Only issue is your lack of evidence. Do you also think that frosh XC runners get Achilles issues from chasing year round fitness? Or is it more of a nuanced injury than that?
I think the lesson here, is that the year round race fitness approach just does not work. Jakob trained and raced himself into the ground and his body has broken down. From what I have seen over the years is that once someone gets an injury like his, they are done man. They are never the same again. It’s over. I for one admired Jakob’s tenacity and his willingness to race and compete, but I thought he was arrogant and dismissive of his competitors. His accomplishments I would say put him in the top 20, but certainly not worthy of GOAT consideration. I think once Hoey has his inevitable toasted burn out and others like Nico and Blanks begin to falter, we will begin to see that all this double threshold, year-round race fitness, run hard every day, no breaks nonsense has been a training fad that is ineffective at having a career over a few years and makes serious injuries unavoidable.
So you think he has had a career over a few years?!
He won Olympic gold in the 1500m in 2021 at age 20 AND........before that he was ranked no 2 in the world in the 1500m at age 18 and 19. AND before that he was in the U20 1500m final and won the Euro U20 XC champs in 2016, won gold in the 3000m SC and 5000m and gold in XC in Euro U20 2017, got silver and bronze in the WC U20 1500m and the 5000m and double gold in the same distances in the SENIOR Euro in 2018. In 2018 he also competed in the SENIOR WC in 3000m SC.
After 2021 he has been the fastest in the 1500m in 2022 to 2024 and won the DL final every year and was unbeaten in the 5000m.
AND even though his 2025 outdoor season was ruined by injury he still broke Nuguse new mile WR with about 1.5 sec and his own 1500m WR with almost 1 sec AND won a double gold in Euro Indoor 1500m/ 3000m (for the third time) AND Double WC indoor gold in the same distances as the second male runner in history (Gebrselassie was the first).
So I think we can argue that his career - so far - has lasted for 10 seasons, including 7 in the absolut world top.
I suspect you hope that his career is over. I think he might have several more years in him PROVIDED HE FULLY OVERCOMES HIS ACHILLES PROBLEMS.
2026 is the best year for a break, a chance to heal and so on. No world champs, no olympic games on track, but maybe we will see him at copenhaven in september -> road halfmarathon worlds.
This post was edited 8 minutes after it was posted.
I think Jakob should skip the whole indoor season and return to competition in the spring. Much better risk/return ratio than returning to competition indoors
All this time and he's still not healthy enough to race. Last fully healthy race was 9 months ago.
If his achilles is still bothering him it may be time for surgery and then it's 12 months of recovery from that.
Maybe that's his plan and Nike is just paying him to keep posting hype videos and then dropping out of races last minute.
No, the course in Portugal was not exactly good for someone recently injured. You'll also note that Gjert was also present as Pinto's coach. Both are good reasons to stay away from the place.
He had claimed training has been going well for many months. He is obviously not revealing the whole truth here
He said in that video that he has just returned to normal mileage and "soon" will return to normal paces. It sounds like training is going well now, but who knows how long it took him to build up back to normal volume. Hopefully, this is a sign that the achilles injury, as a hindrance to normal training volume/intensity, is a thing of the past. The guy is still really young, so I have no doubt he can get back to WR form, health permitting.
What he says is one thing. What he does is another. It is the latter that counts.
I think the lesson here, is that the year round race fitness approach just does not work. Jakob trained and raced himself into the ground and his body has broken down. From what I have seen over the years is that once someone gets an injury like his, they are done man. They are never the same again. It’s over. I for one admired Jakob’s tenacity and his willingness to race and compete, but I thought he was arrogant and dismissive of his competitors. His accomplishments I would say put him in the top 20, but certainly not worthy of GOAT consideration. I think once Hoey has his inevitable toasted burn out and others like Nico and Blanks begin to falter, we will begin to see that all this double threshold, year-round race fitness, run hard every day, no breaks nonsense has been a training fad that is ineffective at having a career over a few years and makes serious injuries unavoidable.
So you think he has had a career over a few years?!
