The thing that bothers me the most is how unethical this is on the part of the participants. Really, it's simply legalized cheating, for which I would feel terrible as a competitor. I can't imagine there would be much pride in it as well.
Sporting governing bodies have totally dropped the ball on it; and I'm really actually a pretty tolerant person, who is kind of centrist about most cultural issues. People have been so bullied about it--and are instantly deemed anti-trans (I'm not) or anti-LGBTQ (I'm not). So frustrating.
Tell us how sports governing bodies have "totally dropped the ball."
World Athletics (WA) announced new rules on Thursday impacting transgender women athletes, banning some from competing in female track and field events.
The thing that bothers me the most is how unethical this is on the part of the participants. Really, it's simply legalized cheating, for which I would feel terrible as a competitor. I can't imagine there would be much pride in it as well.
Sporting governing bodies have totally dropped the ball on it; and I'm really actually a pretty tolerant person, who is kind of centrist about most cultural issues. People have been so bullied about it--and are instantly deemed anti-trans (I'm not) or anti-LGBTQ (I'm not). So frustrating.
Agree in some regards on this statement, but first of all, that article is very misleading.
It disregards that he ran 50.49 for 400m as a high schooler in 2022, which had him ranked #2 in his school history, and EVERYONE should agree is much better than a 11.72, indicating this is a longer sprinter.
A 300m in 41.8 is equivalent to a 58.5s 400m, so comparing that to a open 50.49, at this point is a pretty equivalent time (and that was 18 months ago, so further development is expected).
So this article, and the "Libs of tiktok" tweet really cherrypicked the data, screenshotting the 100m school record list but ignoring his #2 ranking in the 400m. It's this kind of BS "reporting" that pisses me off and makes these boards the cesspools of misinformation they really are.
Now going forward, will it be "fair" as this person competes as a women? I think the advantages this person had developing as a male until recently will help, but there are a lot faster women in the NCAA and many of them are pretty jacked too. so it'll be interesting to follow.
Many, many of us (approaching "most of us") see the problem here. The polling bears that out, which I have shared many times before.
Don't divide society on this one. A stronger, more accurate play is to say, "On this issue, society is united, and that includes both Republicans and Democrats. We need to protect women's sports for XX humans."
That's the message that people need to hear; our elected officials, people who run state athletic associations and national and worldwide governing bodies, college administrators, parents, athletes, etc.
The few lunatics being all democrat politicians. Wont find a single one opposing this. That makes it Impossible to trust you
From 2021 to 2023 the percent of Americans that believe people should play on teams that match their birth gender has grown from 61 to 67%
You can't get to 67% without Democrats.
More Democrats, in 2023, believe that people should play on teams that match their birth gender (48 to 47%, with about 6% having no opinion).
So, yes, I am correct.
The best play is to say, "The majority of both parties agree. We need to preserve girls' and women's sports for XX humans."
We can make a better push for a common-sense resolution on this issue by working together, not by fighting each other.
Americans are less supportive than two years ago of transgender athletes being allowed to play on sports teams that match their current gender identity.
So you're saying its fair for a guy who wouldn't even make a conference team in Division 1 to be competing for the title just because he has a mental illness and changed his name?
Agree in some regards on this statement, but first of all, that article is very misleading.
It disregards that he ran 50.49 for 400m as a high schooler in 2022, which had him ranked #2 in his school history, and EVERYONE should agree is much better than a 11.72, indicating this is a longer sprinter.
A 300m in 41.8 is equivalent to a 58.5s 400m, so comparing that to a open 50.49, at this point is a pretty equivalent time (and that was 18 months ago, so further development is expected).
So this person could potentially bump someone off the national meet. (The final cutoff for the last year was 57.56.) It's far more likely that someone will be bumped off the podium at the conference meet. I don't think NCAA is concerned about this. It's a bigger concern for the Liberty League conference.
Your Gallup Poll says Democrats are divided 48/47 on that issue. Republicans are united (93/6).
So I don't know how you could say "society" is united. Old men (primary demographics on this board) are united regardless of ideology. But younger people, especially younger women, have quite a different view.
All NCAA divisions need to adopt the international rules of each respective sport. So for track and field, this athlete is only eligible for male competition. There is no path forward for trans athletes after college. Why feed the delusional? The trans hurdler who graduated with a national title a year or so ago started stalking the Bobby Kersee group at UCLA expecting to be invited to join the group. It got ugly and reality came crashing down. The NCAA also open themselves up to law suits by not following the rules of each sports’ federations. It’s negligence.
