Gray's 600 WR indicates he was definitely capable of some special things.
http://www.alltime-athletics.com/m_600ok.htm
Maybe 600 was his optimal distance?
Gray's 600 WR indicates he was definitely capable of some special things.
http://www.alltime-athletics.com/m_600ok.htm
Maybe 600 was his optimal distance?
UncleB wrote:
Bronze Medal 1992 Olympics.
Olympic Games finalist in 1996. Perhaps in 1984 and/or 1988 as well.
God knows how many US titles.
Not bad for a guy who "kind of fell apart under pressure"
Fair statement. I always considered JG a talent on par with Cruz, Coe and Ovett, but was disappointed with his performance on the world stage. Was he great? Absolutely. Did he perform up to his potential? Perhaps not. I distinctly remember yelling at the television at during some WC when I he blew up and kind of gave up in the last 100m.
I wouldn't read too much into that list since the event isn't really contested much but Gray and Everett are on my list of guys that would be a lot more famous if they ran the 600 instead of the 800m
MarathonMind wrote:
Gray's 600 WR indicates he was definitely capable of some special things.
http://www.alltime-athletics.com/m_600ok.htmMaybe 600 was his optimal distance?
altoroad wrote:
I'm not sure why Jim Ryun would come to mind, except that he was apparently well before your time. Ryun broke the world record in the mile twice, and won a silver medal in the 1968 1,500 in an incredible race.
Because Ryun didn't run up to his potential. Did you read the title of the thread? Then did you actually think about the guy's post?
MarathonMind wrote:
Gray's 600 WR indicates he was definitely capable of some special things.
http://www.alltime-athletics.com/m_600ok.htmMaybe 600 was his optimal distance?
What are you saying? That Gray was capable of doing special things at 600 meters? He was "special" at that distance. And if that was his "optimal distance," surely he ran to his full potential at 800 meters. Your assessment of Gray applies even better to Martin McGrady, who was "special" at 600 yards, but mediocre at 880 yards.
briannichols wrote:
Looking back at numerous runners, peculiar circumstances (e.g., injuries, poor racing tactics, untimely death, etc.) made you wonder if they ever performed to their full abilities. Jim Ryun and Steve Prefontaine immediately come to mind.
Why Prefontaine? At the age of 21, he ran the 5k in 13:22 and the 2 mile in 8:19. At 23, he ran the 5k in 13:21 and the 2 mile in 8:18. He had reached a plateau and was unlikely to improve dramatically beyond where he already was.
Never went out in 48? This video must be a trick then.
Yeah, Wilson K. only went out in 48.10, finished in 1:41.26.
An interesting way of looking at this would be: Take the fast male and female runners from any single High School. Have each of them run 400m at their seasonal best. At almost every single school, Wilson K. would beat the male to 400m, then "hang on" to finish ahead of the female.
Jumpin Joey wrote:
Why Prefontaine? At the age of 21, he ran the 5k in 13:22 and the 2 mile in 8:19. At 23, he ran the 5k in 13:21 and the 2 mile in 8:18. He had reached a plateau and was unlikely to improve dramatically beyond where he already was.
His early death and late evolution of racing tactics makes me wonder. But fair point.
MarathonMind wrote:
Gray's 600 WR indicates he was definitely capable of some special things.
http://www.alltime-athletics.com/m_600ok.htmMaybe 600 was his optimal distance?
I was surprised to see Lee Evans on that list. He really dies in that last 200!
I am sure occasionally people went out <50 prior to Earl Jones, but it was unusual, and oft noted.
The difference w/ EJ was, he did it in just about every race, even Eastern Michigan dual meets (maybe apochryphal)
He changed the way people thought about the event. Johnny Gray was one of the first athletes to adopt this racing style, and was very successful with it.
The fastest I ever remember James Robinson going out in was 51.X high. 52/53 was how people thought you should run the 800 - Dave Wottle being the apotheosis of even splits.
Jones, Gray, Marshall, Robinson, Paige, Mack, (Everett?). It was a unique time in US 800 running, and has not really been repeated since.
Regardless of which side of this question you fall on, it was a fair question and one that has produced a great thread.Looking back on a golden era of the 800m and some phenomenal runners, is the highlight of my day so far.Now, who wasted more races using their running particular style: Johnny Gray or Mark Everett?
crazykyle26 wrote:
Who knows if the man ran to his full potential. Who knows if any runner has really run to their full potential and could've run faster in whatever event they set they're PR or NR or WR in. What I do know is that Johnny Gray did something not many others have. He had such a long career that was pretty consistent and he seemed to always be able to run fast from race to race and year to year. It wasn't like he only came out and ran fast at a big meet. He showed up and gave people what they payed to see. He also had a lot of balls to run the way he did and I truly respect his flat out from the gun running style. Not many other people have to courage to do that.
I am saying that Gray might have been able to run a faster 800.
I trained with Earl Jones every day for 2 years. Going out in 50-51 was what I did and I was always behind. earl went out in 49 with ease and at one US Olympic Trials he went out in 48.4 and still ran 1:44
And I see in the youtube videos that Wilson K for his 1:41.11 went out in 49 flat and came back in 52.1
Unreal. Still, interesting that going out in 48.1 got him a slightly slower time.
The 800 is a unique event- I think the folks who run it well are on another plane altogether. And think about it- if not for WK, Coe would STILL be the WR holder, and as it is there are only 2 performances better than his. And I notice on the video of Coe's WR that he even had to go wide to pass the leader on the 3rd turn.
does anyone run to their full potential?
Didn't JG win Millrose at 39 or 40? Only a handful of runners have had successful careers as long as he did.
I would go far to the otherside ... Gray hit (or came very close to) his potential because he went hard from the gun and pushed his limits. The runner who I believe isn't hitting his potential is Yuriy Borza_____.
he could have run 1:38 if he trained harder. all he had to do is put in more miles, maybe 200 MPW. thats everyones solution on this site.
Under 1:45 14 straight years and only Amrican under 1:43 and he did it in 4 different years.
Olympic medalist.
No Gold but that's pretty close to running up to his full potential.