2025 California T&F Thread

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10 months ago 01/04/2025 4:11am EST

re: 4 by eight

4 by eight wrote:
Which team has the best 4x800?
According to athletic.net,
Great Oak returns 1:52, 1:53, 1:56, 1:57. I think they will be hungry after being screwed over at the XC state meet.
JSerra looks better though. They return 1:49, 1:55 (transfer), another 1:55, 1:56, 1:57, 1:59. It’s crazy that 4 of them are only juniors now.
Jesuit returns 6 under 2 minutes

Great Oak has had injury problems season after season over the last few years. Also, Doug Soles is still sowing discord on the GO team from Utah (telling people to skip practice, do their own workouts, ect) so theres gonna be some BS happening on that team this year.

I like JSerra's chances if Morales doesn't go down again, but I have the most confidence in Jesuit. All of their guys had amazing XC seasons, huge steps up from the year before, and Walt Lange is one of the best coaches, if not the best coach in California.

Additional teams to watch out for, ranked by my opinion.

1. Glendora: Made NXN. Their slowest returner ran 2:03 last year, but comes into the season having gone from 15:45 to 15:04. on Woodward. The 1:54 returner, Kevin Sandoval, went from 16:37 to 15:20 on Woodward. The 2:01 returner, Dylan Flores, went from 15:21 to 14:59 on Woodward.

2. Monache: Returns 4 at 2:01 or faster, which isn't particularly impressive but man... you gotta see the XC seasons those guys had. If they stay healthy, they are gonna go crazy.

3. Loyola: Returns 4 under 2 mins with huge upside on two of the guys, who are 4x800 runners. Another one of their runners went from 16:42 to 15:27 over 5k this XC season.

4. Menlo: Made NXN. They return all of their top 4, with each having leveled up this XC season considerably. their #5, freshman Oliver Olbekson, is a monster in track. The only thing that holds them back is that Landon Pretre will almost certainly pursue the 3200 instead of the 4x800 during the postseason.

5. Matilda Torres: Returns 4 at 2:02 or faster, all of whom had great XC seasons.

6. Mountain View: Very deep squad with enormous improvement in like, all of their top 10 guys. Returns a very young, very fast group eager to make a name for themselves on the track.

7. Bellarmine: Returns 4 at 2:02 or faster, all of whom had great XC seasons. Questionable periodization. Sorry, said what I said.

Speaking of the 4x800, it's placement between the 3200 and 4x400 is still an abomination. I appreciate you getting the 4x800 added CoachB, but why did it have to be there 😭🙏??

10 months ago 01/04/2025 4:16am EST

re: Its good to be really fast

Its good to be really fast wrote:
mictlantecuhtli wrote:
Stuff to watch out for this year, Girls side:
- The girls 800 was unusually deep last year, with a number running sub 2:10 and sub 2:08 last year. Keaton Robar, who had a late peak last year, leads the group.
- Sisters Makenna and Morgan Herbst, the defending 300mh champion who went undefeated last year, of Carlsbad offer a devastating 1-2 punch in the 800 and 300 hurdles.
Makenna Herbst will beat Keaton Robar and all the other girls at State. And Makenna will also win a national championship in the 800. She is waaay more talented than people realize.

I like her odds. She's already run 1:29 in the 600, a national leader, indoors and outdoors. You mentioned she's talented AF, any insight into her training and progression history? It looks like she was a 400m runner for most of HS before moving up.

10 months ago 01/04/2025 4:30am EST

re: Tyris19

Tyris19 wrote:
TooOld4HS wrote:
Although I believe that Sadie made the right move to end her HS career, I wonder if the less then stupendos NXN results played a big factor. Hard to claim you are the bomb when in the biggest CC race each year you run in you finish poorly.
Not to mention Sadie will be just a tad short of 19 at the time the CA season is over. Time to move on.
She turns 19 in August next year... she'll still be months away from 19 when she graduates HS. That's fairly common. She's not that old bro lol

It’s NOT common to be 19 before you start your freshman year of college. It’s more common to be 17. She should already be a freshman right now.

Did she get held back in grade school ?

10 months ago 01/04/2025 10:41am EST

re: you'll never know

Some more potential dark horses in the 4x800 - some of them probably won’t win but they could make things interesting

Beckman. They won Clovis handily, and after that, they were ranked top 5 in the country until the sections and state meet when Nguyen has injury problems. They return 3 guys under 2, and 3 just over, which includes two transfers that joined their varsity. Many of those guys have improved in the fall.

