Mo Farah is one of the greats

fair points, all.

If you wish, I will take the field against Farah at Pre for $20, sent to the winner's favorite charity.

TAA wrote:

Haile Gebrselassie has "doubled" in both 1995 and 1997 when winning the 10000m world title and setting the 5000m World Record 3/4 days after the 5000m world finale.

Being able to run fast doesn't mean he could have won a championship race. Also another 3-4 days of rest (really more like 5 or 6 if you count the 5k semi) makes a big difference. Geb never got the double in a championship like Farah has.[/quote]

Gebrselassie has won Silver (5000m) and than Gold (10000m) in 1993 in Stuttgart. In 1995 he has improved his level a lot. It's strange to think he would not easily have won against Ismail Kirui and Khalid Boulami. But his aim was to break the World Record at the next possible opportunity (which he did by running the last 5 laps in around 60 seconds each (never done since then at this level - Bekele 2008?) without approaching his limit at all in the last lap).

Yes, Farah has two global 5k/10k doubles, which Gebrselassie doesn't have. And Gebrselassie has a myriad of achievements which Farah doesn't have. Sounds strange to me to mention the one thing Farah has more on his card than Gebrselassie without mentioning all the other points.

said88 wrote:

TAA wrote:

Haile Gebrselassie has "doubled" in both 1995 and 1997 when winning the 10000m world title and setting the 5000m World Record 3/4 days after the 5000m world finale.

Being able to run fast doesn't mean he could have won a championship race. Also another 3-4 days of rest (really more like 5 or 6 if you count the 5k semi) makes a big difference. Geb never got the double in a championship like Farah has.

Gebrselassie has won Silver (5000m) and than Gold (10000m) in 1993 in Stuttgart. In 1995 he has improved his level a lot. It's strange to think he would not easily have won against Ismail Kirui and Khalid Boulami. But his aim was to break the World Record at the next possible opportunity (which he did by running the last 5 laps in around 60 seconds each (never done since then at this level - Bekele 2008?) without approaching his limit at all in the last lap).

Yes, Farah has two global 5k/10k doubles, which Gebrselassie doesn't have. And Gebrselassie has a myriad of achievements which Farah doesn't have. Sounds strange to me to mention the one thing Farah has more on his card than Gebrselassie without mentioning all the other points.[/quote]

I responded to your comment replying to another talking about championship doubles. Everything else is irrelevant. Sounds like we basically agree but came at it from different angles. Have a good day said88.

TAA wrote:

Have a good day said88.

Thanks!

Wtfunny wrote:

but he did double the WC and the OG 5000m, which Geb never even tried.

They had 3 rounds of the 5K and 2 rounds for the 10K back then so that wasn't really feasible, plus the Ethiopian selection committee may not have let him try

There's no comparison:

1500 METRES

RANK MARK WIND PLACE DATE

7th IAAF World Indoor Championships 1 3:33.77 Maebashi (Green Dome) 07 MAR 1999

3000 METRES

RANK MARK WIND PLACE DATE

9th IAAF World Indoor Championships 1 7:40.97 Birmingham (NIA), GBR 16 MAR 2003

7th IAAF World Indoor Championships 1 7:53.57 Maebashi (Green Dome) 05 MAR 1999

IAAF Golden League/Grand Prix Final 1 7:50.00 Moskva 05 SEP 1998

6th IAAF World Indoor Championships 1 7:34.71 Paris-Bercy (Palais Omnisports) 09 MAR 1997

IAAF/Mobil Grand Prix Final 1 7:35.90 Monaco (Stade Louis II) 09 SEP 1995

5000 METRES

RANK MARK WIND PLACE DATE

XXVI Olympic Games h1 DNS Atlanta (Olympic Stadium), GA 31 JUL 1996

5th IAAF World Championships in Athletics h2 DNS Göteborg (Ullevi Stadium) 11 AUG 1995

4th IAAF World Championships in Athletics 2 13:03.17 Stuttgart (Gottlieb-Daimler Stadion) 16 AUG 1993

