FootLocker attracts the best runners in America and prepares them for the next level.
NXN attracts the most narcissistic programs in America with a bunch of kids that burn-out after high school. My high school has qualified most years since 2005 and not a single kid has successfully run at the NCAA Division I level.
Whereas a guy like me that ran FootLocker had a decent collegiate career.
Does anyone have a list of the top 100 runners at nationals, and whether they:
Ran Footlocker exclusively.
Ran NXN exclusively.
Ran both.
Ran neither.
I suspect that the top 100 is comprised primarily of guys in that last category. Girls even more so. Anyone know where I could find out?
Gcol wrote:
FootLocker attracts the best runners in America and prepares them for the next level.
NXN attracts the most narcissistic programs in America with a bunch of kids that burn-out after high school. My high school has qualified most years since 2005 and not a single kid has successfully run at the NCAA Division I level.
Whereas a guy like me that ran FootLocker had a decent collegiate career.
You again.
Footlocker prepares kids for the next level? Are you serious? It is one race, that doesn't prepare anyone for anything. Stop being a stooge.
I honestly think it depends on what region you are from. Here in the Midwest, people go to Foot Locker when they want to run against the best in the country, and people go to NXN when they want a bunch of free stuff and to be coddled.
yeah right... it prepares you to race the best in any given situation - a championship format and race.
Obviously you haven't race at a high enough level to appreciate what a race like FootLocker does to a runner.
Gcol wrote:
yeah right... it prepares you to race the best in any given situation - a championship format and race.
Obviously you haven't race at a high enough level to appreciate what a race like FootLocker does to a runner.
Um, hope you are having a fun and enjoyable freshman year of high school.
I have coached 4 kids who have run at Footlocker Nationals and I would say the rest of the season leading up to that one race had much more of an impact on those runners than one day in Dec..
So you haven't run in a high level race like FL?
yeah right... wrote:
Gcol wrote:yeah right... it prepares you to race the best in any given situation - a championship format and race.
Obviously you haven't race at a high enough level to appreciate what a race like FootLocker does to a runner.
Um, hope you are having a fun and enjoyable freshman year of high school.
I have coached 4 kids who have run at Footlocker Nationals and I would say the rest of the season leading up to that one race had much more of an impact on those runners than one day in Dec..
[quote]get used to it. wrote:
So you haven't run in a high level race like FL?
Sorry, collegiate All-American. Couple of top ten national champ finishes post collegiate. Career was cut short due to a leg issue, but did race at a fairly high level. No, I don't consider Footlocker or most any HS race a high level.
As a coach, i try to ensure that they get it.
Have also had teams qualify for NXN and value the team aspect much more than the individual aspect. Will continue to pass that on to my athletes.
as a fan I have and still enjoy footlocker more than NXN.
BTY: I sort of worry about nike controling everything running....so I hope footlocker continued success
other pts..my opinion
announcers are much better at footlocker nationals
introductions and profiles are much better at footlocker
at this level I am more interested in the top individual in the country
webpage is better and easlier to access results, photos, achives, etc etc...
there is a lot talent at both events, I give the overall edge to footlocker
I think I would rather run footlocker
Gcol wrote:
FootLocker attracts the best runners in America and prepares them for the next level.
NXN attracts the most narcissistic programs in America with a bunch of kids that burn-out after high school. My high school has qualified most years since 2005 and not a single kid has successfully run at the NCAA Division I level.
Whereas a guy like me that ran FootLocker had a decent collegiate career.
Well, all seven guys on my team won Olympic medals after going to NXN, but one dude who ditched on us and ran at footlocker is now drinking sterno under bridges. I guess it just varies from school to school, huh?
themanontherun wrote:
Does anyone have a list of the top 100 runners at nationals, and whether they:
Ran Footlocker exclusively.
Ran NXN exclusively.
Ran both.
Ran neither.
I suspect that the top 100 is comprised primarily of guys in that last category. Girls even more so. Anyone know where I could find out?
I have most of the information already. I'll see about looking it up later today. I have a feeling it will be much more balanced than the person who indicated everyone only ran FLN...
And I always laugh at how people can insist that FLN "prepares" kids for the NCAA better than NXN - a 40 runner race in San Diego CA or a 200 runner race (and probably 50-60 easily comparable to the FLN 40) in Portland OR, in preparing you for a 250 runner field in Terre Haute IN... hmm...
yeah right is right dude, it's just one race. You run against some of the best in the country, you finish with a place and time, and you go home. What about the training you do after the race or fr year in college? does that not make a difference? and also this is to everyone. It will always vary from year to year, but since people leaning towards FL are trying to be biased let me law down some stats. The NCAA champion ran Nike his SO year, 4th place Futsum did Nike his senior year, 5th place finisher Joe Rosa did Nike all 3 years, Craig Nowak a sub-24 sophomore from OSU did Nike SR year. Craig Lutz and Ryan Dohner 9th and 15th have both done Nike before, not to mention Lutz and Futsum both have gotten course records at Nike. Lukas Verzbicas, back to back Nike champion and he was the best at the time. For the girls, I'm sorry, but having Sarah Baxter, Mary Cain, Alexa Efraimson, and Wesley Frazier all in the same race just speaks for itslef. Anna Rohrer? Nobody had even heard of that girl before she ran, put up ok in track season, and no she's injured. No many of these people have done both but the point is, the decision between FL and Nike is just a decision. Most of these athletes don't know that the other athletes are going to pick.