Oaks Christian. Had a historic cross country season. Won the first boys XC state title in D4. Also was top 5 in the overall merge. They have 2 low sticks Yoder and McNee and a couple of more guys under 2:02. They had 5 guys under 15:50 in cross so they had guys who made big jumps from spring 2024

Yosemite. Not a great XC team last fall because they lacked a 5th man, but barring injury, they still have 4 talented seniors, which is how many a 4x800 team needs - Olney twins, Stegge, Ruiz. This team probably won’t win, but will likely do better than it did during cross country

10 months ago 01/04/2025 10:43am EST

re: Grandma Freshman

Grandma Freshman wrote:
Tyris19 wrote:
She turns 19 in August next year... she'll still be months away from 19 when she graduates HS. That's fairly common. She's not that old bro lol
It’s NOT common to be 19 before you start your freshman year of college. It’s more common to be 17. She should already be a freshman right now.
Did she get held back in grade school ?

She is not only running faster than others, but also just aging a bit faster.

10 months ago 01/04/2025 12:30pm EST

re: you'll never know

you\'ll never know wrote:
Also, Doug Soles is still sowing discord on the GO team from Utah (telling people to skip practice, do their own workouts, ect) so theres gonna be some BS happening on that team this year.

No idea where you’re getting this from

#27

This post was removed.

10 months ago 01/04/2025 2:50pm EST

re: you'll never know

you\'ll never know wrote:
Its good to be really fast wrote:
Makenna Herbst will beat Keaton Robar and all the other girls at State. And Makenna will also win a national championship in the 800. She is waaay more talented than people realize.
I like her odds. She's already run 1:29 in the 600, a national leader, indoors and outdoors. You mentioned she's talented AF, any insight into her training and progression history?
It looks like she was a 400m runner for most of HS before moving up.

For the last 3 years Makenna Herbst only ran in the winter (club) and spring (school.) She didn't run in the summer or fall. After focusing on the 400 her freshman and sophomore years, she got more interested in the 800 last year because she wanted to see if she might be better at the 800 than the 400. She ended up running 2:06 which was only 3 seconds behind the national leader.

This year is the first time she is training all year round which is how she was able to run a 1:29 600 in Dec 2024 as opposed to the 1:39 600 she ran in Dec 2023. She obviously won't knock 10 seconds off her 800 time this year but she should be able to run at least 2:03.

10 months ago 01/04/2025 3:07pm EST

re: you'll never know

Speaking of the 4x800, it's placement between the 3200 and 4x400 is still an abomination. I appreciate you getting the 4x800 added CoachB, but why did it have to be there 😭🙏??

I don't think that was up to him. He advocated for it being on day 1 of the state meet but they turned it down. In the SJS that's what they do though

10 months ago 01/04/2025 3:10pm EST

re: Grandma Freshman

Grandma Freshman wrote:
It’s NOT common to be 19 before you start your freshman year of college. It’s more common to be 17. She should already be a freshman right now.
Did she get held back in grade school ?

My God, this discussion again. No, actually, it is quite common to be 18-19 going into college (less so if you are 17), especially over the last decade as many states have pushed for earlier cutoff dates. The California cutoff today is 9/1 and Sadie is only days older than that, which would make sense as to why she may've been "held back"

10 months ago 01/04/2025 3:11pm EST

re: you'll never know

you'll never know wrote:
Great Oak has had injury problems season after season over the last few years. Also, Doug Soles is still sowing discord on the GO team from Utah (telling people to skip practice, do their own workouts, ect) so theres gonna be some BS happening on that team this year.
I like JSerra's chances if Morales doesn't go down again, but I have the most confidence in Jesuit. All of their guys had amazing XC seasons, huge steps up from the year before, and Walt Lange is one of the best coaches, if not the best coach in California.
Additional teams to watch out for, ranked by my opinion.
1. Glendora: Made NXN. Their slowest returner ran 2:03 last year, but comes into the season having gone from 15:45 to 15:04. on Woodward. The 1:54 returner, Kevin Sandoval, went from 16:37 to 15:20 on Woodward. The 2:01 returner, Dylan Flores, went from 15:21 to 14:59 on Woodward.
2. Monache: Returns 4 at 2:01 or faster, which isn't particularly impressive but man... you gotta see the XC seasons those guys had. If they stay healthy, they are gonna go crazy.
3. Loyola: Returns 4 under 2 mins with huge upside on two of the guys, who are 4x800 runners. Another one of their runners went from 16:42 to 15:27 over 5k this XC season.
4. Menlo: Made NXN. They return all of their top 4, with each having leveled up this XC season considerably. their #5, freshman Oliver Olbekson, is a monster in track. The only thing that holds them back is that Landon Pretre will almost certainly pursue the 3200 instead of the 4x800 during the postseason.
5. Matilda Torres: Returns 4 at 2:02 or faster, all of whom had great XC seasons.
6. Mountain View: Very deep squad with enormous improvement in like, all of their top 10 guys. Returns a very young, very fast group eager to make a name for themselves on the track.
7. Bellarmine: Returns 4 at 2:02 or faster, all of whom had great XC seasons. Questionable periodization. Sorry, said what I said.
Speaking of the 4x800, it's placement between the 3200 and 4x400 is still an abomination. I appreciate you getting the 4x800 added CoachB, but why did it have to be there 😭🙏??

