sometimes i wonder if there is a higher percentage of haters among those with average talent, sub-elite talent, elite talent or international-class talent
it's unfortunate that when it comes to doping the only athletes we can 100% trust are those who openly admit to using
so while i recognize it's possible Hull is in fact doping, i really wish people were more open to how changing one's environment can impact their performance
i'm a rather extreme case myself having made dramatic improvements with a change in setting and altitude, so tend to give the benefit of the doubt to other athletes who go through a major life change and see a big jump in performance
another example of a sudden breakthrough that isn't all that uncommon is after a young runner gets married
we all know how powerful hate or anger can be during a race, and that's great in short bursts, but for longevity and longt erm success love goes a long way in between the races
Same here--dramatic improvements with moving to a town that is perfect for me, having a long period with just a steady feeling of contentedness and minimal stress, and having a supportive partner. Nothing about my training really changed during that time, and obviously I can be 100% sure I wasn't doping. Yes, none of this means Hull isn't doping, but I do think her explanation is at least plausible.
That explains a seven-second improvement in one year. At 27.
🙈
Clearly there are no professional athletes posting on this thread (nor am I one). It’s pretty clear no one here understands what it’s like to be living on the knife-edge of professional athletics training. Every single aspect of your life is devoted to extracting the absolute maximum performance out of your body, without tipping over the edge to illness, exhaustion, or injury. Sometimes a change of scenery, like being able to order a flat white among friends, surrounded by people with the same accent, is the magic elixir you need to take your focus off your training and find that late career 3.1% improvement.
That explains a seven-second improvement in one year. At 27.
🙈
Clearly there are no professional athletes posting on this thread (nor am I one). It’s pretty clear no one here understands what it’s like to be living on the knife-edge of professional athletics training. Every single aspect of your life is devoted to extracting the absolute maximum performance out of your body, without tipping over the edge to illness, exhaustion, or injury. Sometimes a change of scenery, like being able to order a flat white among friends, surrounded by people with the same accent, is the magic elixir you need to take your focus off your training and find that late career 3.1% improvement.
You act like it is rare for professional athletes to move homes.
It is common. What isn't common is improving by almost 7 seconds in the 1500 at age 27, "change of scenery" or not.
🤣 This can't be serious:
"...being able to order a flat white among friends, surrounded by people with the same accent, is the magic elixir you need to take your focus off your training and find that late career 3.1% improvement."
I improved by 7 seconds in the 1500m in about 2 weeks, and I'm 46. Did my first one in June and got 5:06.4, then a couple of weeks later got 4:59.5. So it can be done!
You don’t think I’m serious that a move home to a more familiar existence and a release from the stress around training could lead to this sort of improvement? It’s only ~3%! Hardly anything. And now she’s imagining world record form.
So take that journeyman late 20s 10,000m runner, perennially a 27:00 guy, and take the stress off him, send him home to familiar surroundings to stop obsessing over every minute way to improve. And watch him pop that 3% improvement for a 26:12, scaring the world record by a second. Totally plausible.
This post was edited 56 seconds after it was posted.
listen to YOURself wrote: You act like it is rare for professional athletes to move homes.
It is common. What isn't common is improving by almost 7 seconds in the 1500 at age 27, "change of scenery" or not.
🤣 This can't be serious:
"...being able to order a flat white among friends, surrounded by people with the same accent, is the magic elixir you need to take your focus off your training and find that late career 3.1% improvement."
It was the flat whites!
is there anything outside of drugs you think could lead to the improvement Jessica saw last season?
if not, just say so
obviously the closer a group of people get to a WR the higher the odds will be they are on drugs
so one can be lazy and just say "they are all on drugs", "you can't improve that much this late in the game" etc. and the majority of the time they'll probably be right. but it's still lazy in my opinion.
as "Er..." was alluding to with the journeyman, i think Drew Hunter may go sub-13 and close to sub-27 next season, which may seem unbelievable to quite a few posters here. granted, that still wouldn't be on the same level of improvement Jess experienced in 2024 so i of course understand the hesitancy of many to believe she's clean
I agree with you, that simply to say they’re all on drugs is lazy. And generally I loathe sarcasm, although you wouldn’t know that from my posts on this thread. I do not know how someone could make this dramatic an improvement. Sure, it’s possible it’s the sum of better training, diet, surroundings and fewer injuries and distractions. But it is a dramatic PB from someone already running at world class levels. How does it compare to other breakthroughs?
David Moorcroft broke the 5000m world record by five seconds when he was 29. It appears to have been a 20-second PB over a little more than 3 miles, versus 7 seconds over a little more than 1 mile. Granted he was primarily a miler. Had run a few 5000s but you could argue that he hadn’t gone all out until that race. Is that not even more extreme an improvement?
This post was edited 43 seconds after it was posted.
It’s only ~3%! Hardly anything. And now she’s imagining world record form.
