It is good but there are half a dozen guys in the world who can do it.
It doesn’t matter if somebody “can” do it. The point is that they do. Most observation on who “can” do it are just half - arsed predictions anyway that have no credibility.
Great post.
Having the potential to do something has nothing to do with actually getting it done.
It doesn’t matter if somebody “can” do it. The point is that they do. Most observation on who “can” do it are just half - arsed predictions anyway that have no credibility.
Great post.
Having the potential to do something has nothing to do with actually getting it done.
Actually it does. If you don’t have the potential you cannot do it period. So it is clear it has something to do with it.
I have always held onto the belief that Jakob's road to another 1500m world title is to take it relatively easy for the first 700m and then make the last 800m an ultimate endurance grind ala el g. Glad he practiced it. Btw el g only Olympic 1500m win was also a 3:34 race. Though that was a 1:46 last 800m, Jakob had a 1500m final, 3000 heat as well as another 1500m en route so who knows how much he could've run faster. No guarantee (even El g barely held off Lagat then), but at least more reliable or even viable than frontrunning or sit-and-kick.
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You're new to this sport aren't you. PR's aren't absolute, they are a current data point. Fisher has huge upside. Besides, 1500m times don't matter when it comes to a kicking. Fisher proved that against Hocker.
No. The point is that potential has nothing to do with a mark actually run.
There is no list for potential best marks; only best marks. Races run.
If a runner has the potential to do something and never does it, he/she never got it done. Potential is an abstract. Does not count for anything. Races run and won win medals.
No. The point is that potential has nothing to do with a mark actually run.
There is no list for potential best marks; only best marks. Races run.
If a runner has the potential to do something and never does it, he/she never got it done. Potential is an abstract. Does not count for anything. Races run and won win medals.
Sir—this is an Internet message board. We aren’t competing for national, continental, or global championships.
Discussing hypothetical matchups, athlete potential, woulda/coulda/shoulda etc makes the board and interesting.
I defy you to find more than a couple other people, if that, who have ever done that.
Well to be fair George Mills closed in 2.20.21 - it's not like Jakob wiped the floor with him here. I mean he's a very good runner but not sure I would put him as one of the worlds top 10 over 3000m right? (given a full strength lineup including the top Ethiopian trio + Kejelcha). I also have Mills running his last 1500m right at 3.36.0, Jakob 3.34.8 - not a massive difference today. I would add I think this resembled more of a training exercise for Jakob than it did George (or anyone else in the field). Maybe Jakob really desperate and dropping the hammer get's a another second up the track?
To be honest, I think it's not difficult to imagine at least another 4-5 of even todays best guys able to hang on that and run a 2.19.0 if they needed to. I'm not saying that in a hypothetical head to head Jakob doesn't still win because I think he does, but when you look at what Mills did and put it all into context - not as far fetched as it seems.
Sir—this is an Internet message board. We aren’t competing for national, continental, or global championships. Discussing hypothetical matchups, athlete potential, woulda/coulda/shoulda etc makes the board and interesting.
I understand that and was agreeing with the initial poster who said "it doesn't matter what someone "can do" its what someone actually runs (paraphrasing). Enormous difference.
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I understand that and was agreeing with the initial poster who said "it doesn't matter what someone "can do" its what some actually runs (paraphrasing). Enormous difference.
Yeah and you are both incorrect. There are things Jakob has done that possibly nobody else can do. This ain’t one of them. These are distinctions which can be made.
I understand that and was agreeing with the initial poster who said "it doesn't matter what someone "can do" its what some actually runs (paraphrasing). Enormous difference.
Yeah and you are both incorrect. There are things Jakob has done that possibly nobody else can do. This ain’t one of them. These are distinctions which can be made.
We are correct. There is a difference between potential and performance. That is inarguable.
I agree with you that others can do some things that Jake is capable of and not other things.
I hope some of you recognize that the first 2000m was run at a pace which Jakob Kiplimo could possibly run for 25K, as it is slower than his half marathon pace.
I defy you to find more than a couple other people, if that, who have ever done that.
