Jogfest. 54.x split, 1:47.02 time. NCAA runners push the pace harder than that.
Jogfest. 54.x split, 1:47.02 time. NCAA runners push the pace harder than that.
OMG!!
He ran fast at the end of a 1:47 race!!! A 1:47. What a joke.
I've closed faster over the last 100m of a 1:57 race, which is relative.
Exactly. Anyone who fails to see Coe's absolute brilliance as a middle distance runner, knows nothing about middle distance running.
10.0 for the final straight. How long is that? usually 80 meters, but it looks like he is going faster than 12.5 pace doesn't it? So how long is the straight?
I again watched the video, the surge started at ~1.36 flat so he had about 11 secs time to finish, and with flying start you can get almost a second assett vs starting on the blocks, so I am not far from the truth. It´s only semantics were he at 900m mark or just under or just over when the final kick started. From the angle of the camera it is impossible to accurately estimate his position where he was.
U.N.O. wrote:
I again watched the video, the surge started at ~1.36 flat so he had about 11 secs time to finish, and with flying start you can get almost a second assett vs starting on the blocks, so I am not far from the truth. It´s only semantics were he at 900m mark or just under or just over when the final kick started. From the angle of the camera it is impossible to accurately estimate his position where he was.
It´s only semantics were he at 700m point
From this video...about 10,5 sec
45. will get you on every 4x4 team in the ncaa and every national team except perhaps the U.S.
Compare Coe's 400m and 1500m bests to Nick Simmonds. Then compare their 800m times. What does it tell you.
Coe was a 800m/1500m runner. Saying his sprint times compare unfavorably to 400m/800m runners shows a complete lack of understanding of middle distance running.
ventolin^3 wrote:
eh ???
the 1st wide-angle shot is at 1'36.7s, 10.3s from finish
where are 110/90m markers ?
YOu can see the end of the relay boxes at least 10 m back of where you call it.
That track appears to have short straights. If it was faster than 12 seconds it wouldn't be by much. At 1:36, you can't see the starting line for the 100, and the end of relay box is way back. It was a slow run.
pred wrote:YOu can see the end of the relay boxes at least 10 m back of where you call it
no
they are more likely to be 100m lines which is standard for mid-point marking of last take-off zone as well as 2nd
That track appears to have short straights
yes
it's as low as 80m for modern tracks with current iaaf rules of 35.0 - 38.0m for radius
maya been more more back then, but it certainly was no
116 / 84
& = / worse than 120 / 80 limit for modern tracks, but iaaf rules meant sh!t back then
all it had to be was some ~ straights with a semi-circle plugged on each end back then
If it was faster than 12 seconds it wouldn't be by much
it wasn't
try
~ 12.3
At 1:36, you can't see the starting line for the 100, and the end of relay box is way back
no
it is short straight
it is deceptive
that is likely the mid-point of last take-off, which is 100m point & a listed marking on iaaf diagram
It was a slow run
yup
i dread to think what caballo, Rudy, Kip, even nijel wouda done in last 100 of crap slow 800s
i believe nijel had some fast last 100 in crap commonwealth 800 last year, but looking for fast last 100 in pathetic 800 is a pathetic hobby, laughable, as the likelihood of fast last 100s by elite 800 guys are likely almost legion, but there is not even semi-official last 100 in huge majority of these
this race doesn't even have the undisputed markings / side-on vid late on !
like i said, i dread to think what caballo couda run for last 100 in a pathetic 800 in
'76 or '77...
ventolin^3 wrote:i believe nijel had some fast last 100 in crap commonwealth 800 last year
here it is !!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GoERWTz56QUit's wet, probably cold'n'windy as well in scotland, just not african weather !!
nijel finishes a
1'45.1
in
~ 12.3 + !!!
