it amazes me that 'muricans think they have free speech.
and free elections.
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typical con wrote:
protestingisgood wrote:
They were arrested for being illegal immigrants after their temporary visas were revoked. If you are a citizen, you can go protest Israel all you want.
Try being a UK
citizensubject and question mass migration on Twitter. It will not end well for you.So freedom of speech is only for some people now?
I know you think you are being clever here, but there is no contradiction.
The U.S. has the best free speech protections in the world. This is an objective fact. Deny the holocaust, advocate for another holocaust, be a white supremacist, anything you can think of. The government cannot put you in prison. The same cannot be said for anywhere in Europe.
At the same time, student visas are a privilege. It is like a guest being in your home. They can be canceled because someone smells bad, they died their hair a color we don't like, or just because we feel like it. Same for kicking someone out of my house. They have no right to be there in the first place, so their rights are not being violated by being forced to leave. Citizens, on the other hand, do have a right to be here. Just like say, my child, has a right to be in my house. I can not kick them out just because I am angry at them.
You seem to think there is some kind of "hypocrisy trap" you have caught me in here, but there isn't. Citizens of the USA have the best free speech protections in the world, but if you come here as a tax payer funded guest, your trip can be cut short for any reason we deem fit.
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protestingisgood wrote:
typical con wrote:
So freedom of speech is only for some people now?
I know you think you are being clever here, but there is no contradiction.
The U.S. has the best free speech protections in the world. This is an objective fact. Deny the holocaust, advocate for another holocaust, be a white supremacist, anything you can think of. The government cannot put you in prison. The same cannot be said for anywhere in Europe.
At the same time, student visas are a privilege. It is like a guest being in your home. They can be canceled because someone smells bad, they died their hair a color we don't like, or just because we feel like it. Same for kicking someone out of my house. They have no right to be there in the first place, so their rights are not being violated by being forced to leave. Citizens, on the other hand, do have a right to be here. Just like say, my child, has a right to be in my house. I can not kick them out just because I am angry at them.
You seem to think there is some kind of "hypocrisy trap" you have caught me in here, but there isn't. Citizens of the USA have the best free speech protections in the world, but if you come here as a tax payer funded guest, your trip can be cut short for any reason we deem fit.
How to know if this is a sarcastic parody account, a Russian bot or a genuine MAGA cultist? I never know whether to upvote or downvote those kind of post.
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US boasts freedom from gun safety, freedom from state healthcare, )you still pay the most for healthcare per capita), free from elections without alleged voting scandal.
Woman have no abortion rights? I thought gays aren't even allowed to get married in some place?
Free of quality, non biased news coverage.
Not a free country.
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protestingisgood wrote:
typical con wrote:
So freedom of speech is only for some people now?
I know you think you are being clever here, but there is no contradiction.
The U.S. has the best free speech protections in the world. This is an objective fact. Deny the holocaust, advocate for another holocaust, be a white supremacist, anything you can think of. The government cannot put you in prison. The same cannot be said for anywhere in Europe.
At the same time, student visas are a privilege. It is like a guest being in your home. They can be canceled because someone smells bad, they died their hair a color we don't like, or just because we feel like it. Same for kicking someone out of my house. They have no right to be there in the first place, so their rights are not being violated by being forced to leave. Citizens, on the other hand, do have a right to be here. Just like say, my child, has a right to be in my house. I can not kick them out just because I am angry at them.
You seem to think there is some kind of "hypocrisy trap" you have caught me in here, but there isn't. Citizens of the USA have the best free speech protections in the world, but if you come here as a tax payer funded guest, your trip can be cut short for any reason we deem fit.
So, only some people (citizens) have freedom of speech in America? Everyone else has to "watch what they say"?
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typical con wrote:
protestingisgood wrote:
I know you think you are being clever here, but there is no contradiction.
The U.S. has the best free speech protections in the world. This is an objective fact. Deny the holocaust, advocate for another holocaust, be a white supremacist, anything you can think of. The government cannot put you in prison. The same cannot be said for anywhere in Europe.
At the same time, student visas are a privilege. It is like a guest being in your home. They can be canceled because someone smells bad, they died their hair a color we don't like, or just because we feel like it. Same for kicking someone out of my house. They have no right to be there in the first place, so their rights are not being violated by being forced to leave. Citizens, on the other hand, do have a right to be here. Just like say, my child, has a right to be in my house. I can not kick them out just because I am angry at them.
