PAC 10 XC

haha wrote:

Nice to see Moussa move into top 10 and scoring 5.

yeah I have to agree with you I have been really frustrated with Moussa who is a former national high school champion in the two mile. He showed promise his freshman year but has not really lived up to his potential since then. I'm really impressed by Connor Winter who is a former multiple Colorado State High School track champion he is not really primarily a cross country runner, he is much more of a middle distance runner I was really impressed with his performance today. If a lot of the see you guys like Connor winter Morgan Pearson and Moussa all step up at nationals as CU often does I'm really wondering if they could actually upset Oklahoma State

yeahbut wrote:

[quote]Montesquieu wrote:

Except for Stinson (and who knows what's up with him), I don't think any of the guys in the top ten has a 5000m PR as good as the 13:57 that Cheserek ran almost two years ago.

So he really doesn't have to get any better to beat these guys. More a commentary on how Pac-12 quality has gone down overall.

That's a really good point, I hadn't thought about that.

For reference, in order of top 10 (outside cheserek)

Jim Rosa: 13:59i 5k, 8:10 3k

Blake Theroux: No good 5k (14:55??? I can scratch faster than that and I wouldn't be anywhere near the top 10 in Pac-12 XC), but has an 8:11i 3k to his credit. He'll be interesting to follow, seems to have broken out this season.

Connor Winter: Also no 5k of note, but has a 4:10 mile to his credit

Ben Saarel: Frosh HS stud; 4:07 & 8:49 in HS

Parker Stinson: 13:31, 28:34. Need we say more? Everyone knows Stinsons ability.

Pierce Murphy: Total XC guy. I have faster PRs than him in every track distance, but I don't come remotely close to his XC ability. Everyone also knows someone like this.

Aaron Nelson: 14:32 5k, but a very solid 8:52 steeple. One of the better PRs on the list.

Amar Moussa: 14:05 5k, 8:49 3200.

Mac Fleet: Obviously a Mid-D stud w/ a 3:57 mile but has range, I would be curious to see him try out a 3k or 5k. 23:46 over 8k, no slouch at all.

It's pretty apparent that Cheserek is and probably was NCAA all-american talent for the last couple years.

actually Connor Winter has run the 1500 meter equivalent of a 4:01 mile

A Duck wrote:

My biggest impression of XC so far this year is seeing how well Mr. Fleet is getting after it. Total props and respect for an NCAA 1500m champ putting his love and guts into XC as hard as he is.

Second this. I hope he makes it through to track season without an injury. I was actually more impressed with Oregon than with Colorado. Not to take anything away from CU. Great team, great coaching, they probably would have won anywhere. I've run that course though, and I'm all for tough cross country courses, but it's a little much and those guys know just how to run it. No one had the slightest chance of taking Colorado down. I was expecting Stanford and Oregon to be closer in the scores. The course ate up that last couple Stanford guys and the Ducks muscled through it. Oregon ran tough as hell to finish where they did.

yeahbut wrote:

Montesquieu wrote:

Given Cheserek's relative lack of improvement toward the end of his high school career one had to have doubts about how he would do in college. But he has eviscerated such doubts. He looks to me to have slimmed down appreciably from last year. Does anyone know whether this is true? "A Duck", can you weigh in here?

Except for Stinson (and who knows what's up with him), I don't think any of the guys in the top ten has a 5000m PR as good as the 13:57 that Cheserek ran almost two years ago.

So he really doesn't have to get any better to beat these guys. More a commentary on how Pac-12 quality has gone down overall.

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Jeramy Elkaim, 13:38 in the spring.

Obviously, 5K track times don't necessarily correlate too well with X-C times.

My understanding was that Cheserek took off his high school senior year to focus on grades and college entrance exams. If that was the case, he naturally wouldn't show improvement during a year when he wasn't running. In any event, he is looking very good as an Oregon Duck this year.

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If McGorty'd been able to keep it together for the last 2K (which I think he will at normal altitude), Stanford would've beaten Oregon today.

Just sayin,' it's not a foregone conclusion.

Chess A Wreck wrote:

My understanding was that Cheserek took off his high school senior year to focus on grades and college entrance exams. If that was the case, he naturally wouldn't show improvement during a year when he wasn't running. In any event, he is looking very good as an Oregon Duck this year.

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No, he just refrained from competing in X-C for 6 weeks or so.

Still won FL, again, without much trouble, blowing away from McGorty and Leingang in the last 400.

So I don't know if that had much to do with anything.

