Webb has been under the microscope every since he ran 3:53 for the mile in high school.
Webb has been under the microscope every since he ran 3:53 for the mile in high school.
Well, he sorta got the shaft. But his career sure looks like the career of a doper. Not so good, then really great in Europe for a while, then he disappears when people start to test positive for EPO and there is increased scrutiny. Sort of like Regina, except he had the smarts to go off dope before he got caught.
Man, good points about Krum in 2004.
But let's be honest here...he is just old and over the hill. He had a breakout 12 months or so back in the day, but the entire world was running pretty quick at the time with the presence of El G and other epic 1500 runners like Estévez, Lagat, Silva, etc.(whereas Webb leads the world now with a 3:30 in the leadup to WC).
Webb broke an American record that most never saw being approached anytime soon. Same thing when he broke Ryun's HS Record. He's got the potential from an early age and people are interested. He's got an interesting story (shoot, he's had a book written about him!), unlike Krumm who is basically pretty boring. He races boring, his background is boring and his choice of racing and races over the years is clearly thawed.
Go Webb.
Krummenacker is a very good and intelligent guy, but his performances of late are indifferent at bast. He is mellow to the point of nonchalance. It's hard to get excited about him if HE never gets excited.
Because Krum was a sprinter moving up,
And Webb is a distance runner moving down.
We can relate to Webb because he ran HS XC, NCAA XC, USA XC,
does 15 mile long runs, etc, etc.
you say he is black, but did you know that David is actually half white? His mother is white, ask him if you wish.
MLXC wrote:
Because Krum was a sprinter moving up,
And Webb is a distance runner moving down.
We can relate to Webb because he ran HS XC, NCAA XC, USA XC,
does 15 mile long runs, etc, etc.
wow, you know NOTHING about krum, do you??? he was state champ in cross in high school...
haha666 wrote:
you say he is black, but did you know that David is actually half white? His mother is white, ask him if you wish.
Yes, I did know. I've seen a photo of him and his mom in a article when he was running really well.
Do you think that makes a difference? Do people call him white or black? Do you think he is white, black, or do you ALWAYS see him as mixed? Be honest. Technically I'm half white, half hispanic and I have never been considered white or mixed, not once. I'm always looked as a minority first no matter what.
It's a odd world we live in. If you don't look 100% white, to most people your 100% minority.
Obviously, you think that it makes quite a difference.Once you feel comfortable in the skin that you are in, it doesn't matter.Just tossing this out there, if there were some nerdy looking guy, with glasses, sniffles, pasty white skin and spoke with a nasally tone, but just happened to be able to play really good hoops, do you think that he would be celebrated with the same "whatever" as say Carmello Anthony, Chauncy Billups or Allen Iverson?
666 wrote:
haha666 wrote:you say he is black, but did you know that David is actually half white? His mother is white, ask him if you wish.
Yes, I did know. I've seen a photo of him and his mom in a article when he was running really well.
Do you think that makes a difference? Do people call him white or black? Do you think he is white, black, or do you ALWAYS see him as mixed? Be honest. Technically I'm half white, half hispanic and I have never been considered white or mixed, not once. I'm always looked as a minority first no matter what.
It's a odd world we live in. If you don't look 100% white, to most people your 100% minority.
quit trying to start trouble and controversy where there is none.
How do you think a advertisement is designed? Do you think public perception of race plays a part in its construction? It's a real thing that is taken into consideration when trying to reach people.
I'm not trying to make this a big deal but Krum's race did play a part in why he wasn't as celebrated in what is mostly a white fan based sport. It's why track and field is dying; it's the army of faceless Africans -- at least in the eyes of our culture.
About the basketball question, it's not as clear cut as track and I definitely don't have the research or even a personal interest of the sport to speak about with absolute confidence.
Just looking at it, it's kind of different. Basketball an urban sport, supported by hip hop culture and a larger fan base of minorities that's for sure. Would a geeky white guy be celebrated? Hmmm... Steve Nash, nah, haha. Like I said, I'm not trying to make race the end all and be all, being nerdy would affect his perception as much as race would.
Michael Jordan is universally respected by all. He's just a cool f***ing guy; humble like no other and arguably the best to play the game. What if he was the same cool talented guy but was also white? Would he pull in more white fans? It's a question you can think about.
