Sounds like cheat'in to me. Try to keep it on the down low Matt.
Sounds like cheat'in to me. Try to keep it on the down low Matt.
Ok, I got quite a chuckle reading this thread and I figured I'd put in my .02. Let me be perfectly clear: I HAVE NEVER USED ILLEGAL PERFORMANCE ENHANCING DRUGS, PERIOD, NEVER.
Now excuse me while I train my way to a sub 13.
Matt
so if it isn't technically "ILLEGAL" but only being scrutinized by the WADA, then it must be just fine to use - BALCO's THG was not technically "ILLEGAL" either.
M. Tegenkamp wrote:
Ok, I got quite a chuckle reading this thread and I figured I'd put in my .02. Let me be perfectly clear: I HAVE NEVER USED ILLEGAL PERFORMANCE ENHANCING DRUGS, PERIOD, NEVER.
Now excuse me while I train my way to a sub 13.
Matt
This info is a bit disapointing. When we get to the point where we are spinning down our own blood into serum and then re-injecting it to boost recovery sounds like its flirting with the cheating.
Seems like an open mouth, insert food moment to me.
My final post of the night.
ABSTRACT
In recent years there have been rapid developments in the use of growth factors for accelerated healing of injury. Growth factors have been used in maxillo-facial and plastic surgery with success and the technology is now being developed for orthopaedics and sports medicine applications. Growth factors mediate the biological processes necessary for repair of soft tissues such as muscle, tendon and ligament following acute traumatic or overuse injury, and animal studies have demonstrated clear benefits in terms of accelerated healing. There are various ways of delivering higher doses of growth factors to injured tissue, but each has in common a reliance on release of growth factors from blood platelets. Platelets contain growth factors in their {alpha}-granules (insulin-like growth factor-1, basic fibroblast growth factor, platelet-derived growth factor, epidermal growth factor, vascular endothelial growth factor, transforming growth factor-β1) and these are released upon injection at the site of an injury. Three commonly utilised techniques are known as platelet-rich plasma, autologous blood injections and autologous conditioned serum. Each of these techniques has been studied clinically in humans to a very limited degree so far, but results are promising in terms of earlier return to play following muscle and particularly tendon injury. The use of growth factors in sports medicine is restricted under the terms of the World Anti-Doping Agency (WADA) anti-doping code, particularly because of concerns regarding the insulin-like growth factor-1 content of such preparations, and the potential for abuse as performance-enhancing agents. The basic science and clinical trials related to the technology are reviewed, and the use of such agents in relation to the WADA code is discussed.
well.. from what Im reading.. looks like most tennis players.. along with Tiger woods, have used this form of "recovery" from tendonitis.
Maybe its not as bad as it sounds
More Quackery - Sorry, couldn't let it go.
See the following.
Read the entire article - it is a very good read, but it concludes with the following:
The use of the TUE may assist in development of acceptable protocols and indications for use of autologous blood products in the elite athlete. Physicians should be encouraged to apply for TUE’s in order to assist
WADA in responding appropriately to the ongoing challenge that advances in technology presents. I agree with John Hoberman when he states “…it is becoming increasingly difficult to distinguish between today’s outlaw medical practices and the future of medicine itself…”
shady
Iontophoresis. Research. Then speak.
Quacky- You're just pulling these quotes straight out of abstracts found in a google search of research articles, jumping to conclusions, and pawning them off as your own scientific expertise on the subject. Did you ask these scholars prior to plagiarizing their work as your own insightful posts? Isn't there a Letsrun rule against copyright infringements?
WRIGHT-CARPENTER T.; KLEIN P.; SCHÄFERHOFF P.; APPELL H. J.; MIR L. M.; WEHLING P., Journal of Sports Medicine, 2004, vol. 25, no8, pp. 588-593 [6 page(s) (article)] (25 ref.), Treatment of muscle injuries by local administration of autologous conditioned serum: A pilot study on sportsmen with muscle strains.
Yeah, we don't want scientific studies introduced into our discussions. Let's stick with idle speculation and gut feelings.
If the procedure is being used to help fix an injury, rather than the direct boost to performance capacity, I'm inclined to wonder what the fuss is about. If the procedure is limited to the site of local injury, then that is not boosting performance, it is boosting healing of an injury. What's wrong with that? That sounds like sound medicine, not performance enhancement.
I am confused.
If you are injured or have some disease and the treatment is to use a banned substance which is prescribed by a legal doctor and you compete 3 months later when none of the drugs are in your body and you disclose this information to drug testers, can you still be banned?
There is a law about copyright. There is room for limited use, but doing so requires a citation. Clearly, the one that is violating laws, not just some organizations rules or someones interpretation of those rules. Clearly, if this individual is trying to make the point that Teg is 'morally cheating' they have done worse here.
Blood-spinning is a method of providing therapeutic (and, some claim, performance) benefits to the human body through the removal, modification and reintroduction of the body's own blood. Introduced at the University of Miami's Miller School of Medicine in 1998, it involves removing a quantity of a subject's blood and then subjecting it to centrifuge (hence 'spinning'). The centrifuging process concentrates the platelets found in blood into a plasma which has a thicker constituency than normal blood. The red blood cells are usually discarded during the process.
