You talk about him like you know him and have some inside info. This is some big talk from someone who almost certainly hasn't run a 2:08, nor has coached someone to a 2:08.
I know his training, which is on Strava. It’s the training of someone who could be doing better
Which makes it weird that you would misrepresent his training here. I pulled a random week.
total - 123 mi
Sept 16 - am 12.8 , pm 5.7
Sept 17 - am 4x ~400, 4:40 down to 4:05 pace. 3 x 2 mi - 9:25, 9:35, 9:04. pm- Mini Vo2 Workout. 3x400 (4:30-4:40) w/u +6x600 @ VO2 (~4:05)+ 3x400 easy (4:30) + 4x100m
Sept 18 - am 8, pm 4
Sept 19 - am 10, pm 7.24
Sept 20 - am 3x400, 5mi (23:40), 1 mi threshold (4:43), 1 mi progressive (4:31), pm 9
(2) His training is mostly long marathon-paced tempos with very little work at half-marathon/10k
Does that make him a bad runner? No, it's obvious that he is a physical and mental specimen and that he can run marathons faster than 99.9% of the population.
But he is a 2:09-2:10 runner in a 2:06-2:07 body. With better training, he could easily run 2:06-2:07.
He seems fairly independent and autonomous, and he wouldn't resist this. but it wouldn't take much. It would mean that he would include half-marathon/10k training or "CV" pace (so like 15k pace) every 10 days instead of once a month
He won't do it, though
You talk about him like you know him and have some inside info. This is some big talk from someone who almost certainly hasn't run a 2:08, nor has coached someone to a 2:08.
Big talk and no walk, is the nature of the LRC message board...
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"The Olympics aren't the only destination an athlete should go f
Maybe the cusp of Olympic trials but not enough is CJ's ceiling, he knows it, and would prefer to run races he enjoys and not worry so much about qualifying for a race he probably can't qualify for.
Some people can have rewarding running careers without chasing Olympic and World medals. Other than people like readers here and maybe (for a couple of moments) casuals watching the Olympics, who really cares anyway if he does or not?
But he’s not a hobby jogger like us, he’s always going to be in the elite or sub elite group of marathons he runs but always chasing the winners and guys who are a notch above him, he’s a competitor who seems he’s always on the fringe but will never taste true glory, seems like a poor way to live and for your mental and should either improve or quit. There are tons of smaller marathons he could run instead too rather than biggest ones
So he runs races a step down where he's not chasing guys who will always be faster than him, he's winning those, and he enjoys it.
Why is this a problem for you? It doesn't seem to be a problem for him.
are you smoking crack? What is holding him back? Why do letsrun posters ask the dumbest questions when a runner who competed at the highest of levels in 5 different marathons in 2024 including CIM, has NOTHING holding him back. When you can drop a 2:10.06 in your 5th marathon in a year you are truly world-class. Letsrun posters...stop being idiots. Go out and run a 2:10.06 ONCE then come back and and allow someone else to write about you being "held back" and not matching up with America's best. SMH.
are you smoking crack? What is holding him back? Why do letsrun posters ask the dumbest questions when a runner who competed at the highest of levels in 5 different marathons in 2024 including CIM, has NOTHING holding him back. When you can drop a 2:10.06 in your 5th marathon in a year you are truly world-class. Letsrun posters...stop being idiots. Go out and run a 2:10.06 ONCE then come back and and allow someone else to write about you being "held back" and not matching up with America's best. SMH.
exactly, that's my point. He is world class. But he should race less and train better in order to try to maximize these next four years before the 2028 olympics and before he ages out of being this good
I know his training, which is on Strava. It’s the training of someone who could be doing better
Which makes it weird that you would misrepresent his training here. I pulled a random week.