4th IAAF World Junior Championships 1 13:36.06 Seoul 19 SEP 1992

10,000 METRES

RANK MARK WIND PLACE DATE

The XXIX Olympic Games 6 27:06.68 Beijing (National Stadium) 17 AUG 2008

28th Olympic Games 5 27:27.70 Athína (Olympic Stadium) 20 AUG 2004

9th IAAF World Championships in Athletics 2 26:50.77 Paris Saint-Denis (Stade de France) 24 AUG 2003

8th IAAF World Championships 3 27:54.41 Edmonton (Commonwealth Stadium) 08 AUG 2001

27th Olympic Games 1 27:18.20 Sydney (Olympic Stadium) 25 SEP 2000

7th IAAF World Championships in Athletics 1 27:57.27 Sevilla (La Cartuja) 24 AUG 1999

6th IAAF World Championships In Athletics 1 27:24.58 Athína (Olympic Stadium) 06 AUG 1997

XXVI Olympic Games 1 27:07.34 Atlanta (Olympic Stadium), GA 29 JUL 1996

5th IAAF World Championships in Athletics 1 27:12.95 Göteborg (Ullevi Stadium) 08 AUG 1995

4th IAAF World Championships in Athletics 1 27:46.02 Stuttgart (Gottlieb-Daimler Stadion) 22 AUG 1993

4th IAAF World Junior Championships 1 28:03.99 Seoul 18 SEP 1992

HALF MARATHON

RANK MARK WIND PLACE DATE

10th IAAF World Half Marathon Championships 1 1:00:03 Bristol 07 OCT 2001

Mo's got gold/silver 2011, gold/gold 2012, and gold/gold 2013, and that's it for champs. I count 11 world and olympic titles for Geb, plus a few other medals

He also has pr's of 3:28.81 vs. 3:31i (Geb), 8:03i vs. 7:25/7:26i/8:01 (Geb), 12:53 vs. 12:39 wr, 26:46 vs. 26:22, 59:32(?) vs. ?, 2:08:21 vs. 2:03:59.

hey StarPerhaps that wasn't lear, my mistake .. but by 'doubled", I mean, he won gold .. in both the 5 and 10 ... in the same championship. And Mo has done that in both the WC and the OG. Geb didn't do this.The rounds is a difference, for sure, and it doesn't mean one is better or worse than the other. What it means is, and I'll reiterate because apparently both you and said didn't understand .. Mo won gold in both the 5000m and the 10 000m in the same championships. Geb didn't. Geb has many, many other amazing attributes, and a solid claim to being the GOAT. This thread isn't about being "the GOAT"Is Mo one of the greats .. well, he achieved something that Kenenisa Bekele has achieved. That's a petty lofty claim, imo.I don't know whether Mo's doped or not. Aouita's sorry efforts coaching in Australia cast a stronger shadow of doubt over himself than any thing on Mo. That comment had nothing to do with Geb, which is why it followed the remarks about Aouita.

LOL . he IS in the greatness conversation .. that's precisely why this thread exists. We're conversing right now.

said88 wrote:

TAA wrote:

Have a good day said88.

Thanks!

Post the ryun dusseldorf video you greedy fvck

wtfunny wrote:

What it means is, and I'll reiterate because apparently both you and said didn't understand .. Mo won gold in both the 5000m and the 10 000m in the same championships. Geb didn't.

I understood quit well. And I replied exactly to this.

Hi s.w.^3 - good to see you are still alive!

Said .. I'm not sure what exactly you "clarified"? You're simply comparing one set of accomplishments with an entirely different set of parameters.

Geb's an amazing athlete. One of the very greatest distance runners of all time. But he didn't ever win the 5000m/10 000m double at either the OG or the WC. He never once even attempted it, that I recall. If he did, I'm wrong. If he didn't, outlining what else he did, or may have done, or how old he was, doesn't change my point at all.

Mo has done that double at each of those events. Nobody else has won that double at both championships outside of Kenenisa Bekele, correct? In my opinion, that's a phenomenal achievement, and definitely puts Mo in the conversation for "is he one of the greats?".

How many people have won (in the same year) both the 5000m and the 10 000m at either the WCs or at the OGs?