So take that journeyman late 20s 10,000m runner, perennially a 27:00 guy, and take the stress off him, send him home to familiar surroundings to stop obsessing over every minute way to improve. And watch him pop that 3% improvement for a 26:12, scaring the world record by a second. Totally plausible.
i think Drew Hunter may go sub-13 and close to sub-27 next season, which may seem unbelievable to quite a few posters here. granted, that still wouldn't be on the same level of improvement Jess experienced in 2024 so i of course understand the hesitancy of many to believe she's clean
Yeahhhhh. Look, if Hunter drops 3% in one season, ~20s in the 5000 and ~40s in the the 10,000, we should find that "interesting" too.
I agree with you, that simply to say they’re all on drugs is lazy. And generally I loathe sarcasm, although you wouldn’t know that from my posts on this thread. I do not know how someone could make this dramatic an improvement. Sure, it’s possible it’s the sum of better training, diet, surroundings and fewer injuries and distractions. But it is a dramatic PB from someone already running at world class levels. How does it compare to other breakthroughs?
David Moorcroft broke the 5000m world record by five seconds when he was 29. It appears to have been a 20-second PB over a little more than 3 miles, versus 7 seconds over a little more than 1 mile. Granted he was primarily a miler. Had run a few 5000s but you could argue that he hadn’t gone all out until that race. Is that not even more extreme an improvement?
honestly, it's obviously very difficult to find someone who had a similar level of improvement at that age who was already world-class
all i can think of is ruth chepngetich, which you know, isn't super confidence inspiring in terms of Jess looking clean
This summer there was A LOT of discussion as to how Hull could have improved so much. She explains here:
“I had got so in the zone in the US that I couldn’t switch off between training sessions. If training didn’t go well, I would sit there and overthink things like being half a second slow on a split and what I needed to do to get better,” Hull said.
“It was really hard to leave training at the track because running was the reason I was there.
“Once I came home, I noticed I was able to do the track session and just move on because I was around my people and we talk about things outside of the running world.”
This is not the reason for her breakout. If you want to condone it that's one thing, but let's not be stupid together.
There is a reason why the number of world class US athletes is small in relation to the population. Your attitude is part of it. You are mentally limited in your views towards excellence and performance.
I was a foreign athlete from a bygone era who settled here. A wonderful place, but I have always felt that America takes high grade steak and turns it into high grade hamburger.
Colleges suck the life out of athletes, and J Hull points it out perfectly.
While you are likely a never was, her comments won't help you, but, maybe someone else in the audience will understand.
This is not the reason for her breakout. If you want to condone it that's one thing, but let's not be stupid together.
There is a reason why the number of world class US athletes is small in relation to the population. Your attitude is part of it. You are mentally limited in your views towards excellence and performance.
I was a foreign athlete from a bygone era who settled here. A wonderful place, but I have always felt that America takes high grade steak and turns it into high grade hamburger.
Colleges suck the life out of athletes, and J Hull points it out perfectly.
You're right.
Distance runners NEVER succeed after college in the US.
Off the top of my head: Galen Rupp, Matt Centrowitz, Jenny Simpson, Cole Hocker, Molly Huddle, Kara Goucher, Shalane Flanagan, Brenda Martinez, Des Linden, Grant Fisher, Leo Manazano, Yared Nuguse, Clayton Murphy, Raevyn Rogers, Paul Chelimo, Mo Ahmed, Marco Arop...
Who has even heard of these Olympic medalists??
/s
🤡
If only more post-collegiates took the 'unlimited' approach like Hull, right? 😉
Leaving a rainy, dreary place like Beaverton and a corporate apartment for home? Nonsense!
Getting out of a training group of frenemies run by a part-time coach that can’t be arsed to fly in from Denver more frequently? Hogwash!
Being closer to family and real friends, sharing a bed with your spouse, training in the places that made you love the sport as a child? Naïveté!
Right.
That explains a seven-second improvement in one year. At 27.
🙈
I was 27 when I ran my first ever 5k. Took me just over 30 minutes. 2 months later I ran my second and it took me under 25. That is a 5 minute improvement tin a few months at 27. 7 seconds is nothing.
There is a reason why the number of world class US athletes is small in relation to the population. Your attitude is part of it. You are mentally limited in your views towards excellence and performance.
I was a foreign athlete from a bygone era who settled here. A wonderful place, but I have always felt that America takes high grade steak and turns it into high grade hamburger.
Colleges suck the life out of athletes, and J Hull points it out perfectly.
While you are likely a never was, her comments won't help you, but, maybe someone else in the audience will understand.
The real sad part is that letsrun seems (pretends?) to believe it as long as it's an American or a Caucasian. If American Caucasian, then even a ban for intentional doping won't change the believe.
A ban. A coach getting sanctioned. A teammate getting banned. A girlfriend getting banned. Getting placed on the Likely Doping list.
Leaving a rainy, dreary place like Beaverton and a corporate apartment for home? Nonsense!
Getting out of a training group of frenemies run by a part-time coach that can’t be arsed to fly in from Denver more frequently? Hogwash!
Being closer to family and real friends, sharing a bed with your spouse, training in the places that made you love the sport as a child? Naïveté!
Gotta be something underhanded and the threat an attractive, successful, and happy woman poses to the balding old men and life losers that gather here!
Look forward to you coming up with the same defenses for Kenyan and Ethiopian female runners!
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