Most succesful US runner NOT to be a FL Finalist

fairly easy explanation wrote:

idaho wrote:

Nick Symmonds

I don't believe that he could qualify today.

Then you are seriously confused.

I have to agree I don't think stubby would fair to well over 5k on a XC course

I don't believe Tim Broe ever made FLN. He is not better than Lincoln or Flannegan however.

Kennesaw Mountain wrote:

Shalane Flanagan

Game Over... End of Thread

I think that depends on what this thread is supposed to be about. Personally i thikn that's a horrible answer given what i think this thread should be about. The question should be asking who became the greatest runner who didn't make FL nats because they weren't good enough, not because they blew their chance.

Flanagan wins the award for biggest race screw up in the entire history of HS XC hands down....not bashing her, but that's just the facts...which was a sad fact for all MA people that day. Answers like Brian Sell demonstrate who have come a long way. Flanagan was just short of a god in XC in hs.

Broe made it twice. Was 10th as a senior, after a DNS as a junior.

what happened?

If memory serves me correctly....she was winning her region by like 90 seconds well ahead of course record pace, and colasped from running to hard. She was beyond a shoe-in for nats and probably the favorite.

Flanagan is and was an amazing runner, who pushes the limit so much that sometimes it gets the best of her. Although she's come a long way and seems to know herself a lot better now. She also had a similar problem at least one year in NCaas where she was winning going out so hard, and ended up geting pased, and started to walk.

Her negative traits are also positive traits as that insanely competitive nature that used to get the best of her is what has made her great. But it has cost her in the past, dearly.

Khalid Khannouchi

Um, if you blow your chance then you're "not good enough!" Legs and lungs aren't the only areas of talent necessary to become great.

Gwen Hardesty (Coogan). She may have been before the era of girls in FL but would not have qualified as she did not start running until college, where she won several DIII 3000 crowns. Made the Oly team in 10,000.

Jen Toomey fits that description as well.

I know he hasn't run much Cross, but how about Andrew Wheating? He has certainly come out of nowhere over the last year.

OK, I would have to say that most of the ones mentioned have been poor nominations. Either not D-runners at all or just not the best ever who didn't run FL.

Most successful is such a difficult thing to judge as how do you compare two runners over their career from 18 to 28 or even 38?

It depends on how you judge "Most Successful" but I would say that the top of the list would have to be:

Pat Porter

Marc Nenow

Both ran during the Kinney era. Marc still has an impressive number of sub-28:00's compared to any era (and the current era). Maybe the most of any American. Porter has 13:30/27:45 to his credit. Went to four OT 10k's I think and has NINE National XC titles. He also has a bunch of top placings at WCCC.

Steve Plasencia would be another one maybe. Not sure if he is a little older than these two and therefore there was no Kinney for him. I think Kinney started in '76, but I didn't look it up.

Plas was 13:19/27:45/2:12

Bickford would be another, Eyestone too if he didn't do Kinneys.

Good answers on Porter,Nenow and Plasencia. I totally forgot that era. I guess you could add Patty Sue Plumber as a lady from that time too.

Nenow and Plas were pre-Kinney. Nenow graduated around 76 and Plas was even earlier. Kinney didn't start until 1979.

I realize it was a joke, but Symmonds runs 25:40ish 5M tempos in-season, so he'd not have difficulty w/hs 5k XC. (the winners and top placers at footlocker usually run low 25s for 8k at junior nationals later in the same year)

Symmonds is a little old for the race today.

I graduated h.s. in 1979. Before Kinney there was an AAU meet, set up similar to Foot Locker now. Except it was looser--it was more "open." You had to qualify through states and regionals, but when you got to nats it was almost like signing up for a road race. You had to pay your own way there, and when I went, there were no adults supervising us. I was top 10 in my state, and I phoned up six other guys who also finished top 10 (two state champs on our team)--that became our "team," although we all went to different high schools. We drove across six states with no adults (I was in 12th grade) and we were wild in our hotel room in, I think, Shawnee Mission, Kansas. We raced with about an inch of snow on the ground.

I'm not sure he reads these boards, but I thought I remember seeing maybe a 13 or 14-year-old Matt Giusto racing that day (I think he won his race, which was for his age group). There were several races, by age group (i.e., 13-14 year olds, 15-16 year olds, etc).

Anyway, enough of that. Didn't a pre-race favorite, about 1996 or so, also collapse in the FL finals? I think it was the year Kim Mortenson won. Was it Julia Stamps? Anyone remember this? She was leading, then she slowed drastically, then she just collapsed and didn't get up until medical people put her on a stretcher.

If you think this then you failed to notice Julia Stamps's junior AND senior year at FL.

Mrr82 wrote:

Flanagan wins the award for biggest race screw up in the entire history of HS XC hands down....not bashing her, but that's just the facts...which was a sad fact for all MA people that day. Answers like Brian Sell demonstrate who have come a long way. Flanagan was just short of a god in XC in hs.