total - 123 mi
Sept 16 - am 12.8 , pm 5.7
Sept 17 - am 4x ~400, 4:40 down to 4:05 pace. 3 x 2 mi - 9:25, 9:35, 9:04. pm- Mini Vo2 Workout. 3x400 (4:30-4:40) w/u +6x600 @ VO2 (~4:05)+ 3x400 easy (4:30) + 4x100m
Sept 18 - am 8, pm 4
Sept 19 - am 10, pm 7.24
Sept 20 - am 3x400, 5mi (23:40), 1 mi threshold (4:43), 1 mi progressive (4:31), pm 9
Sept 21 - am 8
Sept 22 - 26, with 24 at 5:04 pace
I'm not gonna look through all his training but I don't think this week is a great argument. I browsed his strava a bit and this would be my take: he does long and fast LR's and it's true he does a lot of faster than MP work too, but he breaks up that faster work into too many intervals and different sessions.
If he did only 2 marathons a year ( just hypothetically -- I understand he doesn't want to) then he could do the training he's doing now for a phase but then also have a phase of training where the LR's are easier, there's little to no Vo2max sessions, but the 10k-HMP work is cranked up in difficulty: higher volume, faster pace, more continuous. Not saying it can't still be intervals and different sessions, but it should trend toward longer intervals and shorter rests and fewer (but longer) sessions.
Like he's got this 12 x 1200m session w/ 90s rest where he averaged around 4:40 pace for the first 9 and did the last 3 faster (4:33, 4:36, 4:28). I'd say shorten the rest to 75s or even 60s and aim to average 4:35 for all 12. If that's a "race effort" workout then so be it -- take an extra easy day to prepare for it and an extra easy day after to recover from it. If he had an 8 week training block where he's really pushing the pace and volume of these faster-than-MP sessions, and reducing the rest between intervals, that'd be more likely to result in adaptation for a faster MP than more and more 5:00 LR's and 400's and 600's or whatever.
To me he seems super happy and actually enjoys what he is doing. Very refreshing.
Social media has created a whole space for pro runners complaining about everything. Seems like CJ has balance in his life. A wife, kids, job outside of marathoning.
Hey he probably made a few grand to drive up to Sacramento and run a race in front of family and friends. Had a BIG year of racing. Maybe he will target one fast race but seems like he has this more figured out than the rest of us
Which makes it weird that you would misrepresent his training here. I pulled a random week.
total - 123 mi
Sept 16 - am 12.8 , pm 5.7
Sept 17 - am 4x ~400, 4:40 down to 4:05 pace. 3 x 2 mi - 9:25, 9:35, 9:04. pm- Mini Vo2 Workout. 3x400 (4:30-4:40) w/u +6x600 @ VO2 (~4:05)+ 3x400 easy (4:30) + 4x100m
Sept 18 - am 8, pm 4
Sept 19 - am 10, pm 7.24
Sept 20 - am 3x400, 5mi (23:40), 1 mi threshold (4:43), 1 mi progressive (4:31), pm 9
Sept 21 - am 8
Sept 22 - 26, with 24 at 5:04 pace
I'm not gonna look through all his training but I don't think this week is a great argument. I browsed his strava a bit and this would be my take: he does long and fast LR's and it's true he does a lot of faster than MP work too, but he breaks up that faster work into too many intervals and different sessions.
If he did only 2 marathons a year ( just hypothetically -- I understand he doesn't want to) then he could do the training he's doing now for a phase but then also have a phase of training where the LR's are easier, there's little to no Vo2max sessions, but the 10k-HMP work is cranked up in difficulty: higher volume, faster pace, more continuous. Not saying it can't still be intervals and different sessions, but it should trend toward longer intervals and shorter rests and fewer (but longer) sessions.
