Ryan Hall Excuses

bootsie wrote:

mammoth track club wrote:

Ryan hall is the best US marathon ever.

No. Frank Shorter is. Two olympic medals.

No. Joanie is. OGold and WR and longevity and more wins.

the real JB-S wrote:

No. Joanie is. OGold and WR and longevity and more wins.

Joanie is a woman. She cannot be put into consideration.

Beep

I think Hall ran a good race. I could tell the heat was getting to everybody, including Mosop. Hall beat Cheruiyot and Dos Santos must've DNF. It was a tough race and it seems that yet another "better-than-anybody-born-in-the-USA" marathon isn't good enough for our larger-assed fans.

It's great we have an American running with the Africans, and if Hall doesn't win, I can live with that.

Ryan - great run! If they're picking on you it's only cuz there's nobody else even close to you. That will be apparent at the trials.

The modern day running publications would never do such a thing to Hall, but back in the day (1968) Australian newspapers savaged long distance legend Ron Clarke for coming up short on Olympic gold.

Headlines the following day after his near death at the Olympic 10k read blared: "Clarke Fails Again".

Ouch!

He wouldn’t make the first hundred in Kenya’s national team.

ChiBobs wrote:

[

mammoth track club wrote:

Ryan hall is the best US marathon ever.

No. Frank Shorter is. Two olympic medals.

against lesser competition.[/quote]

No, he won against the best of his era. Just like Bill Rodgers did, just like Lasse Viren did, Emil Zatopek etc.

You cannot compare eras, my guess is that the best of that era would compete against the best of this era. Things are differnet now, training, nutrition, drugs etc., the best would still be the best.

Bottom line is, Hall is not a winner, Shorter was a winner, Rodgers was a winner, they would have gotten it done.

i absolutely disagree with your logic.

the training is the same. when we went away from the '70s training, we sucked, and now that we're getting back to that, we're starting to do ok.

nutrition has gotten worse if anything. just because guys like shorter and rogers ate like crap doesn't mean runners today have any advantage. they're just doing what the older guys should have done.

in technology-linked sports like cycling (new bikes) or swimming (new suits), i would say you can't compare eras, but the roads have been made out of the same stuff for decades.

the drugs thing, i'll give you... but someone like ryan hall is probably the least likely person in american sports to be doping, IMHO.

Ryan Hall doesn't need to be bashed, I think the results speak for themselves.

Hall's a great guy not just because he's the US marathon hope but because he's not afraid to live what he believes and coach himself.

That said, the guy needs a win!

When he leverages his chances at winning big on just two Marathons a year, I would expect better performances. Maybe this is because the competition from East Africans is just too strong?

Sometimes it's as though he doesn't display that fighting spirit, like he doesn't want to win?

Im a fat*ss who runs at a 9 minute mile pace. Ryan Hall sucks! hahahaha, that made me feel a little more powerful and special!

ttc wrote:

Hall's shown to be a 2:05, 2:06 guy on fast courses, who could hang with Mosop on a day like today. Finishing mins behind in 2:08 is good, but not typical Hall. And when racing only 2 marathons/year, you'd better believe we're going to hang onto the effort and wonder what's going on. Or do you need tutoring that 2:08 on a fast course is very unlike Hall?

Sadly, it's clear that you believe this crap.

When has Hall proven to be a 2:05 guy on a fast, *legal* course? His PR is 2:16:17 and that was in much better weather, and in an event in which he had company for more of the race. And as far as hanging with Mosop goes, Hall was almost two minutes behind him at Boston (Mosop's debut) and less than 2 1/2 minutes behind him today, in warmer weather, which virtually always affects East African marathoners less than it does others. And Hall moved up from about 13th at halfway -- 11th if you neglect the pacesetters -- to 5th at the finish. These are the earmarks of a bad day?

I think what's more disturbing is your obvious belief that Hall, and probably everyone else you babble about on this board, owes you something. When I was a kid, I was an avid Red Sox fan, to the point at which I'd yell at the TV when they lost and wish ill on the other teams' players. Thing is, I quit doing that when I was maybe 10 or 11. I still follow the team's fortunes, but I'm leery of grown men who retain the rabid need to invest themselves in the doings of professional athletes. Do you fight with your wife or roommates over which cartoons to watch on Saturday mornings too?

It's one thing to be interested, but another to be so blindly committed and bluntly adversarial, especially when you seem to not have the slightest grasp on what's even going on.

wodka wrote:

Are you really that gullible?