'72 trials was epic ( albeit i only read about it & only brief segment on youtubesomeone fetch it, albeit brief )- wottle - 1'44.3 WR- wohl - 1'45.0- swenson - 1'45.1- Ryun - 1'45.2Ryun missed munich qualifying by fraction, where he probably wouda won gold if he had not run such a suicidal effort in trials at bell in only a shadow of his '67 incredible peak & stoopid 4th by littlehere is "official account" :
"This was a superb 800m, one of those which leaves the watchers drained from the emotion of watching it & followed a series of surprises. The fastest USA of '72, front-running winzreid, was outkicked by 3 men in 1st heat won from the front by resurging Ryun
in final, led thru in 25.2 !!! & still held onto bell in 52.0 by fulton, with wottle at last in 52.9
Ryun suddenly kicked at bell..."
he ran it in a suicidal, even for his incredible '67 peak, for a shadow of it, in
11.5 !!!
No, you are wrong. Why do you repeat posting your biased nonsense even after they have been removed once before?
I have the race on dvd and Coe's last 100m was 11.9.
He ran faster, 11.3, in the Europa Cup semi the same year in a 1:47. Another race I have on dvd. This is the fastest ever last 100 in an international 800 race.
Amos ran a 12.4 in a 1:45.1 with a last 200 of 25.0
Coe ran a 12.4 in a 1:44.5 in Stuttgart 86, with a 24.8 last 200 running 2m+ wide.
He also ran a 12.3 last 100 in a 1:44.0 in 81. Both superior to Amos's finish.
Ryun never ran an 11.5 last 100, only in your dreams. You offer no link, just made up drivel.
Deanouk wrote:
No, you are wrong. Why do you repeat posting your biased nonsense even after they have been removed once before?
I have the race on dvd and Coe's last 100m was 11.9.
He ran faster, 11.3, in the Europa Cup semi the same year in a 1:47. Another race I have on dvd. This is the fastest ever last 100 in an international 800 race.
Amos ran a 12.4 in a 1:45.1 with a last 200 of 25.0
Coe ran a 12.4 in a 1:44.5 in Stuttgart 86, with a 24.8 last 200 running 2m+ wide.
He also ran a 12.3 last 100 in a 1:44.0 in 81. Both superior to Amos's finish.
Ryun never ran an 11.5 last 100, only in your dreams. You offer no link, just made up drivel.
Edit.
Looking at Amos's last 100m in the Commonwealth Games, it is difficult to be precise with his last 100m. The stadium clock (as opposed to the on screen one, which looks like it is 0.1 or 0.2 slow), which is the official one that displays the time at the finish, clearly shows 1:32.7 as Amos's torso is above the line. As the finish time is 1:45.18, then that would indicate 12.4+ for the last 100m. However, the on screen clock shows 1:32.6 and as Amos's torso crosses the line, the clock is still on 1:44.9. So that would indicate 12.3. Without official splits for that last 100m, it could be either.
What is more certain is that his last 200m was 25.2 (not the 25.0 I stated earlier, apologies).
He ran about an extra 1m on the bend, but generally he was close to the curb and drafted for all of it.
In the Stuttgart 800m, Coe ran a last 200m of 24.8. However, he ran most of that last curve wide in lane 1 and touching lane 2 at points. He ran at least 2.5m extra. He had some drafting behind Cram, but nowhere near as much as Amos received in his run. Coe was above the 100m line at 1:32.0 (on the on screen clock), but when his torso crosses the finish line, a freeze frame shows that the clock is still on 1:44.3, just changing to 1:44.4. So again, Coe's last 100m was between 12.3 and 12.4. It was a v similar finish to Amos's, but Coe's was in an overall faster race, where he ran a considerable extra distance throughout the race. Moreover, Amos's last 200 was 25.0 if the extra distance is taken into consideration, whereas Coe's was worth 24.5, taking the extra 2.5m he ran into consideration.
To claim Coe's run in Stuttgart was shameful because he got some drafting behind Cram is a very strange thing to claim. Surely by applying that logic, most 800m runners are also 'pathetic' and 'shameful' pretty much every time they race!
