Listening to and reading on Virgin - he raced so often (probably over-raced) - basically if a (road) race director offered a good appearance fee - he raced! Eventually it caught up to him! Even so - he had an amazing career!
It always amazes me how few of those California studs did anything at all.
I ran against Hulst in 1974. I think he was a HS sophomore. He had more hair on his chest than I had on my entire body. My hair was down to my shoulders!
None of these guys could carry Virgin's water. There was no comparison. 1974 Junior XC Nationals 1. Bobby Thomas (Glendale CC) 24:25.4 2. John Roscoe (SWn Mich) 24:26 3. Roy Kissin (San Ramon HS) 24:29 4. Ralph Serna (Loara HS) 24:29 5. Eric Hulst (Laguna Beach HS) 24:30 6. James Buell (KY) 24:31 7. Cliff Morden (SF Valley TC) 24:36 8. Guy Arbogast (Wash St.) 24:38 9. Dan Fulton (Ore State) 24:43 10. Rick Whitaker (Spok CC) 24:59 11. Don Clary (Anchorage Alaska) 25:10 12. Paul Hansen (Ky) 25:11 13. Steve Lacy (Wisc) 25:14 15. Mitch Kingery (San Carlos, CA) 25:24
1974 Junior Track Nationals 10000 June 14 1. 30:19.6 Jim Buell, KY 2. 30:36.2 Eric Hulst, CA HS 3. 30:42.8 Guy Arbogast, CA HS 4. 31:04.2 George Malley, Penn State
800 June 14 1. 1:49.6 Tom Byers, Ohio State 2. 1:49.9 Mark Belger, NY HS 3. 1:50.5 Steve Gomez, Florida 4. 1:50.5 Craig Masback, Princeton
1500 June 15 1. 3:42.8 Tom Byers, OSU (Byers was the Senior AAU champion. He ran 3:37 twice!) 2. 3:43.5 Curtis Beck, UCLA 3. 3:44.7 Matt Centrowitz, Manhattan 4. 3:47.2 Steve Lacy, WI HS
3000 steeplechase June 15 1. 8:56.4 Tom McChesney, Oregon 2. 8:58.0 Bob Christensen, Wichita State 3. 9:06.4 George Malley, Penn State
5000 June 15 1. 14:16.2 Ralph Serna, CA HS 2. 14:22.0 Rich Kimball, CA HS 3. 14:27.6 Alex Kasich, West Virginia
The California guys were training animals doing high mileage along with high intensity track intervals. I consider Thom to be the best of them. I knew Thom's father really well and he told me Thom pretty much only did LSD (long slow distance.) Not sure if that is true but if I ever meet Thom again I intend to ask him that question. While at Arizona Thom set the WR for the 2,000m indoor, if memory serves correct. He had great range.
It always amazes me how few of those California studs did anything at all.
I ran against Hulst in 1974. I think he was a HS sophomore. He had more hair on his chest than I had on my entire body. My hair was down to my shoulders!
None of these guys could carry Virgin's water. There was no comparison. 1974 Junior XC Nationals 1. Bobby Thomas (Glendale CC) 24:25.4 2. John Roscoe (SWn Mich) 24:26 3. Roy Kissin (San Ramon HS) 24:29 4. Ralph Serna (Loara HS) 24:29 5. Eric Hulst (Laguna Beach HS) 24:30 6. James Buell (KY) 24:31 7. Cliff Morden (SF Valley TC) 24:36 8. Guy Arbogast (Wash St.) 24:38 9. Dan Fulton (Ore State) 24:43 10. Rick Whitaker (Spok CC) 24:59 11. Don Clary (Anchorage Alaska) 25:10 12. Paul Hansen (Ky) 25:11 13. Steve Lacy (Wisc) 25:14 15. Mitch Kingery (San Carlos, CA) 25:24
1974 Junior Track Nationals 10000 June 14 1. 30:19.6 Jim Buell, KY 2. 30:36.2 Eric Hulst, CA HS 3. 30:42.8 Guy Arbogast, CA HS 4. 31:04.2 George Malley, Penn State
800 June 14 1. 1:49.6 Tom Byers, Ohio State 2. 1:49.9 Mark Belger, NY HS 3. 1:50.5 Steve Gomez, Florida 4. 1:50.5 Craig Masback, Princeton
1500 June 15 1. 3:42.8 Tom Byers, OSU (Byers was the Senior AAU champion. He ran 3:37 twice!) 2. 3:43.5 Curtis Beck, UCLA 3. 3:44.7 Matt Centrowitz, Manhattan 4. 3:47.2 Steve Lacy, WI HS
3000 steeplechase June 15 1. 8:56.4 Tom McChesney, Oregon 2. 8:58.0 Bob Christensen, Wichita State 3. 9:06.4 George Malley, Penn State
5000 June 15 1. 14:16.2 Ralph Serna, CA HS 2. 14:22.0 Rich Kimball, CA HS 3. 14:27.6 Alex Kasich, West Virginia
The California guys were training animals doing high mileage along with high intensity track intervals. I consider Thom to be the best of them. I knew Thom's father really well and he told me Thom pretty much only did LSD (long slow distance.) Not sure if that is true but if I ever meet Thom again I intend to ask him that question. While at Arizona Thom set the WR for the 2,000m indoor, if memory serves correct. He had great range.
I got this from another thread in 2005:
Here's some tidbits from "How High School Runners Train", by Greg Brock in 1976.