The fact that Geb may well have been able to do that double, more than once doesn't lessen Mo's accomplishment, it highlights what a phenomenally rare achievement it is.

Medals aren't handed out on a "what if" basis. Geb quite probably would not have won the 5000m in 96 if Daniel Komen had been racing (see Zurich that year), but Komen wasn't in the race either. That discussion, as we've seen on LRC, is endless when we get into the imagined races. "What ifs" and "althoughs" are the world of Vent, not reality.

Mo has achieved something that the only other person who's managed to it is also one of the greatest ever middle distance runners.

Wtfunny wrote:

Said .. I'm not sure what exactly you "clarified"?

I just wanted to show the difference between the double which Farah hasn't achieved (two Olympic 10k (and/or 5k) titles) and the double which Gebrselassie hasn't achieved (5k/10k at same Olympics and/or Worlds).

Farah wasn't good enough; Gebrselassie has preferd other options (setting World Records).

The best perspective to talk about any athlete as one of the greats is after they are done competing or at least after they are done with their prime.

We may have to wait for that view for Farah.

But some things will put you there automatically.

Anyone that was a world record holder and double Olympic champion will always be thought of as one of the greats.

Farah doesn't have a major record - not even close.

And he has only medaled in one Olympics and two World Championships.

A solid three year span but still just three years of beating the runners of his time without even putting up world leading times usually.

Bekele, Geb , Paavo Nurmi, Emil Zatopek, Lase Viren.

That's the conversation he is trying to get in.

If Farah doesn't put up a record time in the 5 or 10 or get a Gold next year, he's not one the greats. He stays as one of the pretty goods.

He's Miruts Yifter or Khalid Skah

said88 wrote:

I just wanted to show the difference between the double which Farah hasn't achieved (two Olympic 10k (and/or 5k) titles) and the double which Gebrselassie hasn't achieved (5k/10k at same Olympics and/or Worlds).

Yes, they're very different achievements. I doubt one ranks "above" the other, but suffice it to say both are fantastic accomplishments. As great as we all know Geb was, as illustrated by your comments, he didn't achieve that double.

The thread isn't about who's"better" or even "is Mo as good as Geb".

Farah wasn't good enough; Gebrselassie has preferd other options (setting World Records).

Well, I think it's safe to say neither of us can support a claim as to what Gebreselassie "preferred". He probably would have preferred to beat KB in 03, right? :)

Star wrote:

If Farah doesn't put up a record time in the 5 or 10 or get a Gold next year, he's not one the greats. He stays as one of the pretty goods.

He's Miruts Yifter or Khalid Skah

You don't think Yifter qualifies as one of the greats? I do.

Nope. Not even close. He's a great racer. That's it. Not to mention he is doing it at an age when most start to slow.

Really? You seem awfully confident that your parameters for "one of the greats" are the defining lot. Perhaps that's not something you get to ascertain. It's definitely a little more subjective than that. I agree Farah's legacy isn't yet written. I disagree that his remarkable and virtually unique accomplishments should be written off so easily. Doing something that so few others (I.e., only Kenenisa Bekele) have ever done is in itself worth paying attention to.You're saying there are only 5 people in this "realm of greatness"?It's also more than a little reductive to say "he has only medaled in one Olympics and two World Championships."He won gold, comfortably in two events. At both championships. One other person in the history of the sport has achieved that, and that person is arguably the greatest middle distance runner of all time. IMO, that's worth a lot.Miruts Yifter and Khalid Skah were merely "pretty good"???That's beyond laughable. Every athlete who steps on the track at the OGs is better than "pretty good". I've competed against guys who are "pretty good", and I suck. LOL .... They're certifiably freaks. Those who make the finals are the top few athletes in the world. Medallists are ridiculous, and the winner is the most ridiculously freakish athlete on the planet. You remind me of the guy behind me in the stands at the Atlanta OG when MJ came out for the 200m, and this guy says to his kids, "Hey look kids, there's Michael Johnson. He's a fast runner!":)

The claim that someone who ran a 3:28 1500 and 2:08 marathon within 9 months isn't an all time great, when considering he is also a 2 time olympic gold medalist, 3 time world champion, and a world record holder, is absurd.