Ryan Hall new AR 57:54

Don't even go there with the Ritz/Hall comparisons.

If you look at how each runner did relative to the competition, Ritz's run is far superior.

Still, a great race for Hall.

Comparing road races is a very difficult matter, I think all would agree. But forget the comparisons: both Ritz and Hall acquited themselves admirably and show they have the ability to compete at the highest levels of long distance road racing. Also, I think we knew that Ritz would do well at the longer distances, but over the last few months Hall has consistently shown he's also extremely capable--and whoe would have predicted this?

HGH wrote:

Don't even go there with the Ritz/Hall comparisons.

If you look at how each runner did relative to the competition, Ritz's run is far superior.

Still, a great race for Hall.

Hall ran great, as the AR shows (though the course was lightening fast for a distance rarely run). But basing talk on him being our next hope shouldn't be based on this race. He was off pace by an average of 28 seconds per 5K, meaning the field was seriously diluted for him to finish 11th. Maybe Hall should move up to the high distances and look towards the marathon. But I think it needs to be put in perspective, similar to when Clint Verran finished 17th in the world half marathon, as we knew he was very good but not great.

I'm not being negative for the sake of it, but to slow down the 'next great U.S. hope' talk. I'd like to see Hall in a stacked field beating a few people that warrant him being our next hope, like Ritz did in his half. He is not Webb and Ritz. He is not as good. Yea I know....I'm bashing a 24 year old for a great race and AR. I'm real proud of myself.

The distance is run every year for a USATF championship and it's run every year in recent years for an IAAF world championship.

hardset nipples wrote:

The distance is run every year for a USATF championship and it's run every year in recent years for an IAAF world championship.

So it's an annual run on the domestic and international scene. That's proof that it's a commonly raced distance??

fwiw, tadesse won great north last year in 59:05.

there has not been a world 20k champs for at least the last 10 yrs. it's always been world half-mara champs/

hardset nipples wrote:

The distance is run every year for a USATF championship and it's run every year in recent years for an IAAF world championship.

Would have expected to see Fernando in the top 20 aswell any word on him? I hope he is okay.

ttc-remind us of your PRs again?

That was a fantastic run by Hall today, easily on par with Ritz's if not superior. His last 5k shows he had more in the tank. He'll go under an hour for the half marathon before all is said and done.

Vipam wrote:

Only 2 runners were capable of producing sub 14:40 last 5km

Tadesse Z. (Eri) 14:14 CHAMPION

Ryan H (USA) 14:29- 11th place

Ryan ran a great race time wise but make you wonder if he should stayed alittle closer to the leaders?

part of the reason is that hall didn't go out with the main pack which was at world record pace for at least 10k - so some guys definitely were slowing down after that sub28 first half (27:55 or so). Hall ran a well paced run but he was coming from behind while guys had put in their guns in a fast first half, so it's kind of hard to take anything from that stat. If he had gone out with the rest of them then you could make a one - on - one comparison. Not trying to take anythign from a great smart run by Hall, just don't think the stat makes a lot of sense in this situation.

14:05 27:55:00 41:47:00 56:01:00 0:00 14:05 13:50 13:52 14:14 1 Tadesse Zersenay ERI

14:05 27:56:00 41:55:00 56:41:00 0:40 14:05 13:51 13:59 14:46 2 Kipchumba Robert Kipkorir KEN

14:05 27:57:00 42:25:00 57:15:00 1:14 14:05 13:52 14:28 14:50 3 Kebenei Wilson Kiprotich KEN

14:06 28:06:00 42:40:00 57:21:00 1:20 14:06 14:00 14:34 14:41 4 Busienei Wilson Kipkemei UGA

14:06 28:06:00 42:40:00 57:22:00 1:21 14:06 14:00 14:34 14:42 5 Taragon Wilfred Kipkoech KEN

14:05 28:06:00 42:39:00 57:27:00 1:26 14:05 14:01 14:33 14:48 6 Ejigu Deriba Merga ETH

