Why didn't he stay in lane 1? He could have come up right behind boraz and the kaki and saved all the ground. he was in lane 1 or on the line between 1 and 2 and there was really nobody in front of him at the turn with 100m to go that would have really blocked him.
"those 2 have never run an elite 800 race in their life"
If they were 800 runners, obviously.
Wheeeeeeeeeeee!!! wrote:
Sprint Geezer wrote:And "armchair coaching", that was funny.
From exactly what vantage point do you think Symmonds' coach watches tape?
That's not the point and you know it. You usually come off as a reasonable and intelligent poster, don't ruin it with comments like that.
Yes, I know it. I just didn't realize that anybody believed that I had any sort of a worthwhile posting standard to maintain.
ukathleticscoach wrote:
'To do so would have meant kicking from 150-160 meters out which also would have cost me the'
No. I agree with sprint geezer he should have gone at this point and run wide round the turn
He didn't run badly but I would have took the chance if I had his ability
He didn't fail in the courage department, he just thought it would work out that he would have an opening later. He doesn't mean 'I knew my only chance was to go then, but I thought it would likely fail so I didn't bother.' He means 'I had a shot then, and in hindsight it was my only shot, but at the time it looked like such a likely-to-fail shot that I didn't take it.' You guys need to learn to listen/read. He says now that in 20/20 hindsight he'd take that shot. It's a lesson he's learned--remember, this is the first championship 800 he's really been in contention for that late in the game. He's learned the lesson that on that stage, sometimes you just have to make a huge risk. It's not that he lacked the courage this morning, just that he didn't yet know enough to know when to exercise it. His mindset is perfect, I don't know what you want him to say. His mentality is precisely why Americans will be winning medals, he's thoughtfully self-aware and self-critical, he recognizes how the race is run, how other people run it, he learned the final important lesson today that CHANCE plays a massive role in these races and so when he gets a chance, even if it looks like a sub-50% chance, he's gotta take it, because chances are chance ain't gonna favor him again in the race. That interview was great, if Alan Webb has Symmonds' mind he would already have a couple of global titles and be threatening the WR, instead of a mentally destroyed shell. Symmonds is going to roll next year. Let's go d3!
Sprint Geezer wrote:"those 2 have never run an elite 800 race in their life"
If they were 800 runners, obviously.
drivel
we are not talking ovett-like tactical acumen on the parts of these 2
- montsho was best gal in the race - she ran a poor tactical race, but instinctively reacting to felix, won, but less than by what she shoud have
- james ran nothing wonderful tactically - he has no discernible 200 speed to talk of & just had to hope he wasn't 8 - 10m behind lashawn into the stretch
he got lucky lashawn didn't run a harder 300 - having been been the low-altitude 300m wr holder until 1y ago, he shouda been thinking 8 - 10m lead, but as he acknowledged after, he "executed poorly"
only an idiot woud believe these 2 ran any tactically remarkable races & only a complete moron woud project this to 800...
My take too.
Symmonds may have made a tactical error but he was still "there". It just didn't go this time.
AOler wrote:
You sound jealous.
Look, kid, not everyone is smart enough to do an analysis. Just accept it and move on to your next Facebook game. No point in wastin' time here on LR. OR maybe you are just a whiny Tea Partier who does not like criticisms of Americans. Grow up kiddo!
You're cute.
Sprint Geezer wrote:
I really don't know why people are saying that the US is sucking.
The US is on top of BOTH the medal table and the placing table right now, with strong US events yet to come.
If you want to look at a country that really is sucking, look at China--5th in both the medal and placing tables, with only 2 medals so far, yet over a billion people.
Or even worse, India.
The US is still pretty great, but is seeming less and less great all the time.
And "armchair coaching", that was funny.
From exactly what vantage point do you think Symmonds' coach watches tape?
I also agree with Sprint Geeser. you had to go there. Why would that have wrecked Symmond's race to go at 200m out? Sometimes Nick has to get more out of his comfort zone. Kaki and Bores got medals because they kicked earlier and had more guts.
Sprintgeesery wrote:
Kaki and Bores got medals because they kicked earlier and had more guts.
Or maybe because they are far superior 800 runners than Nick Symmonds.
Incisive Chinese analyst wrote:
U remind me of my neighbor kid. He dont try very hard at playing piano. When his parents tell to him why he doesn't practise as hard as two of his other classmates, he just say that he is not as good as them. Without even trying! Not to mention he is an American. My kid? I raised her to be the best. She practises piano every day for 2 hours and on weekend for 4 hours. Only then she gets to play. Result? She is the best piano player in her school.
