Red Arrow is right. Coe said in an interview the week before Florence that he was just finishing off a heavy period of training, but that he had a lot of speed work to put in over the course of the summer. His season was aimed to peak at the end of August with a planned clash with Ovett over the MIle (in Brussels) and the World Cup 800m in Rome.
ventolin^3 wrote:
Red Arrow wrote:Rubbish! He ran at least 1.5m extra running wide on the curve after the bell. That's worth 0.2drivel
if he'd run whole of curve in 2nd lap, that wouda given him 3.8m extra
he did a slight swerve around billy at start of curve
it's nonsense to believe that was 40% of distance run entirely in lane 2
try less than 1m at most & that is less than 0.1s extra
The video shows he runs wide on the line with lane 2 for approx. 6 seconds. Over a 200m stretch of 25.1, thats 47m, not a "slight swerve".
If running just outside that line for the entire curve is worth 3.8m, then running where he did for the entire bend would be c. 3m extra.
So 47/100 x 3 = 1.41m.
101.73 / 801.41 = 01269 x 800m = 1:41.55....there's your 0.2
ventolin^3 wrote:
kip ran a solo 1'42.67 in March !!!
anyone with a brain realises that was worth a low-1'41 outdoors & close, if not as good as his outdoor wrs later in year
Kipketer's run came at the peak end of an indoor season culminating in a World Championships. This financially lucrative scene with the kudos of being a world champion was not an option in the early 80's. Kipketer had a reason to be in near peak form in March, Coe would not have had such a reason.
ventolin^3 wrote:
It wasn't a world record attempt. His father/coach didn't go with him and they were anticipating a 1:43. If he was in WR shape his father would have gone to Florence with himwhat the hell does his dad have anything to do with him running on the track ??
does brother colm go to every wr attempt that his charge ,rudisha, runs ???
what exactly was his dad going to do for coe whilst he is running his race ??
Arrow's premise that Florence was not a WR attempt is backed up in Coe's biography, which also underlines the fact that Peter Coe always went with son to WR attempt races. P.139 states;
David Miller, ' Before Seb flew to Italy, he called me & discussed his prospects, having already spoken to Peter. I wanted to know if there was the slightest chance of a RECORD ATTEMPT being "on". If so, I would be on the next plane. Just as he had told Peter, he now said to me that he thought the probability slight enough for me not to bother-...'
Coe adds, ' I'd WOUND DOWN my training a bit, I was doing the hard-core endurance stuff,... I knew I was in good shape from the 1:44.06 the previous week, but that was all. I arrived at Pisa.....to Florence, with the temperature up in the 90's. I don't know if it was the prelude to being ill the following week, but I had a very severe headache before the race. It was so hot that all I could do the day of the race was drink bottled water & try to sleep. Peter & I reckoned that it would be a good warm-up of around 1:43 and we were looking for a "safe" run in a warm climate'
Surely one can take at least another 0.5 secs off Coe's time for feeling unwell and the hot weather, as you are want to do for Ryun's 1:44.3? ;0)
Coe also stated in an interview at the end of July that year;
'Although the season started well with that 800m & 1000m world records, the REAL PEAK of the summer will come in late August & early September, with the Europa Cup final, and then the World Cup in Rome, plus big international meetings in Zurich, and possibly Brussels'
So the fact he wasn't in peak form comes straight from the horse's mouth. The scene then didn't have the requisite rabbit running 49 secs in every European meet, let alone one's own personal rabbit that travels. It wasn't the trend to carry on running endless fast times, as the main aim was to win races. Coe ran few 800s after that WR until the Europa & World Cups, and someone already 1.71 secs faster than anyone else in history had little incentive to try and better that time for the rest of the season. If he knew what was in store for him in 82 & 83, then I'm sure he'd have had a few more shots at it and lowered it further.
ventolin^3 wrote:
Neither Kip nor Rudisha have ever run that fast in Junenonsense
look at kip above
i also keep telling you that kaki ran 1'42.2pb 6/7 earlier in june than coe & told you then he won't beat that again in the season
in fact he has never beaten it
Kaki's 1:42.23 in June was run behind 700m+ pacing and drafting from Rudisha in front of him!!
Take that 2nd lap drafting away and he'd have been more like 1:43.0 at the finish. OR, put another way, if Coe had had that pacing/drafting to 700m, then his time would have been 1:41.0
ventolin^3 wrote:
They were always faster by Aug, Sept, with repeated "fast, paced runs" over the distance. They get better throughout the season and both needed several attempts before they got the WRnonsense
wohlhuter ran 800wr of 1'43.5 2/7 before coe june date
snell ran 1'44.3wr in february !!!
ryun ran 1'44.3wr on same day in june as coe
Wohlhuter was a big player on the US scene which started in April. The Europeans didn't get into their stride until June.
Wohlhuter ran most of his fastest times each season in May & June. In fact his 1st, 2nd, 4th, 9th, 10th, 11th & 12th best times for 800m were all run in May or June.
Snell's HT 1:44.3 (worth more like 1:44.5 electronically) is the best part of 3 secs slower than Coe. February is the height of summer in the Southern hemisphere and athletes from that part of the world, who sometimes didn't even travel to Europe for the Summer, were going to be peaking at that time back home.
As for Ryun's HT 1:44.3, I refer to Wohlhuter above. I would also add, "How many more 800's did he run that year? He ran a 3:51.3 Mile WR in July, which is probably slightly superior to his 800 run. Whose to say he wouldn't have run a faster 800 had he concentrated on it in August!?
ventolin^3 wrote:
it was because 3'48.5 was a sub-standard time, worth only ~ mid-3'31 with 1.08 conversion
he was worth easily 3'30 shape that year & a time of at worst 3'47 expected
No, he was in 3:28 form that year, shown from his solo 3:31 with bad pacing in July. The reason for the dramatic improvement between Zurich & Brussels was due to the fact he hadn't run the sort of tempo needed at that distance for about 5 weeks. He hadn't run any 1500s or Miles since Stockholm and was just out of practise running at that rhythm. He got that in Zurich and so he was better prepared for the effort in Brussels.