SJS Jesuit is super close to my section and they are absolute monster recently. Lots of underclassmen last year who went from sub 2:00 to sub 16. They will be ones to watch out for within the next few years for sure.

10 months ago 01/04/2025 3:12pm EST

re: Tyris19

Tyris19 wrote:
Grandma Freshman wrote:
It’s NOT common to be 19 before you start your freshman year of college. It’s more common to be 17. She should already be a freshman right now.
Did she get held back in grade school ?
My God, this discussion again. No, actually, it is quite common to be 18-19 going into college (less so if you are 17), especially over the last decade as many states have pushed for earlier cutoff dates. The California cutoff today is 9/1 and Sadie is only days older than that, which would make sense as to why she may've been "held back"

And yes, granted Sadie is still a bit on the older side but regardless, kids in C/O 2025 who are born 1-2 weeks later in September 2006 will also be turning 19 right as they start college.

10 months ago 01/04/2025 3:14pm EST

re: Tyris19

Tyris19 wrote:
Grandma Freshman wrote:
It’s NOT common to be 19 before you start your freshman year of college. It’s more common to be 17. She should already be a freshman right now.
Did she get held back in grade school ?
My God, this discussion again. No, actually, it is quite common to be 18-19 going into college (less so if you are 17), especially over the last decade as many states have pushed for earlier cutoff dates. The California cutoff today is 9/1 and Sadie is only days older than that, which would make sense as to why she may've been "held back"

It’s not common to be 19 when you are entering college. Why is it a big deal that she got left behind or started late. Ultimately she’s not a high school age anthlete and it was a good choice to skip track for her high school when she clearly should be a current freshman in college.

10 months ago 01/04/2025 3:49pm EST

re: Turis2old

Turis2old wrote:
It’s not common to be 19 when you are entering college. Why is it a big deal that she got left behind or started late. Ultimately she’s not a high school age anthlete and it was a good choice to skip track for her high school when she clearly should be a current freshman in college.

She is literally 18 her entire senior year of HS. That is a normal age for a HS senior. When a student graduates highschool at 19, then yes it’s a bit different. However Sadie does not fall into that category.

It’s no big deal yes but also understand it doesn’t make sense nor is it fair to assume she should already be in college just because she is a bit older

Eyan Turk (the D5 state champion) is also born August 2006 and he ran 14:32

10 months ago 01/04/2025 3:51pm EST

re: LetsRun.com

If anything, Broen Holman is the one who should be in college. That dude turned 19 in NOVEMBER last year. He'll be turning 20 his first year of college, which is absurd

10 months ago 01/04/2025 5:58pm EST

re: Tyris19

Tyris19 wrote:
If anything, Broen Holman is the one who should be in college. That dude turned 19 in NOVEMBER last year. He'll be turning 20 his first year of college, which is absurd

Found in a thread about him that he repeated a grade because COVID took a way a lot of opportunities

10 months ago 01/04/2025 6:36pm EST

re: 4 by eight

4 by eight wrote:
Found in a thread about him that he repeated a grade because COVID took a way a lot of opportunities

I call BS. If it was so easy for him to be able to repeat a grade, why didn't everyone else?

10 months ago 01/04/2025 11:50pm EST

re: you'll never know

you'll never know wrote:
Great Oak has had injury problems season after season over the last few years. Also, Doug Soles is still sowing discord on the GO team from Utah (telling people to skip practice, do their own workouts, ect) so theres gonna be some BS happening on that team this year.

I have had zero interaction with anyone from GO this school year at all. I wish nothing but the best for their program, but I have moved on. I have worked with some of their competitors though that have made huge jumps as a team in XC.

Coach Soles

10 months ago 01/05/2025 12:24am EST

re: mictlantecuhtli

Alden goes to Jserra

10 months ago 01/05/2025 1:06am EST

re: Tyris19

Tyris19 wrote:
TooOld4HS wrote:
Although I believe that Sadie made the right move to end her HS career, I wonder if the less then stupendos NXN results played a big factor. Hard to claim you are the bomb when in the biggest CC race each year you run in you finish poorly.
Not to mention Sadie will be just a tad short of 19 at the time the CA season is over. Time to move on.
She turns 19 in August next year... she'll still be months away from 19 when she graduates HS. That's fairly common. She's not that old bro lol

I will never understand the obsession with age. I was born in late august and was not withheld for a year.

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