Well to be fair George Mills closed in 2.20.21 - it's not like Jakob wiped the floor with him here. I mean he's a very good runner but not sure I would put him as one of the worlds top 10 over 3000m right? (given a full strength lineup including the top Ethiopian trio + Kejelcha). I also have Mills running his last 1500m right at 3.36.0, Jakob 3.34.8 - not a massive difference today. I would add I think this resembled more of a training exercise for Jakob than it did George (or anyone else in the field). Maybe Jakob really desperate and dropping the hammer get's a another second up the track?
To be honest, I think it's not difficult to imagine at least another 4-5 of even todays best guys able to hang on that and run a 2.19.0 if they needed to. I'm not saying that in a hypothetical head to head Jakob doesn't still win because I think he does, but when you look at what Mills did and put it all into context - not as far fetched as it seems.
absolutely, and that's the way it works in races like this. everybody talks about ElGs 1:46.9 or whatever close, but rarely is it mentioned that there was TWO other guys there who also ran final 800 splits that boggle the mind. Of course only ElG was without a pacer/draft help for all 1:46.9 of that
Well to be fair George Mills closed in 2.20.21 - it's not like Jakob wiped the floor with him here. I mean he's a very good runner but not sure I would put him as one of the worlds top 10 over 3000m right? (given a full strength lineup including the top Ethiopian trio + Kejelcha). I also have Mills running his last 1500m right at 3.36.0, Jakob 3.34.8 - not a massive difference today. I would add I think this resembled more of a training exercise for Jakob than it did George (or anyone else in the field). Maybe Jakob really desperate and dropping the hammer get's a another second up the track?
To be honest, I think it's not difficult to imagine at least another 4-5 of even todays best guys able to hang on that and run a 2.19.0 if they needed to. I'm not saying that in a hypothetical head to head Jakob doesn't still win because I think he does, but when you look at what Mills did and put it all into context - not as far fetched as it seems.
absolutely, and that's the way it works in races like this. everybody talks about ElGs 1:46.9 or whatever close, but rarely is it mentioned that there was TWO other guys there who also ran final 800 splits that boggle the mind. Of course only ElG was without a pacer/draft help for all 1:46.9 of that
IIRC, the bronze medalist actually closed the fastest with a 1:46.3.
absolutely, and that's the way it works in races like this. everybody talks about ElGs 1:46.9 or whatever close, but rarely is it mentioned that there was TWO other guys there who also ran final 800 splits that boggle the mind. Of course only ElG was without a pacer/draft help for all 1:46.9 of that
Exactly - the most forgotten thing about that race (sorry to drag this slightly off topic) is that you can make a solid argument Rui Silva blew winning the Olympic title here.
Because even though El G front ran 1.46.9 crossing 700m in 1.47.4, Silva clearly crosses in 1.48.2 so probably runs 1.46.4 (WTF EP.... nevermind) for his final 800m and if you watch how and where he runs it, it's scarcely believable. Because for the penultimate lap he's all over the place in lane 2 - almost into lane 3 at points on the bends and then makes up about a second alone in the final 350m having to pass the entire field doing so.
On the flipside if he is in that lead spot where El G with 2 laps to run do I think he controls it so well and holds those guys off? Absolutely not.
You're new to this sport aren't you. PR's aren't absolute, they are a current data point. Fisher has huge upside. Besides, 1500m times don't matter when it comes to a kicking. Fisher proved that against Hocker.
Sounds more like you’re the one who’s new. Fisher does not have huge upside in the 1500m. His 3:33 PB was set just a week before he ran 7:22. And of course time matters in this context. Someone who runs 3:33.9 in peak shape isn’t likely to be able to close a 3k in 3:34. It’s common sense.
Why don´t you list the current and retired runners you think could do it and then produce some evidence for your claim.
I don´t say you are wrong (I don´t know) but you must provide some numbers to make your claim probable.
I don´t think thare are many runners who have closed a 3000m in low 2:19.
I wouldn’t call a 3000m that starts in 4:14 to be anything but a 1500, and it was very close to being a fresh start with 1500m to go. Ingebrigtsen and maybe some others could have run 3:30ish in that rate.
Last year at this time he was still working back from injury, and now he’s in the best indoor shape of his life by a wide margin. I think we’re going to see things this summer that make his 2024 season look ordinary.