sol, you've been gone for some time. how'd you do at Chicago?
sol, you've been gone for some time. how'd you do at Chicago?
Billy and Frank, like most elite runners-myself included, did have coaches for a part of their running lives. Bill Squires worked with Billy and Frank used the principles he learned from his college coach Bob Giegengack as well as learning froom his Florida Track Club training partner Jack Bachelor. Billy and Frank both returned for advice even when they weren't directly coached by Squires and Giegengack.
I ran most of my best years self coached, but it is hard to say that any elite runner is truely self-made since there are constant influences from others.
Was there a point to the question?
I probably could have better phrased the question: do elite runners get to the point in their careers where a coach isn't of much use anymore? I'll leave it at that.
feetball kicker wrote:
I probably could have better phrased the question: do elite runners get to the point in their careers where a coach isn't of much use anymore? I'll leave it at that.
That is a better question.
A good coach should eventually become an advisor for most of his/her athletes (IMNSHO). Smart elite athletes should understand what they are doing and why. But there are still times when even the smartest athlete needs a second head to consider their "plan" or remind them they need to keep their eyes on the goal and not get distracted by the crap they encounter on the journey.
I had several advisors I turned to, but I took the responsiblity for my own failures.
I read you loud and clear. Thanks.
Roger Bannister never used a coach!
Jim Spivey was coached by Mike Durkin for his elite career, but the interesting thing is that over this whole period of time (which was long and successful) Durkin was only physically present for ONE workout - the rest was all via correspondence/phone. Maybe Jim can tell the story w/ more detail.
rubbish!! Franz Stampf coached Bannister
Correct. I just read "The Perfect Mile". It was very informative about the sport in those days for some athletes. I especially enjoyed the description of what happened in Vancouver. Bannister considered each of his attempts at perfection a failure until he hooked up with Stamfl. He had a lot more support than that too. After Bannister, Chataway and Brasher joined up with Stampfl, they formed a harmonious team that achieved Bannisters goals. Brasher and Chataway then went on to do pretty well too!
I was never an elite by today's standards but I found that guidance and teammates always made it easier even in the many years that I competed after I had a coach.
At the US Olympic Marathon Trials last winter "forty-nine percent of men and 31 percent of women did not have a coach."
I Agree with Benji. I think elite athletes would do better to have an advisor. Performance comes down to talent but it's my guess that the athletes that stayed at the top had someone who steered their training towards the goal. At the very top the little details can make the difference between a medal and 5th. I would at least get an advisor.
Look at the Hansons at the trials.
That is very interesting. The article also said that the marathon had been a weak event in the US during the last few years. Also, I would like to see the same survey with only the top 5 men and women in the trials all taking it.
The marathon is a tough event. The US's two Olympic medal winners had a tremendous support team resulting in their great successes. It certainly helps to have the correct support. In additon, support relieves the athlete of time and worry.
By the way, Roger Bannister also had the support of others around him, especially the McWhirter twins.
I think Rob Gary has been self-coached for the last 4-5 years over a fairly successful career including 2 Olympic teams (1996 and 2004) and great cross country.
I think if you analyzed finish position at the trials against being coached/self-coached then you'd find a very close relationship between finishing well and being coached.
I wonder if many of the self-coached runners would consider a coach if they thought they were "good enough". I wonder if they thought they had a serious shot at a top finish would they engage a coach to help them see what more they can accomplish.
I would really like to know if there is a significant portion of world-class athletes who achieve anything without a coach. Sure, Toby Stevenson is an exception with his videocamera and biomechanics-professor father but there don't seem to be many who, like you say, have a tremendous support team around them.
corrected:
datahead wrote:
I would really like to know if there is a significant portion of world-class athletes who achieve anything without a coach. Sure, Toby Stevenson is an exception with his videocamera and biomechanics-professor father but there don't seem to be many who, like you say, don't have a tremendous support team around them.
So what is the list? Americans Culpepper and Gary? Is that it among distance runners? That's a pretty short list and these two, presumably, are the exception.
I disagree with that statement, their are many USA elite runners besides Webb and that other guy...Give me a break...
Joe Beisner
schul did too have a coach. what are you smoking sol? he was coached by igloi.
Hendrick Ramaala is self-coached, I believe. Just won NYC marathon, and it was reported he's the South African 10k record holder.