He won Olympic gold in the 1500m in 2021 at age 20 AND........before that he was ranked no 2 in the world in the 1500m at age 18 and 19. AND before that he was in the U20 1500m final and won the Euro U20 XC champs in 2016, won gold in the 3000m SC and 5000m and gold in XC in Euro U20 2017, got silver and bronze in the WC U20 1500m and the 5000m and double gold in the same distances in the SENIOR Euro in 2018. In 2018 he also competed in the SENIOR WC in 3000m SC.
After 2021 he has been the fastest in the 1500m in 2022 to 2024 and won the DL final every year and was unbeaten in the 5000m.
AND even though his 2025 outdoor season was ruined by injury he still broke Nuguse new mile WR with about 1.5 sec and his own 1500m WR with almost 1 sec AND won a double gold in Euro Indoor 1500m/ 3000m (for the third time) AND Double WC indoor gold in the same distances as the second male runner in history (Gebrselassie was the first).
So I think we can argue that his career - so far - has lasted for 10 seasons, including 7 in the absolut world top.
I suspect you hope that his career is over. I think he might have several more years in him PROVIDED HE FULLY OVERCOMES HIS ACHILLES PROBLEMS.
The last part of your last sentence is a longshot. I wouldn't bet on it.
I think Jakob should skip the whole indoor season and return to competition in the spring. Much better risk/return ratio than returning to competition indoors
If he were smart he'd skip the indoor season which contributes almost nothing to his legacy but he won't.
I think the lesson here, is that the year round race fitness approach just does not work. Jakob trained and raced himself into the ground and his body has broken down. From what I have seen over the years is that once someone gets an injury like his, they are done man. They are never the same again. It’s over. I for one admired Jakob’s tenacity and his willingness to race and compete, but I thought he was arrogant and dismissive of his competitors. His accomplishments I would say put him in the top 20, but certainly not worthy of GOAT consideration. I think once Hoey has his inevitable toasted burn out and others like Nico and Blanks begin to falter, we will begin to see that all this double threshold, year-round race fitness, run hard every day, no breaks nonsense has been a training fad that is ineffective at having a career over a few years and makes serious injuries unavoidable.
What do you want race fitness to work for? Why do you believe year-round race fitness has not worked for Jakob I. (or others)? How many years should a world class running career last?
Jakob has run outstanding world class times since 2017. He achieved remarkable success at the global level for 8+ years. Hoey, Nico and Blanks have also been extremely successful, as have numerous other runners who have had year-round race fitness. As one example, Keninisa Bekele had numerous seasons where he was fit enough to win World Cross Country in March, race well on the European Track Circuit in the spring and summer, and then top it off with global championships in August and September.
Frank Shorter used to do an indoor track season, a spring/summer track season, and then race US Cross Country championships in the fall.
Many racers successfully compete in things like the USATF Running Circuit that has featured 11 xc and road races from January-November.
Whatever anyone's ideas are about Achilles' recovery ability is probably ill-informed.
A distance runner does 20,000-30,000 submaximal force ground contacts per week in training. A middle-aged man at the gym who lopes 10 minute mile pace, plays pickleball, and lifts weights will accrue nearly as many ground contacts per week while weighing 40% more at the same height, with resultant forces far higher than +40%.
The middle-aged loper has less ability to enter deep sleep, less IGF-1, and less organized healing processes in the body.
a 25 year old runner is set up to easily recover tendons. It doesn't take a genius to benefit from improving recovery, whether from not being in a prolonged state of one of the following: nitrogen deficit, caloric deficit, poor sleep, not tapering and cross training, and not employing one of the myriad of new pieces of biomedical technology for healing
This is the unfortunate truth. I realized this year how meaningless people consider World Indoors after all the top runners went to GST and how much people overlooked Jakob's historic double (especially on this site). Jakob wasn't even a finalist for the World Athlete of the Year award. It just doesn't matter that much. I'd say if he wanted an easy Indoor season without having to worry too much about travel and many race pace sessions to aggravate his achilles (if that is what is causing it because for all we know it could've just been the fact that he had to sit in a courtroom most of the day), he could just race a lowkey 3k in Madrid and knock out the easy 7:33 standard. Skip Lievin. Then he has a month and a half to train stress free until the straight 3000m final in Poland which is not that far at all from Norway. But does it really matter if he does this? I'd much rather him continue to build his base and go for a 5000m WR attempt in Oslo/Paris DLs and perhaps a Mile WR attempt in Pre/Monaco. That will be 100x more important.