14:05 28:10:00 42:47:00 57:27:00 1:26 14:05 14:05 14:37 14:40 7 Woldegebrel Tadesse Tola ETH

14:05 27:59:00 42:51:00 57:33:00 1:32 14:05 13:54 14:52 14:42 8 Shami Mubarak Hassan QAT

14:05 28:21:00 42:57:00 57:42:00 1:41 14:05 14:16 14:36 14:45 9 Disi Dieudonné RWA

14:05 28:13:00 42:46:00 57:49:00 1:48 14:05 14:08 14:33 15:03 10 Kifle Yonas ERI

14:33 29:00:00 43:25:00 57:54:00 1:53 14:33 14:27 14:25 14:29 11 Hall Ryan USA

14:06 28:21:00 43:08:00 58:19:00 2:18 14:06 14:15 14:47 15:11 12 Mkami Dickson Marwa TAN

14:05 28:20:00 43:33:00 58:26:00 2:25 14:05 14:15 15:13 14:53 13 Toroitich Martin Kitiyo UGA

14:05 28:20:00 43:27:00 58:31:00 2:30 14:05 14:15 15:07 15:04 14 Rashed Essa Ismail QAT

14:06 28:22:00 43:27:00 58:43:00 2:42 14:06 14:16 15:05 15:16 15 Nyasango Cuthbert ZIM

14:05 28:25:00 43:33:00 58:55:00 2:54 14:05 14:20 15:08 15:22 16 Salem Gamal Belal QAT

14:06 28:37:00 43:53:00 59:07:00 3:06 14:06 14:31 15:16 15:14 17 Tumbo Fred Mogaka KEN

14:14 29:01:00 43:53:00 59:09:00 3:08 14:14 14:47 14:52 15:16 18 April Lusapho RSA

14:07 28:48:00 43:57:00 59:11:00 3:10 14:07 14:41 15:09 15:14 19 Theuri James Kibocha FRA

14:08 28:59:00 44:28:00 59:23:00 3:22 14:08 14:51 15:29 14:55 20 Abebe Demssew Tsega ETH

14:06 28:37:00 43:53:00 59:29:00 3:28 14:06 14:31 15:16 15:36 21 Mesfen Tesfayohannes ERI

14:20 29:21:00 44:29:00 59:29:00 3:28 14:20 15:01 15:08 15:00 22 Hierro Iván ESP

14:34 29:24:00 44:29:00 59:37:00 3:36 14:34 14:50 15:05 15:08 23 Bourifa Migidio ITA

14:07 28:55:00 44:07:00 59:40:00 3:39 14:07 14:48 15:12 15:33 24 Kibet James UGA

14:17 29:22:00 44:31:00 59:45:00 3:44 14:17 15:05 15:09 15:14 25 Petrei Antonello ITA

14:06 28:57:00 44:37:00 59:54:00 3:53 14:06 14:51 15:40 15:17 26 Musyoki Patrick Makau KEN

14:17 29:21:00 44:29:00 59:56:00 3:55 14:17 15:04 15:08 15:27 27 Ietani Kazuo JPN

It just made me wonder if Hall hadn't let them get WELL over a minute ahead of him, could he have placed higher than 11th. Just on his stats alone his last 10km showed he had alot left in the tank and I guarantee he's thinking the same thing- should he have went out alittle faster. Only a handful of runners went with Tadesse for the first 10km, yet Ryan Hall ran faster than MOST of them for the 2nd 10km and ALL of them except Tadesse for the last 5km.

Judging by his first 10km it seem Ryan had a game plan of going for the American Record and got in easily.

uhhh are you just going to cut and paste stuff randomly or do you have a point to make with that data?

Vipam wrote:

Ryan Hall didn't just break the American Record as he killed it by almost a fullminute (48 seconds). Ryan took aim at the record pistol whipped it, shot it, beat it alittle more for good measure, and then layed it to rest!

The only person who ran their last 5km faster than Ryan Hall was the first place runner Zersenay Tadesse.

how often is the 20k distance contested?

lansing wrote:

uhhh are you just going to cut and paste stuff randomly or do you have a point to make with that data?