It's not just one race. Is the Olympic Final just one race? This is the high school championship, there is only one.
Foot Locker teaches kids so much about competition and performing against the best on that given day, which is why Foot Locker has the Hall of Fame alumni that it has...
I initially felt it was fine to have the two separate championships, Footlocker for individuals, and NxN for the teams that want to go there.
What I don't like is the constant bashing of FL by Nike, which gives a really low class aura to NxN. As a result, and because Footlocker has always stayed out of the fray, keeping their focus on the kids, I like them the best.
It would be good if Nike would calm down, stop trying to make it a corporate competition, stop trying to put pressure on the kids, and let them decide for themselves. The same thing goes for the coaches.
Nike is a bunch of kids going gimme gimme gimme
Footlocker is kids who are serious about their running
podl wrote:
It's not just one race. Is the Olympic Final just one race? This is the high school championship, there is only one.
Foot Locker teaches kids so much about competition and performing against the best on that given day, which is why Foot Locker has the Hall of Fame alumni that it has...
Footlocker has the hall of fame alumni because it has been around for 40 years and at one time was the only option. That is now changing.
Like someone mentioned earlier, these kids will never race a championship xc race with only 40 kids in it. This is all for show, not prep for anything in the real world.
Not at all podl, aka nike troll, it's 40 runners so we can determine who is the best of the best, why let the fluff get in the way... The NXN meet is all about fluff, oh and of course making money from as many kids as possible, I wouldn't be surprised if NXN introduced D1 and D2 races based on school size... They want participation because they are greedy for money.. Footlocker, is the opposite, they keep it true to the sport, a true blue collar race... They avoid this typical liberal approach to sports, where everyone has to win, everyone needs a trophy, NXN does not...
John Chicago wrote:
Not at all podl, aka nike troll, it's 40 runners so we can determine who is the best of the best, why let the fluff get in the way... The NXN meet is all about fluff, oh and of course making money from as many kids as possible, I wouldn't be surprised if NXN introduced D1 and D2 races based on school size... They want participation because they are greedy for money.. Footlocker, is the opposite, they keep it true to the sport, a true blue collar race... They avoid this typical liberal approach to sports, where everyone has to win, everyone needs a trophy, NXN does not...
Are you serious? Nike flies every team (and coach) along with the individuals to Portland then puts them up in a Hotel for three nights, feeds them, gives them all free equipment and then they race a real xc race and you call that greedy. That is 400 people.
Then you have the "blue collar" race where they fly 40 boys, and 40 girls out to San Diego to run on a groomed course and put them up in a hotel on a beach. Coaches fend for themselves.
Seems to me that you have the collar colors mixed up, talk about exclusive?
When the NCAA and US Champs and the World XC meets become exclusive little 40 person fields then you will have something to fall back on, until then you have a fake race and event.
Participation numbers at the Nike and Foot Locker meets for NCAA Top-100 finishers this year is VERY similar over the last four years.
Boys -
2012 NXN: 0/2
2012 NXR: 1/2
2012 FLN: 2/2
2012 FLR: 2/2
2011 NXN: 6/13
2011 NXR: 8/13
2011 FLN: 6/13
2011 NXR: 7/13
2010 NXN: 6/28
2010 NXR: 13/28
2010 FLN: 4/28
2010 FLR: 12/28
2009 NXN: 12/59
2009 NXR: 25/59
2009 FLN: 11/59
2009 FLR: 28/59
Girls -
2012 NXN: 3/10
2012 NXR: 4/10
2012 FLN: 4/10
2012 FLR: 8/10
2011 NXN: 6/22
2011 NXR: 10/22
2011 FLN: 5/22
2011 NXR: 10/22
2010 NXN: 10/42
2010 NXR: 13/42
2010 FLN: 8/42
2010 FLR: 20/42
2009 NXN: 9/64
2009 NXR: 19/64
2009 FLN: 8/64
2009 FLR: 20/64
Boys that competed at both: 20
Boys that competed at NXN only: 15
Boys that competed at FLN only: 18
Boys that didn't compete at either: 47
Girls that competed at both: 8
Girls that competed at NXN only: 20
Girls that competed at FLN only: 24
Girls that didn't compete at either: 48
Notable: if Washington's team didn't have it's issues at the start, that probably would have been two more girls (Neale and Knight) for NXR/NXN every year.
watchout wrote:
Notable: if Washington's team didn't have it's issues at the start, that probably would have been two more girls (Neale and Knight) for NXR/NXN every year.
I'll take this part back - I just now looked at their results - that was just a bad coaching job by the UW: no real difference between what they did and the rest of the race did in the last 4k. They just took two women that might have been top-100 last year and turned them into 120+ finishers, getting beat by 20+ seconds over people they dominated last year. Good job, Metcalf, good job.