You seem to think there is some kind of "hypocrisy trap" you have caught me in here, but there isn't. Citizens of the USA have the best free speech protections in the world, but if you come here as a tax payer funded guest, your trip can be cut short for any reason we deem fit.
So, only some people (citizens) have freedom of speech in America? Everyone else has to "watch what they say"?
Guests can have their temporary guest passes (visas) revoked. Citizens do not have temporary guest passes, as they have a legal right to be here.
If you interpret that as them not having rights, than that is just they way you see it I guess.
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typical con wrote:
protestingisgood wrote:
I know you think you are being clever here, but there is no contradiction.
The U.S. has the best free speech protections in the world. This is an objective fact. Deny the holocaust, advocate for another holocaust, be a white supremacist, anything you can think of. The government cannot put you in prison. The same cannot be said for anywhere in Europe.
At the same time, student visas are a privilege. It is like a guest being in your home. They can be canceled because someone smells bad, they died their hair a color we don't like, or just because we feel like it. Same for kicking someone out of my house. They have no right to be there in the first place, so their rights are not being violated by being forced to leave. Citizens, on the other hand, do have a right to be here. Just like say, my child, has a right to be in my house. I can not kick them out just because I am angry at them.
You seem to think there is some kind of "hypocrisy trap" you have caught me in here, but there isn't. Citizens of the USA have the best free speech protections in the world, but if you come here as a tax payer funded guest, your trip can be cut short for any reason we deem fit.
So, only some people (citizens) have freedom of speech in America? Everyone else has to "watch what they say"?
Yeah, free speech should be only for those who look like me AND who think like me.
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Free speech absolutist wrote:
typical con wrote:
So, only some people (citizens) have freedom of speech in America? Everyone else has to "watch what they say"?
Yeah, free speech should be only for those who look like me AND who think like me.
People can say whatever they want no matter what they look like in the US. None of them will go to prison or be convicted of a crime for doing so.
However, if you are a non-citizen student here at the taxpayers graces, your free gift from the American taxpayer might be taken away if you advocate for terrorism against the nation hosting you. You will not be tourtured or sent to prison. Your gift will simply be returned to it's original owners.
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protestingisgood wrote:
typical con wrote:
So, only some people (citizens) have freedom of speech in America? Everyone else has to "watch what they say"?
Guests can have their temporary guest passes (visas) revoked. Citizens do not have temporary guest passes, as they have a legal right to be here.
If you interpret that as them not having rights, than that is just they way you see it I guess.
So what rights do "temporary guest pass" holders have?
Right to a fair trial? Right to privacy?
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protestingisgood wrote:
Free speech absolutist wrote:
Yeah, free speech should be only for those who look like me AND who think like me.
People can say whatever they want no matter what they look like in the US. None of them will go to prison or be convicted of a crime for doing so.
However, if you are a non-citizen student here at the taxpayers graces, your free gift from the American taxpayer might be taken away if you advocate for terrorism against the nation hosting you. You will not be tourtured or sent to prison. Your gift will simply be returned to it's original owners.
If someone is advocating violence then they are breaking the law and will have their visa revoked.
Removing someone's visa because they said they don't like the president or US foreign policy are restrictions on free speech.
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protestingisgood wrote:
Free speech absolutist wrote:
Yeah, free speech should be only for those who look like me AND who think like me.
People can say whatever they want no matter what they look like in the US. None of them will go to prison or be convicted of a crime for doing so.
However, if you are a non-citizen student here at the taxpayers graces, your free gift from the American taxpayer might be taken away if you advocate for terrorism against the nation hosting you. You will not be tourtured or sent to prison. Your gift will simply be returned to its original owners.
In the case of this French scientist, he was neither advocating terrorism nor travelling at the US taxpayers graces… The USA under Trump definitely have a strange way to treat their guests.
Interestingly, the only three countries I had my phone searched upon arrival was China, North Korea and in my most recent trip the USA. This haven’t even happened to me in Russia or other authoritarian countries.
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protestingisgood wrote:
Free speech absolutist wrote:
Yeah, free speech should be only for those who look like me AND who think like me.