Once the platelets have been concentrated (to a minimum of five times their normal concentration), calcium and thrombin (an enzyme) are added. This mimicks conditions that would be found in a wound, and the platelets are stimulated into coagulating into a gel. Once they do so, they begin to produce NGFs (Natural Growth Factor hormones) just as they would within the body. These NGFs are the point of the process. Once back within the body, they will serve to quickly heal injuries or accelerate the process of muscle tissue repairing itself during training.
Blood-spinning should not be confused with blood doping - the practice of freezing and storing the athlete's own red blood cells for retransfusion for a simple hemoglobin and hence oxygenation boost. Although that is also illegal in some cases, there are obviously more simple medical reasons that might be done - preparation in case of injury, for example - which make that a more complex issue. The anti-doping aspect is more clear-cut in blood-spinning, as substances are in fact added to the spun blood - the calcium and thrombin. Even if those substances are found naturally in the body, the fact that they are added outside the body makes the practice more difficult to defend.
The problem is that the gel can presumably be injected back into the athlete after being rediluted, perhaps in more of the athlete's own blood. This would give a boost in NGF levels, which would offer an advantage in training by boosting muscle mass.
USATF
Rapid Healing Technique Questioned by Anti-Doping Rules
The World Anti-Doping Agency (WADA) has questioned the use of a treatment called "blood-spinning". The treatment is mainly used to increase the healing process of injuries and enhance the healing quality of damaged wounds and tissue.
It is WADA's fear that the treatment may introduce banned substances into the body by re-injecting a person's own blood. The blood-spinning process allows for the patient's blood samples to develop five times their normal level. This allows the so-called platelets to release an abundance of natural growth factors (NGFs) that help accelerate the healing process.
The production of NGFs is WADA's main concern. Some of the NGFs that appear on the banned list are the growth hormones. The likeliness of an athlete benefiting from this procedure prior to a competition is still considered a debatable topic.
WADA continues to monitor the use of this technique.
****
Blood spinning is gaining in popularity, again because it is undetectable, WADA can't decide whether it is legal or not, and there is some evidence it might help performance. This process involves taking one's own blood out, having the serum & platelets taken out, stimulating the platetes to release growth factors, and then injecting the new (but still one's own product) growth factors back into the body.
*****
Ok Morons, so if I he blood dopes but and says well I was suffering from a disease and it is out of my system so can I get a pass, just disregard all the enhanced training I got prior while I was enhancing my blood. Don't worry it is out of my system. Retard drug cheaters cheat this way all the time, take drugs, time it so it is out of their systems before major comps so if tested it wont show up. Sounds legal to me???
Tegenkamp should, no doubt, be given a free pass because some guy posting on the esteemed Letsrun.com website as "Quacky the Drug Duck" did not correctly cite nor receive permission to post snipets of their research. Matt Tegenkamp, I hereby grant you absolution, you are free to receive as many treatments as you like, with no condemnation from the Letsrun community because of the transgressions committed by the one known as "Quacky the Drug Duck".
terps wrote:
Quacky- You're just pulling these quotes straight out of abstracts found in a google search of research articles, jumping to conclusions, and pawning them off as your own scientific expertise on the subject. Did you ask these scholars prior to plagiarizing their work as your own insightful posts? Isn't there a Letsrun rule against copyright infringements?
WRIGHT-CARPENTER T.; KLEIN P.; SCHÄFERHOFF P.; APPELL H. J.; MIR L. M.; WEHLING P., Journal of Sports Medicine, 2004, vol. 25, no8, pp. 588-593 [6 page(s) (article)] (25 ref.), Treatment of muscle injuries by local administration of autologous conditioned serum: A pilot study on sportsmen with muscle strains.
I'll admit I'm a cheater too.
I competed for a top level group.
Many of us did 'blood spinning' to recover from injury. When we were sick or deficient we did intravenous therapy. We even received injections to promote healing. From my knowledge this is all illegal.
Though it is illegal, I viewed it as a grey area. It not like I was an athlete being tesed out of competition. Approval can be granted from Iaaf, but why go through the bother when your attempting to recover from an injury and don't plan on competing for a while.
We were always told to keep this information on the down low.
It surprises me that a high profile athelte such as Teg would make this public knowlege.
how about cancer patient who take EPO?
Another quacky source.
terps wrote:
Quacky- You're just pulling these quotes straight out of abstracts found in a google search of research articles, jumping to conclusions, and pawning them off as your own scientific expertise on the subject. Did you ask these scholars prior to plagiarizing their work as your own insightful posts? Isn't there a Letsrun rule against copyright infringements?
WRIGHT-CARPENTER T.; KLEIN P.; SCHÄFERHOFF P.; APPELL H. J.; MIR L. M.; WEHLING P., Journal of Sports Medicine, 2004, vol. 25, no8, pp. 588-593 [6 page(s) (article)] (25 ref.), Treatment of muscle injuries by local administration of autologous conditioned serum: A pilot study on sportsmen with muscle strains.
Yes. (from an inside source) End of thread.