Coe did run the last 100m in 11.3 in the Europa Cup semi competition. It appeared in the Times newspaper at the time and was in David Miller's book, "Running Free". I have the race on dvd. I do not have the software to upload it onto Youtube.
I also made a mistake with Coe's last 100m in Crystal Palace 81. On closer look at the video, it was 12.4 (not 12.3) in his 1:44.0. Apologies.
Yet, I still believe a 12.4 at the end of a front running 1:44.0 to be more impressive than a 12.3/12.4 at the end of a 1:45.1, chasing down a moving target in front.
I wrote that Ryun never ran 'a LAST 100m' in 11.5 in an 800m. A statement which I stick by. On closer inspection of Ventolin's post, it was not clear that he was talking about a 100m stretch at the bell. This, IMO, while impressive, is not relevant to the thread or the discussion, as we were talking about the closing 100m in an 800m race. The fact that Ryun didn't even win that race, further underlines it's relative insignificance.
Deanouk wrote:Looking at Amos's last 100m in the Commonwealth Games, it is difficult to be precise with his last 100m
nonsense
it is quite simple to get very accurate figure if you can learn to watch
The stadium clock (as opposed to the on screen one, which looks like it is 0.1 or 0.2 slow)
no it is at least 0.2s slow, nearer 0.3s
which is the official one that displays the time at the finish, clearly shows 1:32.7 as Amos's torso is above the line
nonsense
i can freeze-frame at 1'32.8 with his torso over the line
observe better
As the finish time is 1:45.18, then that would indicate 12.4+ for the last 100m
utter total drivel !!!
if you are adjusting the running clock, you apply it at both 700m & 800m
at 700m, his torso can be seen over line with 1'32.8 on clock
incredibly with his torso over the finish, the clock can be freeze-frozen at 1'44.9
therefore according to the running tv clock, he ran :
1'44.9 - 1'32.8 =
12.1 !!!
However, the on screen clock shows 1:32.6 and as Amos's torso crosses the line, the clock is still on 1:44.9. So that would indicate 12.3. Without official splits for that last 100m, it could be either
utter nonsense
his torso can be seen over line with 1'32.8 & 1'44.9 at finish
that is 12.1
where on earth does this 1'32.6 drivel come from ???
you cannot use the infield clock because you do not have instant view of it as he crosses the line
learn to think
What is more certain is that his last 200m was 25.2 (not the 25.0 I stated earlier, apologies)
yes
He ran about an extra 1m on the bend, but generally he was close to the curb and drafted for all of it
utter total drivel
what on earth race are you watching ???
nijel ran ~ 2m wide on each of 2nd, 3rd & 4th bend !
that is ~ 6m extra
not only that, at 1'33.0 on clock, he got blocked, stumbles & had to suddenly move out wide into lane 2 !!!
that cost him at least 1m on Rudy & that means his unimpeded last 100 wouda been
~ 11.9+ !!!
In the Stuttgart 800m, Coe ran a last 200m of 24.8. However, he ran most of that last curve wide in lane 1 and touching lane 2 at points. He ran at least 2.5m extra
nijel ~ 2m
He had some drafting behind Cram, but nowhere near as much as Amos
received in his run
nonsense
coe gets almost same drafting as nijel, virtually insignificant
coe gets clear run in stretch whereas nijel gets blocked, stumbles & has to immediately go out into lane 2
Coe was above the 100m line at 1:32.0 (on the on screen clock)
no
that is as clock changes to 1'32.1
but when his torso crosses the finish line, a freeze frame shows that the clock is still on 1:44.3, just changing to 1:44.4
nonsense
there is no freeze-frame with him at 1'44.3 with torso above the line
it is at 1'44.4
it is clearly seen that 1'44.51 can be freeze-framed with his torso ~ 0.75m past line indicating again 1'44.4
also prior to finish, it can be freeze-framed as 1'44.3 with his torso fractionally past 799m
So again, Coe's last 100m was between 12.3 and 12.4
wrong numbers but correct 100m
It was a v similar finish to Amos's
nonsense
we are concerned with last 100
nijel ran 12.1
coe ran 12.3
nijel was significantly impeded at start of stretch costing him at least 1m in distance making his finish more like
11.9+
but Coe's was in an overall faster race
compensated by nijel having to run much quicker semi than coe by nearly 2s
where he ran a considerable extra distance throughout the race
utter nonsense
nijel ran ~ 6m extra wide in race + bad stumble at start of home-stretch necessitating sudden move to lane 2
Moreover, Amos's last 200 was 25.0 if the extra distance is taken into consideration, whereas Coe's was worth 24.5, taking the extra 2.5m he ran into consideration
nijel's more like 24.8 accounting for stumble at start of home-stretch & immediate move to lane 2
the crucial aspect is last 100m
nijel's unimpeded last 100 was ~ 11.9+ !!!