Like he's got this 12 x 1200m session w/ 90s rest where he averaged around 4:40 pace for the first 9 and did the last 3 faster (4:33, 4:36, 4:28). I'd say shorten the rest to 75s or even 60s and aim to average 4:35 for all 12. If that's a "race effort" workout then so be it -- take an extra easy day to prepare for it and an extra easy day after to recover from it. If he had an 8 week training block where he's really pushing the pace and volume of these faster-than-MP sessions, and reducing the rest between intervals, that'd be more likely to result in adaptation for a faster MP than more and more 5:00 LR's and 400's and 600's or whatever.
exactly this. Mantz can run 45 flat for 10 miles but only 2:08 for the marathon. If CJ trained to be able to run that 10 mile pace, he could run 2:06
I'm not gonna look through all his training but I don't think this week is a great argument. I browsed his strava a bit and this would be my take: he does long and fast LR's and it's true he does a lot of faster than MP work too, but he breaks up that faster work into too many intervals and different sessions.
If he did only 2 marathons a year ( just hypothetically -- I understand he doesn't want to) then he could do the training he's doing now for a phase but then also have a phase of training where the LR's are easier, there's little to no Vo2max sessions, but the 10k-HMP work is cranked up in difficulty: higher volume, faster pace, more continuous. Not saying it can't still be intervals and different sessions, but it should trend toward longer intervals and shorter rests and fewer (but longer) sessions.
Like he's got this 12 x 1200m session w/ 90s rest where he averaged around 4:40 pace for the first 9 and did the last 3 faster (4:33, 4:36, 4:28). I'd say shorten the rest to 75s or even 60s and aim to average 4:35 for all 12. If that's a "race effort" workout then so be it -- take an extra easy day to prepare for it and an extra easy day after to recover from it. If he had an 8 week training block where he's really pushing the pace and volume of these faster-than-MP sessions, and reducing the rest between intervals, that'd be more likely to result in adaptation for a faster MP than more and more 5:00 LR's and 400's and 600's or whatever.
exactly this. Mantz can run 45 flat for 10 miles but only 2:08 for the marathon. If CJ trained to be able to run that 10 mile pace, he could run 2:06
I mean why not have some fun and be the best American marathoner? Klecker is currently in a half-marathon training block to run a sub 60 half-marathon--he may or may not be able to do so, but his attempt to do so will catapult him to a marathon capability that is echelons above where CJ could be despite his slower relative 10k/5k PRs to Klecker etc
exactly this. Mantz can run 45 flat for 10 miles but only 2:08 for the marathon. If CJ trained to be able to run that 10 mile pace, he could run 2:06
I mean why not have some fun and be the best American marathoner? Klecker is currently in a half-marathon training block to run a sub 60 half-marathon--he may or may not be able to do so, but his attempt to do so will catapult him to a marathon capability that is echelons above where CJ could be despite his slower relative 10k/5k PRs to Klecker etc
*echelons above where CJ is, but where CJ could be
What’s keeping Albertson below Connor manta and Clayton young’s level? He’s a great guy but seems like he’s always running 2:10ish and always on the cusp, like with the Olympic trials and not breaking into Olympic standard territory. Is he running too many marathons and not training enough? He ran nyc too
2:08:13 at Chicago, 2:10:57 at NYC, 2:10:03 at CIM in the span of less than 2 months. The Olympic standard window isn't open, so there's no need to chase a time. Maybe he prefers to race a lot and pick up paychecks.
What's keeping him from Mantz's and Young's level? You can't compare guys with potentially different talent levels. Mantz was a 2-time XC champion. I don't know that CJ even made XC nationals and he was only a 13:50 5k guy.
I was at the race and I think I overheard his wife at the finish line talking about how he was just doing the race for the paycheck.
Not long ago, CJ was asked about legacy. He stated: "To be quite honest, realistically I don’t believe I’m going to leave much of a legacy. With access to so much information and the ability to watch anyone in the world almost at any time, very few people will be remembered in “legacy” terms. People just move on from things quickly. Ultimately, I just enjoy running and racing. Some people seem to enjoy watching me race or talking with me at an event, and we’re all a part of the current community of runners. For the most part, I don’t think it needs to be any more than that. Just enjoy it, connect with people, and make the most of the moments. The only realistic long-term legacy is a financial one for my children. Because I’m able to run and have two incomes, I can put money into my children’s accounts each month to help them out when they’re adults. So prize money, bonuses, etc. gives me extra motivation when I’m competing."