People can say whatever they want no matter what they look like in the US. None of them will go to prison or be convicted of a crime for doing so.
However, if you are a non-citizen student here at the taxpayers graces, your free gift from the American taxpayer might be taken away if you advocate for terrorism against the nation hosting you. You will not be tourtured or sent to prison. Your gift will simply be returned to it's original owners.
this is hilarious rubbish.
you have legally unprotected speech in the us like many other countries.
But the bigger problem by far is the attitude towards other's views that you enact all the time. people should be able to say what they want and expect to be protected in saying this by the people they disagree with. Not threatened with violence, law suits, cancellation etc. this is where the us leads modern society in failing biggly.
“I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it.” (Beatrice Evelyn Hall).
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Free speech index:
1. Finland
2. Denmark
3. Ireland
…
15. United Kingdom
…
28. USA
Press freedom index:
1. Norway
2. Denmark
3. Sweden
…
22. United Kingdom
…
…
55. USA
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Nice post Gramps.
and how is this possible in the us?
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you will obey.... wrote:
Kingrey wrote:
USA doesn’t either.
Peoplenon-citizens are being arrested for speaking up against IsraelWhy should opposing a genocide being committed br a foreign nation be cause for arrest in America? You don't think citizens have been arrested for this?
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pupil3142 wrote:
protestingisgood wrote:
People can say whatever they want no matter what they look like in the US. None of them will go to prison or be convicted of a crime for doing so.
However, if you are a non-citizen student here at the taxpayers graces, your free gift from the American taxpayer might be taken away if you advocate for terrorism against the nation hosting you. You will not be tourtured or sent to prison. Your gift will simply be returned to it's original owners.
this is hilarious rubbish.
you have legally unprotected speech in the us like many other countries.
But the bigger problem by far is the attitude towards other's views that you enact all the time. people should be able to say what they want and expect to be protected in saying this by the people they disagree with. Not threatened with violence, law suits, cancellation etc. this is where the us leads modern society in failing biggly.
“I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it.” (Beatrice Evelyn Hall).
The article you linked does not help your case. It clearly outlines that we do not have hate speech laws in the U.S., which makes us unique compared to most of Europe, Canada, Australia, and New Zealand. You can state any OPINION in the United States. "I'm going to kill you" is not an opinion, it is a threat.
On the contrary there are many opinions that are illegal to state in much of Europe. This could be opinions about the details of the holocaust, opinions on race relations, opinions on transgenderism, or opinions on mass migration. We have no such laws here.
With regards to lawsuits, that is civil law and not criminal law. If you make up malicious lies about someone, you could be required to pay them damages. This is not a criminal offense, it is a tort.
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typical con wrote:
protestingisgood wrote:
Guests can have their temporary guest passes (visas) revoked. Citizens do not have temporary guest passes, as they have a legal right to be here.
If you interpret that as them not having rights, than that is just they way you see it I guess.
So what rights do "temporary guest pass" holders have?
Right to a fair trial? Right to privacy?
They have both of those rights, the one right they do not have is the right to remain here.
Again, these people are not being charged with a crime, there is no trial to be had. They had a temporary pass to be here, and that pass is no longer valid.
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protestingisgood wrote:
typical con wrote:
So what rights do "temporary guest pass" holders have?
Right to a fair trial? Right to privacy?
They have both of those rights, the one right they do not have is the right to remain here.
Again, these people are not being charged with a crime, there is no trial to be had. They had a temporary pass to be here, and that pass is no longer valid.
It's odd that you think non-citizens have some basic rights like rights to a fair trial, and rights to privacy. But other basic rights like freedom of speech are restricted. If you can have your visa ripped up for expressing your opinions, then that person doesn't have freedom of speech.
And once they start ripping visas up for arbitrary reasons, they start ripping up green cards, then naturalized citizenships, then dual citizens, and finally - you.
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you will obey.... wrote:
Wrongthink is punishable to keep society in line.Technically we still have Free Speech in the U.S. But, not to worry: He will get around to that eventually, maybe in his next term, posthumously.
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On the bright side, it doesnt matter, does it? Nobody cares about or listens to anything that doesnt fit their narrative anyway do they?
Well....do they?00
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