coe's was ~ 12.3
a huge huge difference
To claim Coe's run in Stuttgart was shameful because he got some drafting behind Cram is a very strange thing to claim
clueless
coe was still wr holder back then & for him to shamefully limpet cram was embarrassing
he was terrified of cram after seeing his incredible commonwealth 800 win & had no intention but to draft of cram & hope he didn't run away from him
nijel was running race expected behind the incredible WR holder
he had to believe/expect Rudy wouda been in some kinda near-peak shape & thus deferred by drafting behind him as anyone with a clue expected
do you know anything about the sport ???
Surely by applying that logic, most 800m runners are also 'pathetic' and 'shameful' pretty much every time they race!
clueless
no one tries to run away from a recent WR holder from the front unless they think they are near that shape
Coe did run the last 100m in 11.3 in the Europa Cup semi competition
speculation
as can be shown from non-existent markings for the zagreb race, it is likely way out
it sounds nonsense as he looks to have only gone 12.2 in zagreb in a race only slightly quicker than helsinki
11.3 sounds more mis-measured nonsense
It appeared in the Times newspaper at the time
you certainly weren't reading that back in '81
how about the telegraph or guardian's reckoning of his last 100 ???
how about T&F News's or AW's ???
some mis-measured quote included in a book
and was in David Miller's book, "Running Free"
plainly quoting from alleged newspaper report
I have the race on dvd. I do not have the software to upload it onto Youtube
post asking for help on a new topic
if you can convert it to mpg or avi, someone will definitely upload it for you if you email them it
I also made a mistake with Coe's last 100m in Crystal Palace 81. On closer look at the video, it was 12.4 (not 12.3) in his 1:44.0. Apologies
nonsense
there are no distinct perpendicular markings to make any estimate of his last 100
apologise for posting nonsense
Yet, I still believe a 12.4 at the end of a front running 1:44.0 to be more impressive than a 12.3/12.4 at the end of a 1:45.1, chasing down a moving target in front
nonsense
you have no obvious track markings on which to base this
I wrote that Ryun never ran 'a LAST 100m' in 11.5 in an 800m
yes you did
can't you read :
"Ryun never ran an 11.5 last 100, only in your dreams. You offer no link, just made up drivel"
utter drivel
you posted it
learn to read your own & my actual quote
A statement which I stick by
completely inept
i, or no one else claimed Ryun ran 11.5 for last 100 in 1'45.2
it was statement of his 400 - 500 which you were too clueless to comprehend
On closer inspection of Ventolin's post, it was not clear that he was talking about a 100m stretch at the bell
yes it was !!!
how damn clueless are you ???
"if he had not run such a suicidal effort in trials at bell in only a shadow of his '67 incredible peak"
then official account :
...Ryun suddenly kicked at bell...
then my conclusion
"he ran it in a suicidal, even for his incredible '67 peak, for a shadow of it, in
11.5 !!!
can't you comprehend ???