But, yeah, the people who didn't think he would be a big force in college really didn't know anything about the kid, and probably haven't watched him run much.

Jim Rose is lights out this year. Is brother Joe injured?

retr wrote:

actually Connor Winter has run the 1500 meter equivalent of a 4:01 mile

Ah good to know, I just scanned their bio pages quickly I must have missed that. Obviously very, very impressive, but mid-d guys have wildly different success rates when it comes to XC, so its not someone who I would expect to beak Cheserek.

30:45X-C1978 wrote:

Jim Rose is lights out this year. Is brother Joe injured?

It looks like it, he hasnt run a single race this season. Has he redshirted before?

sp2 wrote:

yeahbut wrote:

Except for Stinson (and who knows what's up with him), I don't think any of the guys in the top ten has a 5000m PR as good as the 13:57 that Cheserek ran almost two years ago.

So he really doesn't have to get any better to beat these guys. More a commentary on how Pac-12 quality has gone down overall.

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Jeramy Elkaim, 13:38 in the spring.

Obviously, 5K track times don't necessarily correlate too well with X-C times.

The original comment was about the top ten finishers in the race, which didn't include Elkaim, who was way back in 65th.

5000m track times should actually be an excellent indicator of NCAA cross country ability, unless you're talking about a true miler for whom 5000m is already pushing the top of his range. Stinson and ELkaim don't have that excuse.

fyi, yesterday's PAc 12 meet was not run on the Buffalo Ranch course. It was a new course set up on the Coal Creek golf course. It was 100% manicured grass with just a few rollers. Weather was dead calm, blue sky, perfect shirt sleeve temperature. Definitely Rupp certifiable.

home course wrote:

fyi, yesterday's PAc 12 meet was not run on the Buffalo Ranch course. It was a new course set up on the Coal Creek golf course. It was 100% manicured grass with just a few rollers. Weather was dead calm, blue sky, perfect shirt sleeve temperature. Definitely Rupp certifiable.

Second this. Texas Toast is way off. Except for a few small hills, it was flat as a billiard table. Not a tough course at all.

3434 wrote:

home course wrote:

fyi, yesterday's PAc 12 meet was not run on the Buffalo Ranch course. It was a new course set up on the Coal Creek golf course. It was 100% manicured grass with just a few rollers. Weather was dead calm, blue sky, perfect shirt sleeve temperature. Definitely Rupp certifiable.

Second this. Texas Toast is way off. Except for a few small hills, it was flat as a billiard table. Not a tough course at all.

That certainly does make me way off. Sorry.

Totally agree, great comments.

CU, great coaching, great athletes. And XC is really where a team can have a home course advantage.

Used to get schooled a lot in high school by a rival team who had their course mastered. Eventually I figured out how to run that course... XC rocks!

30:45X-C1978 wrote:

Jim Rose is lights out this year. Is brother Joe injured?

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Joe Rosa was injured in the late spring.

No word about it all summer.

Lately, some comments from Milty, and a couple other pieces of random info, have strongly implied that Joe has been training well, and coming back strong, and isn't quite ready yet, but hopes to be able to contribute by the end of the season.

I'd guess there's a good chance we'll see him at Regionals.

He came back in rather stunning fashion after a long absence in his senior year of high school.

I have no idea what to expect this time, but if he can be back at 90 or 95% of form by Nats, I think Stanford could be a top 5 team.

sp2 wrote:

30:45X-C1978 wrote:

Jim Rose is lights out this year. Is brother Joe injured?

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Joe Rosa was injured in the late spring.

No word about it all summer.

Lately, some comments from Milty, and a couple other pieces of random info, have strongly implied that Joe has been training well, and coming back strong, and isn't quite ready yet, but hopes to be able to contribute by the end of the season.

I'd guess there's a good chance we'll see him at Regionals.

He came back in rather stunning fashion after a long absence in his senior year of high school.

I have no idea what to expect this time, but if he can be back at 90 or 95% of form by Nats, I think Stanford could be a top 5 team.

Thanks for the update, I was wondering about this.

Dont understand what happened to the last few guys on Stanford's team? 27 mid for sub 4:10 milers…

These PRs are way off.

Theroux was All-American last XC season and ran 8:49 in the steeple last spring.

Saarel has run 4:02

Moussa has run 13:57

And Murphy has a track 10k PR faster than Rosa. I doubt you have run 29:36 for 10k

Nelson is clearly the one having the breakout season, as being a good Steepler doesn't necessarily translate to being a good cross runner, ie Seddon of FSU.

Expect much faster track PRs out of Nelson this upcoming year.