Some people seem to be having trouble with the term "racing range in a short period of time."
I think we're talking about a range of distances where people might assume different training is needed for separate events.
5 and 10 doubles don't fit this.
Not sure what you guys are thinking listing a series of 800m races as a good range.
someone had to do it wrote:
because farah had 12'40/26'30 5k/10k endurance
Even though Farah has NEVER demonstrated the possibility of being in 12:40/26:30 shape, let's assume that he is for the sake of my next question. What person in simultaneous 12:40/26:30 shape can't run faster than 60:10??? A 12:40/26:30 guy should run 60:10 as a common run, not as a close to all out race pace.
kippy roppy wrote:
range for days wrote:i don't care about wins or losses, purely the performance. i doubt Kiprop could've ran a 60min HM 2 months after Monaco, or Bekele a 3:28 1500 2 months prior to GNR.
agree Bekele's short/long course XC doubles are impressive in terms of tittles though. i'm sure he took down some fine 1500 runners in the 4K XC.
Why do you doubt that Kiprop could have done it? You're aware of how slow 60:10 is aren't you? If Farah did it, why couldn't they? Alan Webb in 2007 could have done it or at least come close. I'd consider his 1:43/27:34 sit and kick to be pretty good range.
Oh come on. You guys don't actually think Kiprop could run a 60:10 half marathon just like that, do you?
Hello ventolin^3 how' s ur calculator?
bigtool05 wrote:
Oh come on. You guys don't actually think Kiprop could run a 60:10 half marathon just like that, do you?
Once again, why not? A 60 half isn't fast. The world record should be around 58flat.
Both Webb and Farah's performances suggest that it's not out of the question. A 60:10 is only equivalent to a 27:20 10k. And like has already been mentioned, look up Kiprop's tempo run pace and then look at the pace for a 60:10.
You need to change your impression of what a good half time is.
Haile Gebreslassie ran 3:31 for 1500 indoor in February of 1998, then 12:39 and 26:22 for 5000 and 10000 respectively in June.
Critical Thinking wrote:
Haile Gebreslassie ran 3:31 for 1500 indoor in February of 1998, then 12:39 and 26:22 for 5000 and 10000 respectively in June.
If this is true then discussion is over.
odk wrote:
someone had to do it wrote:idiot
we've been thru this
60'10 is very impressive for someone who is sub 3'30
Just because you say it is, doesn't mean that it actually is. Tell me what the tempo pace is for a 3:50 runner. Answer this without changing the subject or any name-calling or any other typical Ventolin-avoidance.
60:10 is 4:35/mi. That seems pretty fast for a tempo pace no matter who you are.
It might not be the most impressive ever, but Rono in '78 came to mind when reading the thread title.
coach d wrote:
You all forgot about the best one--letsrun poster Henry Rono.
He broke the world records in 3000, SC, 5000, and 10000....in less than 3 months (81 days).
ron clarke broke 12 world records in 44 days !!!!
if i can find them online somewhere
Rono deserves mention, but I don't see 3000 to 10000 as huge range (though throwing SC into the mix makes does add something).
Ovett won the Dartford Half-Marathon in 65:38 on August 20, 1977. On one of the days between September 2nd and 4th (I'm not sure which day the 1500 occurred), he destroyed the field in the 1500m at the IAAF World Cup with perhaps the best finishing kick ever.
viren too
2-13 marathon for 5th 18hrs after winning olympic 5000 gold
and a blood transfusion in between!
odk wrote:
someone had to do it wrote:idiot
we've been thru this
60'10 is very impressive for someone who is sub 3'30
Just because you say it is, doesn't mean that it actually is. Tell me what the tempo pace is for a 3:50 runner. Answer this without changing the subject or any name-calling or any other typical Ventolin-avoidance.
same moron, new name
the arguments have already been made as you well know
here is a refresher for your pea brain -
http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=5396544&page=1Only 10 people in history have run under 59 minutes for the half-marathon.
At least 1 of which tested positive for steroids.
Does that mean only 9 people in history have good endurance?
Ryan Hall ran 59:43. Does that mean he does not have good endurance?
You really have some bizarre perception of what good endurance is. El Guerrouj had better endurance than any runner that raced the 1500 as their main event. He would not have run under 27 minutes. And he would not have run anywhere near 60 minutes for the half, let alone under 59 minutes (which you suggest is the benchmark for "good endurance").
But don't take my word for it. Perhaps you will instead listen to Renato Canova. Maybe you've heard of him?!?
Renato Canova wrote:
Don't think the real value of Mo is 12'53". He ran already 12'57" in 2010, when we worked together for some month in Iten, in Zurich, and now is very much stronger, after going to Salazar. To think can run near 12'40" is something reasonable, such as the possibility of running under 26'30" in 10000m.
Renato posted that after Mo ran 3'28 this year. He seems to understand that Mo has tremendous endurance to run 3'28.high with such limited speed. Same as Komen running 3'29 with limited speed or Geb running 3'31 indoors.
cool, thanks! stuff like this Geb example is what i was looking for. IMO the Ovett example is even more interesting as i always wonder what the pure 800/1500 guys with lots of strength could do in longer stuff in the roads. and come on...Kiprop doing a 13+ mile "tempo run" at 4:35 pace? ;)but seriously, if anyone knows anything about Kiprop's training, i'd be curious to know if he has ever hammered a 10 miler in 4:45s or something. otherwise i feel we have little to no perception of what he could really do in a HM (let alone a 10K! or maybe even a 5K). (after i type the above paragraph, i looked up Kiprop's PRs. 742 and 1359 listed for 3K and 5K respectively. so unless there is an impressive road or XC race by Asbel that i missed, i stand by what i wrote!)
Critical Thinking wrote:
Haile Gebreslassie ran 3:31 for 1500 indoor in February of 1998, then 12:39 and 26:22 for 5000 and 10000 respectively in June.
range for days wrote:
so unless there is an impressive . . . XC race by Asbel that i missed
.
He won junior world cross in 2007.
And you're welcome for the Geb example!
John Walker 4th in world cross country champs in March 1975 then in August he became the first person under 3:50 for the mile.
Paul Cummings 1982 if memory serves......
Ran a 2:12 marathon in Sweeden and then 7 or 8 days later ran 13:30 5K at the US outdoor track championships.
coach d wrote:You all forgot about the best one--letsrun poster Henry Rono.
He broke the world records in 3000, SC, 5000, and 10000....in less than 3 months (81 days).
it is a huge pity henry didn't run a rested 1500 with pacers in '78 ( albeit he ran coupla low key mile races early on & 2 at end of season when running on fumes )
his 3k wr of 7'32.1 was incredible
i believe he split 3'50/3'42 with a 57.4 finish !!!
so, basically a jog to 1500m ( i don't know if he got much/any pacing ) then a huge push
it's pretty obvious he couda gone 7'30 that day at even pace
i'm also pretty sure he wouda been in 3'33 shape that day ( he was not that disimilar from jipcho who went 3'33.1/13'14+ ( latter fractionally outside 13'13wr - ben's clocking though was in a proper race, not a tt ! ) ) as you'd expect most 7'30 guys nowdays to be capable of 3'32/3'33/3'34
the 1500wr in '78 was bayi's 3'32.1
i don't think henry wouda quite broken it, but possibly couda run it close if he'd rested a bit & did a bit pf speedwork mid-season
no one has held every wr from 1500 - 10k certainly not simultaneously ( i have to check nurmi though ), but henry couda come damn close !!!
Emil Zatopek: 5K, 10K and marathon golds at the 1952 Olympics