In general, no, but unfortunately those quotes sounded much more plausible than they should for a runner of Hall's capability.

nope not at all wrote:

i absolutely disagree with your logic.

the training is the same. when we went away from the '70s training, we sucked, and now that we're getting back to that, we're starting to do ok.

nutrition has gotten worse if anything. just because guys like shorter and rogers ate like crap doesn't mean runners today have any advantage. they're just doing what the older guys should have done.

in technology-linked sports like cycling (new bikes) or swimming (new suits), i would say you can't compare eras, but the roads have been made out of the same stuff for decades.

the drugs thing, i'll give you... but someone like ryan hall is probably the least likely person in american sports to be doping, IMHO.

You obviosly weren't around in those days. You trained when and where you could back then, with whoever you could train with. There was no Daniels running formula, you did what worked for you, there was no science behind it. There was also no big time shoe company support, guys got paid, but it was under the table, no nutrionists, no strength coaches, no training groups.

Yes, people ate like crap and shouldn't have, but there was no evidence back then or interest in what should be eaten or shouldn't be. Why would anybody do anything different if they didn't think or know that it mattered. We drank beer as a recovery drink, you have seen Ryan hall with all his supplements. Don't tell me it's not different, it's all different.

You are right that people are going back to what worked way back, hard work and miles. But, with all the recovery aids out there now, just imagine what talented guys like, Rodgers and Sgorter would have done?

fold art wrote:

Does anyone know who is the Official Deepdish Pizza sponsor of the Chicago Marathon?

No, but I can guarantee that Abe Froman supplied the sausage on said pizza.

I'd love to see you wear the same shoes Shorter wear in his marathons and come even within a minute of your 10k pr on the roads. Things have changed, we have many advantages that didn't exist back then.

nope not at all wrote:

i absolutely disagree with your logic.

the training is the same. when we went away from the '70s training, we sucked, and now that we're getting back to that, we're starting to do ok.

nutrition has gotten worse if anything. just because guys like shorter and rogers ate like crap doesn't mean runners today have any advantage. they're just doing what the older guys should have done.

in technology-linked sports like cycling (new bikes) or swimming (new suits), i would say you can't compare eras, but the roads have been made out of the same stuff for decades.

the drugs thing, i'll give you... but someone like ryan hall is probably the least likely person in american sports to be doping, IMHO.

Wow Unbelievable wrote:

Hall did okay. It's hardly a "disaster." He ended up berating half of the guys in the lead pack. He's got another race to do in January. He's consistent now, he's not bombing out anymore. He'll probably win the Trials by at least two minutes.

This has got to be the problem right here. If he didnt spend so much time yelling at the rest of the lead pack he would have saved a lot of energy and been right there with the leaders to the end. What was he thinking?

Normally I dont post on typos obv but that was a funny one. I have an image of Hall screaming at Mosop and/or Korir- possibly about God. Maybe pulling out some literature and trying to get them to see the error of their ways.

Herman Cain?

fold art wrote:

Does anyone know who is the Official Deepdish Pizza sponsor of the Chicago Marathon?

hannsen wrote:

If he didnt spend so much time yelling at the rest of the lead pack he would have saved a lot of energy and been right there with the leaders to the end. What was he thinking?

Normally I dont post on typos obv but that was a funny one. I have an image of Hall screaming at Mosop and/or Korir- possibly about God. Maybe pulling out some literature and trying to get them to see the error of their ways.

Yeah, I liked this one too. I can see him losing it late in the race in an endorphin/low-glycogen storm and screaming about the whore of Babylon (who may well live on the South Side), and being joined every block by a new street preacher in a trench coat who manages to run 4:50 pace for half a block before turning over the job to the next bellowing nut. The Pied Piper meets Forrest Gump meets too much MD 20/20.

I'm not Scotty - just set that straight right now. No need to bring that kid into it...just a guy from CO.

My point with the excuses is that every year basically Hall comes in and says how he killed such and such a workout and is going for such and such a time.

However when the real racing starts, he never takes part. In the Majors he runs 13-16 miles with the leaders and when they start dropping 4:3x he just goes along at his pace like he's following a 16 week program that advocates even pacing.

We can debate who is the best, but give me a guy like Salazar who even if he lost and he lost quite a bit on the international level, put himself out there

Boy, Shorter and Rogers had it so much more easy. They would win these races in 2:12. Those guys never had to face sub 2:06 marathoners.