Moral of story? You are just making weak excuses for weak American like Symmonds. He didn't even try his best. Shame on him and his appologists like you.!
China great honorable nation. Communism superior democracy, as evidenced america more crime. Weak social order lead inevitable America downfall, great honorable China rise up the world.
betterbutter wrote:
Why didn't he stay in lane 1? He could have come up right behind boraz and the kaki and saved all the ground. he was in lane 1 or on the line between 1 and 2 and there was really nobody in front of him at the turn with 100m to go that would have really blocked him.
This is a good point. you have to know that it is Kaki in front of you. If Kaki is in front of you, stay behind him...don't go to lane 3.
nick is a great runner and I like his chances in London next year, but he needs to believe in himself a little more and follow Kaki and the Russian, rather than wait for the two poles to pass him before pulling out with 80 to go. The Polish runner who beat him, started kicking about 130 out and was strong enough to hold him off. Nick said he was in perfect position with 200 to go. If he wants a medal, he can't allow 2 to pass him at the 180 mark.
jimjamesrunner wrote:
While I hate to agree with Sprint Geezer, the only way to race when it comes down to the final laps or half a lap of a race is to REACT, not to THINK.
He is thinking AFTER the race, explaining his reactions. Of course he wasn't going through all of this in his head during the race: the video itself was longer than the race!
Incisive Chinese analyst wrote:
I know my English is not perfect but that's all you have? Makeing fun of other peoples languages? How's your Chinese? Or any other second language? Hahaha.
But you avoided replying to my point. You are just weak American makeing weak excuses for weak runners. You are not a good role model for the inspiring young runners here on LR.
I wasn't making fun of your english, I was making fun of propaganda-esque statements like "You are just weak American."
If he was visualizing how to beat Rudisha, then WTH wasn't he running close to him instead of dropping towards the back as usual?
Retardo Montalban wrote:
If he was visualizing how to beat Rudisha, then WTH wasn't he running close to him instead of dropping towards the back as usual?
Somehow I don't think going out in 23.x with the world record holder would have ended well for Symmonds.
Well then he should have been visualizing his own race, not one of beating Rudisha.
Retardo Montalban wrote:
Well then he should have been visualizing his own race, not one of beating Rudisha.
His only chance at beating Rudisha would be if Rudisha blew up and came back to him, so for all you know he might have been doing both.
I agree. But he needs to make a stronger move from 300-400m. That's where he can have an advantage - letting the leaders go too fast for the first 200 and then catching back up to them by 400. He can be right on their asses using less energy through efficient splits.
He shouldn't be last at the bell.
It wasn't his "shot". NOT getting boxed in doesn't mean that he would have medalled--but GETTING boxed in definitely meant that he would NOT medal.
Allowing himself to get boxed in WAS his "shot" at not medalling, and he took it.
Plus, even if your interpretation of "what he really means" is accurate, any observation like "at the time it looked like such a likely-to-fail shot that I didn't take it" is the very definition of the lack of courage I was talking about.
"It's not that he lacked the courage this morning, just that he didn't yet know enough to know when to exercise it."
You don't "exercise" courage, you implement strategy by "exercising" tactics. Courage is there all the time, it manifests at all moments. You suppress courage with mental exercise. Courage happens only when your actions are bigger than your self, when you lose your sense of self to the bigger situation. That can be uncomfortable for people, and that is what courage is--the ability to let go.
That is why great performances are described by their performers as effortless, that is why Montsho was up and waving while Felix was on the ground sucking wind, that's why Bolt said he could go right back and run 9.69 again, that's why they often don't remember exactly what happened.
Symmonds knows exactly what I'm talking about, no doubt he's had this at other points in his career.
I think he's run enough high-level meets, though, to have it in a championships final, and have learned already long ago that "CHANCE plays a massive role in these races".
Unless he's Rudisha, which he's not.
asedas wrote:
I agree. But he needs to make a stronger move from 300-400m. That's where he can have an advantage - letting the leaders go too fast for the first 200 and then catching back up to them by 400. He can be right on their asses using less energy through efficient splits.
He shouldn't be last at the bell.
You may be right, but I still wonder how he could have been better placed with 250 to go. He was behind Rudisha and Borza, right on the outside of Kaki. Right on their asses, like you said. His mistake was letting people pass him after that point.