This, IMO, while impressive
hugely impressive
no man has ever put in a 11.5 in last lap of a 1'45
probably indicative of a guy in 1'42-flat/low shape if aimed all of it in a 1-off euro race
this was when shadow of incredible '67 peak
is not relevant to the thread or the discussion
yes it is if guy didn't run many 800s
any fast 100 in 2nd lap is damn important
you have no clue about 800
as we were talking about the closing 100m in an 800m race
Ryun made huge misjudgement
an 11.5 for 400 - 500 is unlikely have been worse than 12.0 if he'd waited for his kick with still 1'45.2
The fact that Ryun didn't even win that race, further underlines it's relative insignificance
utterly clueless
wottle won & tied wr, but he, as well as everyone who watched or read about it knew Ryun made the race
Another laughable and deluded response.
Amos's torso is above the 100m line at 1:32.6 on the running clock. The same running clock is already at 1:44.9 before his torso crosses the line, and stays on that time as he crosses the line. His last 100m is 12.3 absolute tops. It's ludicrous to claim it was 0.4 sec faster.
His last 200m is 25.2, he doesn't run anywhere near 2m wide on bend.
In Stuttgart Coe ran further distance overall, about 9m, ran more extra distance over the last 200m than Amos, and received less drafting than him in that last furlong.
He ran 24.8 and 12.3/12.4 for last 100 in a race 0.6 faster.
In the 1:44.0 race in 81 you clearly see Coe on the 100m line on the 1st lap as he passes the hurdles on the infield. At exactly the same point on the 2nd lap, with Coe at the front of the hurdles on the infield, the clock shows 1:31.6, meaning the last 100m was 12.4.
If he can run a 12.4 at the end of a 1:44.0, a 12.3 at the end of a 1:44.5, a 12.0 at the end of a 1:46.1 (81 World Cup) and an 11.9 in a 1:47 in 79, then of course he could run an 11.9 in a 1:47 in 81, and an 11.3 in a 1:47.5.
ventolin^3 wrote:
'72 trials was epic
( albeit i only read about it & only brief segment on youtube
someone fetch it, albeit brief )
- wottle - 1'44.3 WR
- wohl - 1'45.0
- swenson - 1'45.1
- Ryun - 1'45.2
Ryun missed munich qualifying by fraction, where he probably wouda won gold if he had not run such a suicidal effort in trials at bell in only a shadow of his '67 incredible peak & stoopid 4th by little
here is "official account" :
[quote]"This was a superb 800m, one of those which leaves the watchers drained from the emotion of watching it & followed a series of surprises. The fastest USA of '72, front-running winzreid, was outkicked by 3 men in 1st heat won from the front by resurging Ryun
in final, led thru in 25.2 !!! & still held onto bell in 52.0 by fulton, with wottle at last in 52.9
Ryun suddenly kicked at bell..."
he ran it in a suicidal, even for his incredible '67 peak, for a shadow of it, in
11.5 !!!
it is off-season & some re-evaluation needed
now, '72 was nowhere in same universe as Ryun's '67 peak
he ran 11.5 for 400 - 500 in '72 trials which was suicidal but got wottle his tied-wr
here is source, a real gem, which i recommend every serious fan download if not already done so :
http://www.usatf.org/statistics/champions/OlympicTrials/HistoryOfTheOlympicTrials.pdfhere are splits for Ryun along with others from iaaf WR progression pdf, which is another essential download
( worth ~ $40+ for hardback !!! )
http://iaaf-ebooks.s3.amazonaws.com/2015/Progression-of-IAAF-World-Records-2015/index.htm( other editions available to download - go fetch )
Ryun split
52.5
then
11.5 !!!
for next 100
then 13.3 with last 200 of 27.9
yes, he slowed badly in last 200 but still held onto 1'45.2
it doesn't take much logic to realise that
52.5 / 11.5 / 13.3 / 27.9
coud easily have been transposed to a far more sensible effort at bell, where he couda have gone
~ 52.5 / 27.2 / 13.5 / 12.0
the key was to realise that a 11.5 for 400 - 500 is perfectly consistent with a more sensible 12-flat if effort re-distributed hugely more efficiently in last lap
( obviously that still only gets him 1'45.2 & no munich 800 shot )
then i't shocked me to realise, we have actually seen a very similar effort !!!