What exactly is your point?

did you actually read my post?

let me try it again then. yes hall ran one of the fastest last half's but it has to be taken with a grain of salt since all the people in front of him that the original poster is comparing with went out at world record pace or close to it (27:55-28:20) - when you go out this fast, it's almost expected that most people will tail off in the last 10k in comparison to Hall who ran a much more evenly paced race with his own specific goals in mind. So while he closed faster, it is sort of a pointless comparison to make since he wasn't with those guys in the first place at the first half. Had he been with them or even 28:20 and closed the last 5k at the same pace, I'd say that definitely says something. It's like if someone who runs 2:10 for the marathon closes in 6min for the last 1.1 while someone who runs 2:30 closes in 5:40, can you actually derive any major conclusions from the difference? No not at all.

Now malmo, I saw what you did in the NYC thread, don't troll around here. if you thought i didn't make a point, you could have simply said that and maybe made some assumptions on what you thought i meant. secondly, why the heck did you put up those numbers? you still never explained that. great you can cut and paste from websites. congratulations.

Thanks for posting all the splits. Hall ran very even splits and it seems like it worked out well for him. His 3rd 5k was the third fastest for that section and his last 5k was 2nd fastest for that section. I understand wanting him to go out with the leaders, but it seems like that wasn't him game plan. He seems to have known what shape he was in and ran smart/within himself. He absolutely ate up people in that last half. All in all it seems to be a smart/competitive run.

How many races of 20k or more has Hall ran? I don't believe he's done many, so running an even pace seems like a smart way to go. He'll go with the leaders as he becomes more comfortable with the longer distances.

Also, I love that Hall seems to be game for races of all distances, very throwback.

What's more informative are the places he was at 10k, 15k, and 20k:

10k: 24th

15k: 12th

20k: 11th

So actually his 3rd 5k, though not as fast as his final 5k, moved him the farthest in the field.

lansing wrote:

Now malmo, I saw what you did in the NYC thread, don't troll around here. if you thought i didn't make a point, you could have simply said that and maybe made some assumptions on what you thought i meant. secondly, why the heck did you put up those numbers? you still never explained that. great you can cut and paste from websites. congratulations.

What's your problem? I put up that data table, because I wanted to, that's why. There will be many here who'll find the data interesting and very few of them are snotty-nosed brats.

Here's another look at that same data table that you will find nowhere on the web except here:

14:05 27:55:00 41:47:00 56:01:00 ___ 14:05 13:50 13:52 14:14 ___ 0:00 0:00 0:00 0:00 ___ 1 Tadesse Zersenay ERI

14:05 27:56:00 41:55:00 56:41:00 ___ 14:05 13:51 13:59 14:46 ___ 0:00 0:01 0:08 0:40 ___ 2 Kipchumba Robert Kipkorir KEN

14:05 27:57:00 42:25:00 57:15:00 ___ 14:05 13:52 14:28 14:50 ___ 0:00 0:02 0:38 1:14 ___ 3 Kebenei Wilson Kiprotich KEN

14:06 28:06:00 42:40:00 57:21:00 ___ 14:06 14:00 14:34 14:41 ___ 0:01 0:11 0:53 1:20 ___ 4 Busienei Wilson Kipkemei UGA

14:06 28:06:00 42:40:00 57:22:00 ___ 14:06 14:00 14:34 14:42 ___ 0:01 0:11 0:53 1:21 ___ 5 Taragon Wilfred Kipkoech KEN

14:05 28:06:00 42:39:00 57:27:00 ___ 14:05 14:01 14:33 14:48 ___ 0:00 0:11 0:52 1:26 ___ 6 Ejigu Deriba Merga ETH

14:05 28:10:00 42:47:00 57:27:00 ___ 14:05 14:05 14:37 14:40 ___ 0:00 0:15 1:00 1:26 ___ 7 Woldegebrel Tadesse Tola ETH