666 wrote:
Commen Cense wrote:You're free to believe whatever you want, but it has nothing to do with Krummenackers skin color.
I work in marketing/creative direction, I'm a minority, and I'm good at what I do -- at least I like to think I am. Anyway, if I had to choose between Krummenacker (A goddamn World Champion) during his prime or Adam Goucher, guess who I would chose as a rep for middle/long distance track? Hmmmm.... it's just the way it works. A reality in business but of course our PC-ness gets in the way in actual discussion.
--
"Krummenacker is not just about fast times, however. He is doing something that not many male American middle distance runners have done in Europe lately: win. And even in his runner-up races he has been beating the likes of William Chirchir, Laban Rotich, Hezekiel Sepeng and Yuriy Borzakovskiy.
Could this be the same guy that Scott Raczko referred to last winter as not having enough speed to be among the best in the world? Raczko, you might remember, is the coach of Alan Webb, the high school phenomenon who was unfortunately saddled with the sobriquet of "America's Next Great Miler."
I don't think we need to bother with slapping that label on Krummenacker. He's doing quite well without it."
http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/print?id=1411144&type=columnist
I don't know if I agree if it has to do with the fact that Krum is black or not....regardless of that, from a marketing standpoint.....remember that 13% of the U.S. population is black and 66% or so is white.
I think that people forget this, and I am not saying that "666" forgot this. I just think that sometimes people are really quick to play the "race" card when the facts show that a majority of the U.S. population is white.
I'm not sure what you're trying to say about me but the fact that the U.S. is 2/3 white is an extension of why it's true. I'd say that most of the people reading this board are white males; I ran D1 track as a minority, in XC I was a super duper minority... You know what I mean?
Most of the time I don't sell products or services, I sell an image, a lifestyle. Track athletes are products just as clothes, or whatever product, is. I wont sell young urban clothing to young urban females by plastering images of old women with nonsexual mature undertones.
There is almost zero proof that Webb is a doper. He had his up and downs just to get to the top. A doper usually makes it to the top without a struggle.
Krummenacker is clean too. He still can run his annual 1:45 800. His main competition now is father time. He was born in 1975. Only Lunn is older among active US middle distance runners.
I know the real reason why. I can say it in a single sentence which better explains the situation than you can. It might sting a little for Krum and his fans, but it's the honest truth.
Krum is simply a bore compared to Webb. To be more specific, he doesn't have nearly the personality Webb does, the flair for the dramatic, the record-setting success (Webb: insane HSR, 2 ARs and many more to come with any luck, possibly a WR in the mile later on - Krum: 0 ARs, no chance of WR). Webb has a legit shot at being one of the best of his era, which is saying a lot these days, even if it isn't saying as much as it did in the 90's when Morceli and El G ruled.
Krum has a AR which goes to show...
I remember when Krummenacker ran 1:43/3:31... we were talking about him just like we are talking about Webb. Actually, the entire debate was about Krum moving up to the 1500M due to his 3:31 performance. Never truly transpired... Krummenacker's greatness at 1500... he just stayed isolated in the 800M until age and injuries crept back in.
I am a huge Krum fan, but he really was kind of a flash in the pan he won 3 US titles but he was fast for about 2 years, and never did anything in an outdoor championship (although i did go nuts when he won indoor worlds) I think I stopped really going crazy over him when he elected to not run the 1500 at the 2004 trails (as one of the few A standard holders, he would have been all but guarnteed a placec on the team) Also his times were quick 3:31 an 1:43.9 but not insane and I do believe he finished a ways back in those
666 wrote:
How do you think a advertisement is designed? Do you think public perception of race plays a part in its construction? It's a real thing that is taken into consideration when trying to reach people.
I'm not trying to make this a big deal but Krum's race did play a part in why he wasn't as celebrated in what is mostly a white fan based sport. It's why track and field is dying; it's the army of faceless Africans -- at least in the eyes of our culture.
I don't know. Swimming is as white as white gets (hell, Americans are even damn good at it), and no one cares about it except maybe every four years. Basketball is largely black, and has been for a long time, and is still plenty popular among all races of Americans.