I think the lesson here, is that the year round race fitness approach just does not work. Jakob trained and raced himself into the ground and his body has broken down. From what I have seen over the years is that once someone gets an injury like his, they are done man. They are never the same again. It’s over. I for one admired Jakob’s tenacity and his willingness to race and compete, but I thought he was arrogant and dismissive of his competitors. His accomplishments I would say put him in the top 20, but certainly not worthy of GOAT consideration. I think once Hoey has his inevitable toasted burn out and others like Nico and Blanks begin to falter, we will begin to see that all this double threshold, year-round race fitness, run hard every day, no breaks nonsense has been a training fad that is ineffective at having a career over a few years and makes serious injuries unavoidable.
What do you want race fitness to work for? Why do you believe year-round race fitness has not worked for Jakob I. (or others)? How many years should a world class running career last?
Jakob has run outstanding world class times since 2017. He achieved remarkable success at the global level for 8+ years. Hoey, Nico and Blanks have also been extremely successful, as have numerous other runners who have had year-round race fitness. As one example, Keninisa Bekele had numerous seasons where he was fit enough to win World Cross Country in March, race well on the European Track Circuit in the spring and summer, and then top it off with global championships in August and September.
Frank Shorter used to do an indoor track season, a spring/summer track season, and then race US Cross Country championships in the fall.
Many racers successfully compete in things like the USATF Running Circuit that has featured 11 xc and road races from January-November.
The year-round race fitness thing is kind of a myth. He literally does fast sessions in January/Feb/March in order to peak for the Indoor Championships. That's not the same as his fitness in April where he goes back double threshold and rebuilding the mileage. What we don't know is whether the sessions at 54-55 second speed are what is actually aggravating his pains or his high mileage or anything else. That's why he kind of has to consider skipping some races.
This post was edited 5 minutes after it was posted.
Whatever anyone's ideas are about Achilles' recovery ability is probably ill-informed.
A distance runner does 20,000-30,000 submaximal force ground contacts per week in training. A middle-aged man at the gym who lopes 10 minute mile pace, plays pickleball, and lifts weights will accrue nearly as many ground contacts per week while weighing 40% more at the same height, with resultant forces far higher than +40%.
The middle-aged loper has less ability to enter deep sleep, less IGF-1, and less organized healing processes in the body.
a 25 year old runner is set up to easily recover tendons. It doesn't take a genius to benefit from improving recovery, whether from not being in a prolonged state of one of the following: nitrogen deficit, caloric deficit, poor sleep, not tapering and cross training, and not employing one of the myriad of new pieces of biomedical technology for healing
but Jakob said he recovered in the last summer, but did a fiasco in the WC.
We have seen in the past runners dragging injuries and beating WR and medaling in the 800m.
Reality check: Jakob skipped Euro XC like almost every other top runner in Europe. I don't think it is a missed check point given his disjointed training leading into Tokyo, time off due to tonsil surgery and cautiousness building back up. In Jakob's own words, his training consists of building blocks, the foundations of which he wasn't able to do leading into Tokyo, and probably hasn't done since this time last year. Now is the time to lay the foundations again.
In one thread on LRC, people are criticizing Hoey for going too hard in december, and in another sounding alarm bells because Jakob is skipping races.
Well your reality check is Jakob doesn’t operate like “almost every other top runner in Europe.” He typically runs each European championship (including XC/indoors), each track World championships (including indoors) that he can. Historically, he doesn’t pick and choose like your typical guy.
Now, if you want to say Jakob isn’t properly prepared due to the operation AND his injuries that’s fine. But if you’re saying Jakob is now going to pick and choose his spots like nearly everyone else then the injury is a significant turning point in his career. It seems to me we are seeing a mixture of both right now. You are taking a very rosy view of things if you can’t connect the dots with the concerning trajectory as it relates to his brothers. But again, let’s see when it’s time for Lieven and if he is able to train at a high level until then. But even if it’s a philosophical shift that keeps him from racing indoors that’d be something that’s new for him and unfortunate for Jakob fans/fans of the sport. But it might be best for his longevity.