14:05 27:59:00 42:51:00 57:33:00 ___ 14:05 13:54 14:52 14:42 ___ 0:00 0:04 1:04 1:32 ___ 8 Shami Mubarak Hassan QAT

14:05 28:21:00 42:57:00 57:42:00 ___ 14:05 14:16 14:36 14:45 ___ 0:00 0:26 1:10 1:41 ___ 9 Disi Dieudonné RWA

14:05 28:13:00 42:46:00 57:49:00 ___ 14:05 14:08 14:33 15:03 ___ 0:00 0:18 0:59 1:48 ___ 10 Kifle Yonas ERI

14:33 29:00:00 43:25:00 57:54:00 ___ 14:33 14:27 14:25 14:29 ___ 0:28 1:05 1:38 1:53 ___ 11 Hall Ryan USA

14:06 28:21:00 43:08:00 58:19:00 ___ 14:06 14:15 14:47 15:11 ___ 0:01 0:26 1:21 2:18 ___ 12 Mkami Dickson Marwa TAN

14:05 28:20:00 43:33:00 58:26:00 ___ 14:05 14:15 15:13 14:53 ___ 0:00 0:25 1:46 2:25 ___ 13 Toroitich Martin Kitiyo UGA

14:05 28:20:00 43:27:00 58:31:00 ___ 14:05 14:15 15:07 15:04 ___ 0:00 0:25 1:40 2:30 ___ 14 Rashed Essa Ismail QAT

14:06 28:22:00 43:27:00 58:43:00 ___ 14:06 14:16 15:05 15:16 ___ 0:01 0:27 1:40 2:42 ___ 15 Nyasango Cuthbert ZIM

14:05 28:25:00 43:33:00 58:55:00 ___ 14:05 14:20 15:08 15:22 ___ 0:00 0:30 1:46 2:54 ___ 16 Salem Gamal Belal QAT

14:06 28:37:00 43:53:00 59:07:00 ___ 14:06 14:31 15:16 15:14 ___ 0:01 0:42 2:06 3:06 ___ 17 Tumbo Fred Mogaka KEN

14:14 29:01:00 43:53:00 59:09:00 ___ 14:14 14:47 14:52 15:16 ___ 0:09 1:06 2:06 3:08 ___ 18 April Lusapho RSA

14:07 28:48:00 43:57:00 59:11:00 ___ 14:07 14:41 15:09 15:14 ___ 0:02 0:53 2:10 3:10 ___ 19 Theuri James Kibocha FRA

14:08 28:59:00 44:28:00 59:23:00 ___ 14:08 14:51 15:29 14:55 ___ 0:03 1:04 2:41 3:22 ___ 20 Abebe Demssew Tsega ETH

14:06 28:37:00 43:53:00 59:29:00 ___ 14:06 14:31 15:16 15:36 ___ 0:01 0:42 2:06 3:28 ___ 21 Mesfen Tesfayohannes ERI

14:20 29:21:00 44:29:00 59:29:00 ___ 14:20 15:01 15:08 15:00 ___ 0:15 1:26 2:42 3:28 ___ 22 Hierro Iván ESP

14:34 29:24:00 44:29:00 59:37:00 ___ 14:34 14:50 15:05 15:08 ___ 0:29 1:29 2:42 3:36 ___ 23 Bourifa Migidio ITA

14:07 28:55:00 44:07:00 59:40:00 ___ 14:07 14:48 15:12 15:33 ___ 0:02 1:00 2:20 3:39 ___ 24 Kibet James UGA

14:17 29:22:00 44:31:00 59:45:00 ___ 14:17 15:05 15:09 15:14 ___ 0:12 1:27 2:44 3:44 ___ 25 Petrei Antonello ITA

14:06 28:57:00 44:37:00 59:54:00 ___ 14:06 14:51 15:40 15:17 ___ 0:01 1:02 2:50 3:53 ___ 26 Musyoki Patrick Makau KEN

14:17 29:21:00 44:29:00 59:56:00 ___ 14:17 15:04 15:08 15:27 ___ 0:12 1:26 2:42 3:55 ___ 27 Ietani Kazuo JPN