nijel in '14 commonwealth ran race with similar finish, similar 1st 400. etc
he ran 1'42.45 in monaco in same year when he ran ~ 8m extra !!!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d0sxPFhKCVMhe set off too quick at 24.2 which with my formula of :
( 4 * 200 initial split ) + 3 = 1'39.8 !!! pace, was far too quick !
he then ran
- 2nd bend ~ 2.5m extra & no great drafting 1/2-wide of bosse
1st home-stretch mostly outsida bosse, so little drafting for his entitlement
- 3rd bend ~ 2.5m extra with some slightly better drafting behind bosse
-4th bend - ridiculous !!!
he is running well into lane 2 late-on !!!
that is easily 3m extra overall
so, 808m in 1'42.45 ->
1'41.43
i'd be 1st to say Ryun of '72 was not in above shape, but he woudn't have been far off it based on similar postulated last 100 of suggested 12.0 instead of suicidal 11.5 at bell, albeit must be acknowledged nigel in wet, probably cold conditions in scotland wasn't happy with weather
i'd have to offer Ryun a
~ 1'42-flat
for his '72 shape in a 1-off, 70F, little-wind 800
( i doubt he got little wind in eugene, so that reduces nijel's wet/cold handicap )
not bad for hugely past his '67 peak !!!
he most probably shouda won the 800 in munich if in 1'42-flat shape, if not run the most stoopid race imageinable at trials...
Deanouk wrote:Another laughable and deluded response
utter nonsense again
Amos's torso is above the 100m line at 1:32.6 on the running clock
nonsense
his back-foot is still behind line at 1'32.8
therefore torso at same
learn to watch
The same running clock is already at 1:44.9 before his torso crosses the line
yes
that is key
and stays on that time as he crosses the line
clueless
how inept are you ???
it is what the clock shows as he crosses line & then correlate with same clock at 700m as = error thruout
the 700m position doesn't have same side-on view
what can be concluded is :
1'44.9 - 1'32.8 =
12.1
His last 100m is 12.3 absolute tops
utter drivel
learn to watch
1'44.9 - 1'32.8 =
12.1
you have been too inept not to look at same clock thruout nor observe properly
It's ludicrous to claim it was 0.4 sec faster
clueless
learn to observe & analyse better
His last 200m is 25.2, he doesn't run anywhere near 2m wide on bend
utter nonsense
he is at least mid-point all of last bend until late on when forced sideways into lane 2
In Stuttgart Coe ran further distance overall, about 9m
nijel ran 6m
after far quicker 800 the day before, by nearly 2s
nijel helluva lot more tired for final than coe was
ran more extra distance over the last 200m than Amos
barely
by ~ 0.5m
and received less drafting than him in that last furlong
no
nijel recieved fractional less drafting as coe limpeted-cram most all of bend
He ran 24.8 and 12.3/12.4 for last 100 in a race 0.6 faster
nijel ran 12.1 for last 100 with serious barge
it wouda been 11.9 !!!
hugely more impressive in far unfriendlier african conditions - horrible scotland
In the 1:44.0 race in 81 you clearly see Coe on the 100m line on the 1st lap as he passes the hurdles on the infield
utter drivel
that is not a horizontal line on the track
where is running clock at that point ??
this just shows track wasn't 116 / 84
At exactly the same point on the 2nd lap, with Coe at the front of the hurdles on the infield, the clock shows 1:31.6, meaning the last 100m was 12.4
nonsense
same position on 2nd lap has him at ~ 1'31.3 making it 12.7
those lines look nonsense as not proper 116 / 84 looking track
.
