Why is front running more respected that "sit and wait" running?

One takes balls (front running), the other one takes a Frenchman to do(sit and kick).

Viren and Gammoudi controlled most the pace.

Prefontaine did not know the quality he was actually up against.

Ian Stewart even admitted he ran a poor race to steal bronze.

Sand Dunes wrote:

One takes balls (front running), the other one takes a Frenchman to do(sit and kick).

Who is the Frenchman you're referring to?

Mimoun?

Jazy?

Bosse? He is a front runner isn't he?

Von Hayek wrote:

Sand Dunes wrote:

One takes balls (front running), the other one takes a Frenchman to do(sit and kick).

Who is the Frenchman you're referring to?

Mimoun?

Jazy?

Bosse? He is a front runner isn't he?

French are cowards.

Question: You know what the French battle flag is?

Answer: The white flag.

Sand Dunes wrote:

Von Hayek wrote:

Who is the Frenchman you're referring to?

Mimoun?

Jazy?

Bosse? He is a front runner isn't he?

French are cowards.

Question: You know what the French battle flag is?

Answer: The white flag.

According to historian Niall Ferguson, of the 125 major European wars fought since 1495, the French have fought in 50, more than both Austria (47) and England (43). And they achieved an impressive overall batting average: out of a total of 168 battles fought since 387 bc, they have won 109, lost 49 and drawn 10.

Education is important.

Von Hayek wrote:

How come everyone likes a front runner but a sit and wait runner is "chicken s***" according to Prefontaine?

A lot of people do prefer Filbert Bayi over John Walker for example.

It takes courage to run from the front and to put everything on the line. Do or die!

Von Hayek wrote:

How come everyone likes a front runner but a sit and wait runner is "chicken s***" according to Prefontaine?

Because the mental strength it takes to front run successfully is by far and away in excess of what it takes to run with the pack then go with the mad scramble at the end.

Front running is also more physically depleting than running with others - not only do you have to make the break and establish your own pace, but in addition you have nobody else to key off, nobody to push you, nobody to establish a rhythm with.

Molly Huddle tried to imitate Almaz Ayanas tactics in the heats of the 5000m at the London world champs last year. Ultimately it was a successful tactic as she (just) made the final after being overtaken by the lead chasers with 150m to go. - However she was destroyed by her effort.

Almaz Ayana is the both the gutsiest and most talented elite front runner we will ever see. For this reason alone I believe she has the most likelihood of overcoming Paula`s marathon record.

Von Hayek wrote:

How come everyone likes a front runner but a sit and wait runner is "chicken s***" according to Prefontaine?

The front runner is "doing all the work" the sit an wait guy is sitting on the shoulder of the front runner, saving energy, and then out kicking the front runner. There is no rule saying you can't do it. But, if you are say, 26, and you are sitting on the shoulder of a 40+ runner, and then blow by him before the finish, I don't care how good the 40+ is, that's really, really, a flat-out pu$$y-a$$ed, low-down, chicken $hit. And you will lose respect from your fellow runners.

It feels much like not establishing a password for your WiFi service and having your neighbor use the service You are foolish for it but it feels like he is stealing from you anyway. You are foolish for leading but you still don’t like guys siphoning off you.

Von Hayek wrote:

Cottonshirt wrote:

do you have any evidence that front running is, actually, "more respected," than other tactics? I doubt it. I suspect this is simply your own back-of-an-envelope estimation and it probably represents your own view, and, like most of us, you prefer to think your view is in the majority (see what I did there).

my own view is to repeat something I read right here on LRC a couple of weeks ago. in one of those interminable "let's bash Rupp" threads some level-headed dude, who I would love to be able to quote but I can't remember his name, said that the point of racing is to win. which is both true and all that needs to be said on the subject. now go out and race.

cheers.

Calm down dear.

Yeah, cottonhead is always saying something stupid and thinking its clever

Norpoth sits and kicks on 19-year old Pre in a nothing meet and never improve from there. Meanwhile the front-running Pre improves by leaps and bounds. Two years later, they are in the same heat in 5000m in Munich. Pre wins the heat. Norpoth doesn't advance.

I believe Dellinger/Bowerman's race plan was for Pre to move to the front and start rachetting down the pace with 3-laps to go but the early pace was so slow that Pre went a lap early. That decision probably cost him the race.

"Pre wins the heat."

"Norpoth doesn't advance."

You real sure about both of those statements, bud?

Wrong again, bud. Pre stated that he was going to ratchet it up in the last mile, run it in 4 minutes, and waste everybody.

A mile would have been over 4 laps on that track.

And no fricking way Pre beats Viren that day. Viren ran a controlled, intelligent race and easily disposed of Pre in that final lap.

The point of professional racing is to win, preferably with as little effort as possible. Style doesn't count when medals and checks are distributed.

belial wrote:

Von Hayek wrote:

How come everyone likes a front runner but a sit and wait runner is "chicken s***" according to Prefontaine?

So brave. Asking the bold questions my friend.

So brave, using a username starting with a lower case letter, proper gansta.

Von Hayek wrote:

sky wrote:

Pre didn't front run the majority of that Olympic final in '72. He was in the pack for the first 8.5 laps. He took the lead with 4 full laps to go. Viren moved from the pack to Pre's shoulder with 3 full laps to go. Viren then took the lead with 2 full laps to go and led the majority of the way from there, with the exception of a couple of surges by Pre and a last lap push by Gammoudi.

So if anybody thinks Pre went out in front early and held the lead all the way until being out-kicked at the very last would be mistaken.

Viren and Gammoudi controlled most the pace.

Prefontaine did not know the quality he was actually up against.

Ian Stewart even admitted he ran a poor race to steal bronze.

Pre should get credit in that race for pushing the pace in the last 4 laps and breaking up the pack. But if he was going to use that strategy he should not have relinquished the lead at the bell. That was his undoing, because then he tried to make that stupid move on the backstretch to regain the lead.

But what he should be criticized for is quitting in the last 20 meters to let Stewart steal the bronze. No one ever mentions that.

Ask any racer, any real racer. It doesn't matter if you win by an inch or a mile, winning's winning.

Rx7 wrote:

Ask any racer, any real racer. It doesn't matter if you win by an inch or a mile, winning's winning.

Pre wouldn't agree with that sentiment.