Hunt: Developed his own training schedule. Very little weight work. "Basically, I do only long distance work with a little fartlek thrown in. I do track workouts very seldom, usually only when I feel I have to loosen up." Spring training sample: Mon thru Fri AM - 4-7 miles easy. Mon PM - 6-10 miles at 6-7:00. Tue PM - 6 miles in hills. Wed PM - 8-12 miles at 5:45-6:30 Thu PM - 4-7 miles easy. Fri PM - Race Sat PM - 10-12 miles at 5:45-6:30. Sun - 15-20 miles at 6:00-7:00 pace.
The California guys were training animals doing high mileage along with high intensity track intervals. I consider Thom to be the best of them. I knew Thom's father really well and he told me Thom pretty much only did LSD (long slow distance.) Not sure if that is true but if I ever meet Thom again I intend to ask him that question. While at Arizona Thom set the WR for the 2,000m indoor, if memory serves correct. He had great range.
I got this from another thread in 2005:
Here's some tidbits from "How High School Runners Train", by Greg Brock in 1976.
Hunt: Developed his own training schedule. Very little weight work. "Basically, I do only long distance work with a little fartlek thrown in. I do track workouts very seldom, usually only when I feel I have to loosen up." Spring training sample: Mon thru Fri AM - 4-7 miles easy. Mon PM - 6-10 miles at 6-7:00. Tue PM - 6 miles in hills. Wed PM - 8-12 miles at 5:45-6:30 Thu PM - 4-7 miles easy. Fri PM - Race Sat PM - 10-12 miles at 5:45-6:30. Sun - 15-20 miles at 6:00-7:00 pace.
Thanks for posting that!
Yeah, Thom was very skinny back then. He use to sometimes stop by our school to shower after his runs, I remember my first impression being "wow, that guy is skinny!" He looked like a thin rag doll. No biceps, no pecs, skinny hips.
I remember always hearing about the California guys breaking down with career ending injuries once they were in college. Their insane training caught up with them. Back then the shoes were not as good (though I ran thousands of miles in Nike waffles without any problems) but perhaps more importantly knowledge of nutrition and prehab were practically non-existent.
Hunt also trained with some open athletes who were in the San Diego area at the time - including some very good SDTC runners. If Memmory serves he ran 4:02.xx indoor miles and sub 2:30 marathon (both in HS).
Your memory is very good: as a high schooler, Hunt ran 2:24:06 in 1975 at Culver City (aka Western Hemisphere), which was the US national marathon that year. Hulst was also in that race and rand 2:31ish, then ran 2:27ish a few weeks later at Mission Bay.
Hunt also trained with some open athletes who were in the San Diego area at the time - including some very good SDTC runners. If Memmory serves he ran 4:02.xx indoor miles and sub 2:30 marathon (both in HS).
I believe that would have been the Jamul Toads and not SDTC.
His indoor 4:02 set a HS record while a 2:30 would not even put him even in the top ten all-time, at a distance HSers rarely run. If all the best HS runners gave it a go, the record would be below 2:15.
If you want to make a case for him great range, you could point out that, as a senior, he finished second behind Hulst at World XC.
Listening to and reading on Virgin - he raced so often (probably over-raced) - basically if a (road) race director offered a good appearance fee - he raced! Eventually it caught up to him! Even so - he had an amazing career!
Here's his racing schedule in 1973.
4/07 8:50.4 2 mile & 4:17 relay leg 4/24 8:55.6 & 4:16.6 St Clair County meet 4/28 8:59.0 Granite City Invite 5/02 9:24.2 O'Falon Relays 5/03 4:27.9 & 2:02.1 Conference meet 5/05 8:46.6 & 4:11.8 relay Orphan Relays 5/15 8:54.0 Cahokia Invite 5/18 8:53.6 & 4:10.9 District 5/21 8:48.6 & 4:08.5 Meet of Champions 5/25 4:10.0 State meet heat 5/26 8:42.6 & 4:12.2 State finals 6/01 4:05.5 Top 10 meet 6/09 8:40.9 Intl Prep Invite - HS 2 mile record 6/23 13:36.8 3 mile at Nat. Jr AAU 7/04 4:06.1 Freedom Mile (5th) 7/14 8:10.2 3000 for 3rd vs West German Jrs 7/20 8:16.0 3000 win vs Poland Jrs 7/28 13:58.2 5000 win vs USSR Jrs
Yeah, Thom was very skinny back then. He use to sometimes stop by our school to shower after his runs, I remember my first impression being "wow, that guy is skinny!" He looked like a thin rag doll. No biceps, no pecs, skinny hips.
I watch the 1974 Division 1 Championship video run at Bloomington from time to time and I see Virgin wearing this floppy hat, white I think. It was cold that day but I noticed several of the runners wearing big thick knit caps and couldn’t imagine that happening today.
Has their been dress codes established since, saying what gear a runner can put on when he races at this level of racing?
I watch the 1974 Division 1 Championship video run at Bloomington from time to time and I see Virgin wearing this floppy hat, white I think. It was cold that day but I noticed several of the runners wearing big thick knit caps and couldn’t imagine that happening today.
Virgin was wearing an aviators hat. It wasn't cold that day.
Craig Virgin was a machine in high school . He is an Illinois treasure. Virgin and Newton might be the single biggest reason why distance running is so important in Illinois Athletics.
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