If he can run a 12.4 at the end of a 1:44.0
no
try more like 12.7
a 12.0 at the end of a 1:46.1 (81 World Cup)
yes
and an 11.9 in a 1:47 in 79
nonsense
looks more like 12.3
you offer drivel about grippo when wrong guy
idiot
it was zivotic
how inept are you ???
& no proper horizontal markings
then of course he could run an 11.9 in a 1:47 in 81
why on earth are you repeating same drivel ???
it's nonsense
looks more like 12.3
you offer drivel about grippo when wrong guy
how inept are you ???
& no proper horizontal markings
and an 11.3 in a 1:47.5.
utter nonsense
he looks 12.3 in a 1'47.03
how on earth does that look consistent with a 11.3 ??? in a 1'47.57 ???
bumpuseful post + useful downloads
ventolin^3 wrote:
it is off-season & some re-evaluation needed
now, '72 was nowhere in same universe as Ryun's '67 peak
he ran 11.5 for 400 - 500 in '72 trials which was suicidal but got wottle his tied-wr
here is source, a real gem, which i recommend every serious fan download if not already done so :
http://www.usatf.org/statistics/champions/OlympicTrials/HistoryOfTheOlympicTrials.pdfhere are splits for Ryun along with others from iaaf WR progression pdf, which is another essential download
( worth ~ $40+ for hardback !!! )
http://iaaf-ebooks.s3.amazonaws.com/2015/Progression-of-IAAF-World-Records-2015/index.htm( other editions available to download - go fetch )
Ryun split
52.5
then
11.5 !!!
for next 100
then 13.3 with last 200 of 27.9
yes, he slowed badly in last 200 but still held onto 1'45.2
it doesn't take much logic to realise that
52.5 / 11.5 / 13.3 / 27.9
coud easily have been transposed to a far more sensible effort at bell, where he couda have gone
~ 52.5 / 27.2 / 13.5 / 12.0
the key was to realise that a 11.5 for 400 - 500 is perfectly consistent with a more sensible 12-flat if effort re-distributed hugely more efficiently in last lap
( obviously that still only gets him 1'45.2 & no munich 800 shot )
then i't shocked me to realise, we have actually seen a very similar effort !!!
nijel in '14 commonwealth ran race with similar finish, similar 1st 400. etc
he ran 1'42.45 in monaco in same year when he ran ~ 8m extra !!!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d0sxPFhKCVMhe set off too quick at 24.2 which with my formula of :
( 4 * 200 initial split ) + 3 = 1'39.8 !!! pace, was far too quick !
he then ran
- 2nd bend ~ 2.5m extra & no great drafting 1/2-wide of bosse
1st home-stretch mostly outsida bosse, so little drafting for his entitlement
- 3rd bend ~ 2.5m extra with some slightly better drafting behind bosse
-4th bend - ridiculous !!!
he is running well into lane 2 late-on !!!
that is easily 3m extra overall
so, 808m in 1'42.45 ->
1'41.43
i'd be 1st to say Ryun of '72 was not in above shape, but he woudn't have been far off it based on similar postulated last 100 of suggested 12.0 instead of suicidal 11.5 at bell, albeit must be acknowledged nigel in wet, probably cold conditions in scotland wasn't happy with weather
i'd have to offer Ryun a
~ 1'42-flat
for his '72 shape in a 1-off, 70F, little-wind 800
( i doubt he got little wind in eugene, so that reduces nijel's wet/cold handicap )
not bad for hugely past his '67 peak !!!
he most probably shouda won the 800 in munich if in 1'42-flat shape, if not run the most stoopid race imageinable at trials...
Tactics, pace judgement, and big race temprement are all part of the package of a middle distance runner. Ryun was not a tactically astute runner, nor was he a championship performer. His tactics in the heat of the Munich Olympic 1500m were much worse than those in the trials for the 800m.
Ryun is one of many super talents who couldn't get it right when it counted most at the Olympics.
Some athletes end their careers with a list of Olympic accomplishments, others with a list of excuses.