I think we already established Jakob has changed his approach back in April when news of his injury first surfaced. So in the context of the 2025 season, and where he is currently at making positive improvements in training in December, I don't think it is another check point missed - the season has barely begun.
This is another missed checkpoint, so I understand the skepticism from posters here. Lieven is a big one and the next one. If he doesn’t race there and set up a World Indoors defense, it’s very concerning. Obviously the bigger competitions this year are European Outdoors, Ultimate Athletic Champs and the Diamond League final. Still, if Jakob is right he doesn’t sit out chances to run fast, set records and beat his competition.
Reality check: Jakob skipped Euro XC like almost every other top runner in Europe. I don't think it is a missed check point given his disjointed training leading into Tokyo, time off due to tonsil surgery and cautiousness building back up. In Jakob's own words, his training consists of building blocks, the foundations of which he wasn't able to do leading into Tokyo, and probably hasn't done since this time last year. Now is the time to lay the foundations again.
In one thread on LRC, people are criticizing Hoey for going too hard in December, and in another sounding alarm bells because Jakob is skipping a race at the end of a long 2025.
Junk course on hard dirt. Not a good place to bounce back from a bad achilles.
Whatever anyone's ideas are about Achilles' recovery ability is probably ill-informed.
A distance runner does 20,000-30,000 submaximal force ground contacts per week in training. A middle-aged man at the gym who lopes 10 minute mile pace, plays pickleball, and lifts weights will accrue nearly as many ground contacts per week while weighing 40% more at the same height, with resultant forces far higher than +40%.
The middle-aged loper has less ability to enter deep sleep, less IGF-1, and less organized healing processes in the body.
a 25 year old runner is set up to easily recover tendons. It doesn't take a genius to benefit from improving recovery, whether from not being in a prolonged state of one of the following: nitrogen deficit, caloric deficit, poor sleep, not tapering and cross training, and not employing one of the myriad of new pieces of biomedical technology for healing
Achilles injuries amongst elites can take them away from the sport for substantial periods and can even end careers. Elites and pros are subjecting their bodies to demands that far exceed that of middle-aged hobby joggers.
I think we already established Jakob has changed his approach back in April when news of his injury first surfaced. So in the context of the 2025 season, and where he is currently at making positive improvements in training in December, I don't think it is another check point missed - the season has barely begun.
You’re missing an important distinction. In April he changed his approach because he was injured. It’s taking a while to get to 100% and after enduring a lot of injuries/setback are you so sure he’ll take the same swings going forward?
I think we already established Jakob has changed his approach back in April when news of his injury first surfaced. So in the context of the 2025 season, and where he is currently at making positive improvements in training in December, I don't think it is another check point missed - the season has barely begun.
You’re missing an important distinction. In April he changed his approach because he was injured. It’s taking a while to get to 100% and after enduring a lot of injuries/setback are you so sure he’ll take the same swings going forward?
No he won't take the same swings going forward, which is what I'm saying and why skipping Euro XC isn't cause for huge alarm, and not a missed checkpoint. As snowflakes said in his post above, the focus has to be on WR's next year, not XC and other sideshow events he would normally entertain - for fun.
I think Jakob has realised he has lost a year and needs to go all-in on getting at least the 5000m and mile WR's in 2026. 1500m is a bigger challenge. At this stage, I don't think he gives two sh*ts about XC, World Indoors or Ultimate Championships (which is essentially a combo of GST and DL Final).
This post was edited 36 seconds after it was posted.
All this time and he's still not healthy enough to race. Last fully healthy race was 9 months ago.
If his achilles is still bothering him it may be time for surgery and then it's 12 months of recovery from that.
Maybe that's his plan and Nike is just paying him to keep posting hype videos and then dropping out of races last minute.
No, the course in Portugal was not exactly good for someone recently injured. You'll also note that Gjert was also present as Pinto's coach. Both are good reasons to stay away from the place.
Is he going to change sport then? Because Pinto is continuing to go to major champs and Gjert now is getting acreditation from Portugal.
he didn’t go because he is injured again, this was a little bird that told me.