Some will argue his racing frequency results in poor times.
With the above statement, it sounds like he's well aware of that and is at peace with it. He loves to run, and he wants to ensure his children are taken care of.
But if senpai was that forward thinking he wouldn't have gone to Arizona State and instead gone to a top tier university via recruitment and got a much more lucrative job. In sports like football and basketball you see players good enough to play division 1 but no shot of going pro and they go to schools like kentucky, alabama, gonzaga, ohio state.
It's the ones who go to Ivy league tier universities like Duke and Stanford who are planning for their future because they can use that degree and pedigree to get lucrative jobs in finance, business or literally whatever. Take graham blanks coming out of Harvard from having done it right. If he turns out to be a bust his life is still set literally just from his harvard name
If senpai's children are as talented athletically as he is one can hope he teaches them not to make the same mistake he did
I love the quote from Albertson that you're responding to and also am really glad I don't know the kind of snobs your post makes you out to be. It appears that he doesn't want a more lucrative job. He loves to run, learned he is good enough at it to earn enough of a living doing it while also puting money aside for his kids. Gosh, what a waste of a life, having fun while providing a decent living for yourself and your kids.
Just stuff the bit about people going to top tier universities planning for their futures as if no one else is. The people I taught in community colleges were planning for their futures.
What’s keeping Albertson below Connor manta and Clayton young’s level? He’s a great guy but seems like he’s always running 2:10ish and always on the cusp, like with the Olympic trials and not breaking into Olympic standard territory. Is he running too many marathons and not training enough? He ran nyc too
He races way too freaking much. He needs to learn periodization and how to lay all the marbles out on the table instead of holding something back. What's his next race? Houston, he's probably sad he has to go 6 weeks between marathons if so.
are you smoking crack? What is holding him back? Why do letsrun posters ask the dumbest questions when a runner who competed at the highest of levels in 5 different marathons in 2024 including CIM, has NOTHING holding him back. When you can drop a 2:10.06 in your 5th marathon in a year you are truly world-class. Letsrun posters...stop being idiots. Go out and run a 2:10.06 ONCE then come back and and allow someone else to write about you being "held back" and not matching up with America's best. SMH.
But if senpai was that forward thinking he wouldn't have gone to Arizona State and instead gone to a top tier university via recruitment and got a much more lucrative job. In sports like football and basketball you see players good enough to play division 1 but no shot of going pro and they go to schools like kentucky, alabama, gonzaga, ohio state.
It's the ones who go to Ivy league tier universities like Duke and Stanford who are planning for their future because they can use that degree and pedigree to get lucrative jobs in finance, business or literally whatever. Take graham blanks coming out of Harvard from having done it right. If he turns out to be a bust his life is still set literally just from his harvard name
If senpai's children are as talented athletically as he is one can hope he teaches them not to make the same mistake he did
I love the quote from Albertson that you're responding to and also am really glad I don't know the kind of snobs your post makes you out to be. It appears that he doesn't want a more lucrative job. He loves to run, learned he is good enough at it to earn enough of a living doing it while also puting money aside for his kids. Gosh, what a waste of a life, having fun while providing a decent living for yourself and your kids.
Just stuff the bit about people going to top tier universities planning for their futures as if no one else is. The people I taught in community colleges were planning for their futures.
He would be able to provide much better for his kids if he ran faster
did you really just write "but only 2:08 for the marathon". Can you run a 3:08 marathon? Do you realize how fit you have to be to even run a 3:08? 2:08 is on a whole different level kind of fitness. Letsrun posters are the best.....SMH