for a 3:25 time in that marathon. That's a 7:50 pace which you can comfortably handle and if you have anything left in the tank after mile 23, just hammer the rest of the miles. 7:35 is too aggressive and you will hit the wall at mile 22.

Yes, you can run sub 1:30 based on speed...what did you eat/drink during the race? I know some can get away with nothing or water only...but I for sure need a boost, one or two gels preferably with caffeine work well for me. Make sure you are running the easy days easy...no mention of that either. You need to have recovery miles between hard efforts. Chicago is a long ways away, it's super flat and if the weather is cool, you can reach your goal.

TMC92 wrote:

- I have done long runs of 17, 18, and 19 miles. All of them have been around a comfortable 7:35 pace.

- I recently did 8x1000 at 6:00 pace with 1 minute standing rests.

- I also recently did 5x5 minutes at 6:06 pace with 1 minute standing rests.

- I've done 4x1000 at 5:32 pace with 2 minute jogs.

You are right to believe you are capable of sub-1:30. I ran a 1:32 in May on an injured hamstring and I can't come close to 8x1000 @ 6:00 flat or 4x1000 @ 5:32. My R pace (for no more than 400m) is around 5:30.

I have a hard time fathoming how you can run 19 miles at 7:35 "comfortably" but struggle to run only 13 miles 20 seconds faster. 20 seconds is not very much in that pace range.

I injured my hamstring because I went full Strava hero mode in the winter and kept pushing 7:30s on easy days and wound up overtraining.

Given your description of 20 seconds off your HM performance as "comfortable" combined with these very tough workouts that are way out of line with your HM performance, I suspect you are just overtrained. You are doing too much intensity at too much volume. I've seen this with runners I know (including myself) so many times. Their training and pre-goal-race tune up races predict an easy 1:30 yet they blow up on race day and can't hold it. Why? Overtraining.

Let’s not discount the possibility that you just had a bad day. It happens. Lots of reasons. Nerves. Some illness your body is fighting off. An injury that your body is stuggling to heal. Mental fatigue. Not enough quality sleep. Ate something bad. Or a thousand other things. Sometimes you just have a bad day. Happened to me in training today - had some really solid runs last week, and today a big crash. It’s fine. It happens.

Your training performances are impressive. I can’t manage those workouts, and I run 1:30 HMs. I’d say that before you scrap your training entirely, find another HM in a couple of weeks and try again. If the last one was just a bad day, you’ll do better. If you don’t, THEN go back to the drawing board.

There’s a lot predictable to running. But bad days still happen.

TMC92 wrote:

Age 39....typically running 50 to 60 miles a week.

Add 20 miles per week and cut back on the intensity of your workouts a bit. The half marathon is a very aerobic event. You will fall apart past 10 miles everytime with this mileage. Stop increasing your long runs so much and increase your other runs more.

All of the training seems way too fast for a 1:30 half runner. Stop racing your workouts

another runner wrote:

TMC92 wrote:

Age 39....typically running 50 to 60 miles a week.

Add 20 miles per week and cut back on the intensity of your workouts a bit. The half marathon is a very aerobic event. You will fall apart past 10 miles everytime with this mileage. Stop increasing your long runs so much and increase your other runs more.

Stop it. The guy is doing enough to run 1:25

Your intervals are too short. I would prefer something like 5-6x mile at 6:35-45 if you like the minute standing rest. Then work that up to 3x 2 miles at the same pace with 2 minutes rest, and finally 2x 5k at same pace with 2-3 minute jog in between (400m).

Reading this thread I feel like we are reliving the 90s. It is obvious that you are not doing enough mileage to reach your goals.

80s guy wrote:

Reading this thread I feel like we are reliving the 90s. It is obvious that you are not doing enough mileage to reach your goals.

No, stop this rubbish on the boards. It`s NOT a matter of more mileage, it`s more HOW the mileage done has been run up to the very best individual paces.

TMC92 wrote:

- I have done long runs of 17, 18, and 19 miles. All of them have been around a comfortable 7:35 pace.

After you've built a base, long slow running has no use for building speed endurance.

You've the base speed but lack the endurance, try to alternate

- Long steady runs, up to 10-13 miles @7:00 mile pace (your race target is about 6:50)

- Fast finish long runs, up to 12-15 miles. Start easy the first half and speed up in the last few miles to close faster than your target pace (6:40 - 6:30 is enough)

18-19 mile longs are overkill for a half at your level and may leave you tired for the rest of the week.

Also, as someone else stated, doing intervals @5:30-6:00 is too hard considering your target is 1 minute slower.

Don't bury yourself in training and you'll be fine.

Sometimes I give my advice for free here with a program to follow. This is one of these times.You are lucky TMC92.. lol

You have to run your present best individual training paces and then your program look like this for a half just sub 1:30 ( 1:28) , also a marathon sub 3:05 ;

mo: 6-8 miles at 8-8:20 mile pace

tu: 20 x 400m at 90-91 sec , recovery= walk easy down to 120 beats/ min or 60 % of MHR.

we: 6-10 miles 8-8:20 mile pace

th: LT-intervals, 6-8 x 1 mile at 6:36 mile pace , recovery = walk easy down to 120 beats/ min or 60% of MHR.

fr: 6-8 miles 8-8:20 mile pace

sa: 15-20 miles at 8-8:20 mile pace , last 10-15 min fast at close to LT-pace 6:36 min per mile pace.

su: RESTDAY

A total of at most: 59 mpw

If you do this kind of training you are guaranteed to succeed with your goals. Good Luck! :)

designed by - The Magic Wizard -

Jimmy21 wrote:

All of the training seems way too fast for a 1:30 half runner. Stop racing your workouts

What Jimmy said, I have run 1:30 twice and technically should be able to run sub 1:30 with consistent training. I run 50-60 miles a week and my easy runs never even sniff close to below 8:20 a mile. I do 20-minute tempo runs and long runs with marathon paced miles included. I do a good bit of track work but my main focus is easy runs so that when its time to do speed work I can throw it down.

OP

Target a flat and fast course in the fall.

1. Pace better

2. Enter races with people near your ability so you aren't alone the whole time

3. More long tempo/progression long run type stuff. Finish the last few miles of long runs at goal half pace

My guess is you're not training for the hills. Include a good degree amount of hills in your training. Include them in your long run and hill repeats during training. Another guess is you're not consuming proper energy foods and liquids during the race.

Anyone saying that 50-60 MPW is not enough to break 1:30 for anybody who has more than exactly zero talent is a moran.

OP - don't listen to them. You are running enough mileage. You need to train at paces though that match your ability, which right now is only 1:35. Don't train for your goal pace, train for your current fitness.

Also, what's your current weight/height? Want to make sure there isn't something going on there.