Your Gallup Poll says Democrats are divided 48/47 on that issue. Republicans are united (93/6).
So I don't know how you could say "society" is united. Old men (primary demographics on this board) are united regardless of ideology. But younger people, especially younger women, have quite a different view.
Because society is the total of all the demographics.
67% (and growing by the day) agree.
There are very few issues in this country with 67% agreement.
That’s why it is fair to say society is generally united. Not unanimous, obviously. But we get closer to that by pulling together.
All NCAA divisions need to adopt the international rules of each respective sport. So for track and field, this athlete is only eligible for male competition. There is no path forward for trans athletes after college. Why feed the delusional? The trans hurdler who graduated with a national title a year or so ago started stalking the Bobby Kersee group at UCLA expecting to be invited to join the group. It got ugly and reality came crashing down. The NCAA also open themselves up to law suits by not following the rules of each sports’ federations. It’s negligence.
This rule won't start until the August of 2024. So this athlete has a window of opportunity during the current season.
At its January 19, 2022 meeting, the NCAA Board of Governors updated the transgender student-athlete participation policy governing college sports. The new policy
Agree in some regards on this statement, but first of all, that article is very misleading.
It disregards that he ran 50.49 for 400m as a high schooler in 2022, which had him ranked #2 in his school history, and EVERYONE should agree is much better than a 11.72, indicating this is a longer sprinter.
A 300m in 41.8 is equivalent to a 58.5s 400m, so comparing that to a open 50.49, at this point is a pretty equivalent time (and that was 18 months ago, so further development is expected).
So this person could potentially bump someone off the national meet. (The final cutoff for the last year was 57.56.) It's far more likely that someone will be bumped off the podium at the conference meet. I don't think NCAA is concerned about this. It's a bigger concern for the Liberty League conference.
True, and how do we know that a kid that ran 50.49 in 2022 wouldn't be running 49.2, ranked in the top-20 on the mens side, 18 months later had he stayed a male? If that's the case, is it unfair for the women that he transitioned is running as a female?
It sucks that they have more competition now for those spots, but is it "unfair" (I don't know or stating an opinion, I'm just asking the question for further debate)
So you're saying its fair for a guy who wouldn't even make a conference team in Division 1 to be competing for the title just because he has a mental illness and changed his name?
Do you think a 58.5 women in Division 1 is competing for a conference team? No, they're not.
My argument centered on how falsely the article was to roundup all you deranged turnips into a frenzied hive. You don't care if its a lie if it supports your viewpoint. The fact that you can't even read my post with some objective thought proves your mental capacity is up for discussion.
Whether a trans person should compete in athletic competition is a real debate (I'm not a fan of it, but I'm not a close minded twat about it either), but if you don't think it's possible to for a human body to transition by medical or hormonal therapies, then Simple Jack from Tropic Thunder is a damn genius compared to you.
Why is the NCAA lagging two years behind the sports’ federations standards? This is negligence! Any female disadvantaged by the NCAA lagging two years behind international standards should sue the NCAA!!
True, and how do we know that a kid that ran 50.49 in 2022 wouldn't be running 49.2, ranked in the top-20 on the mens side, 18 months later had he stayed a male? If that's the case, is it unfair for the women that he transitioned is running as a female?
It sucks that they have more competition now for those spots, but is it "unfair" (I don't know or stating an opinion, I'm just asking the question for further debate)
I think there are two different views on what is "unfair."
The first is that if someone performs relatively better after transition, it is unfair. So if someone ranked #50 as a man is ranked #1 as a women, it is unfair. However, if someone ranked #50 as a man becomes #50 ranked woman, it is not unfair' according to this view.
The second view is that it is unfair whenever something of value is taken away from a cis woman, no matter small it might be. According to this view, it is unfair unless the trans person finishes DFL every single time. Because someone places one spot lower as a result of a trans person's participation. And there is no way for trans person to play any team sport, because whatever playing time she gets would have gone to a cis woman.
I think most sports organizations take the first view, while most posters on this board take the second view. That's why they remain enraged until all trans people are banned from all competitions regardless of their "advantage."
By the way, I do not think a male can transition to being a female by any medical procedure or medication! The differences between a male and female are in every single cell in the human body. This cannot be altered by surgery or drugs. Lowering testosterone and wearing women’s clothing is a farcical, superficial attempt at changing a man into a woman. It’s an insult to women to believe the differences between men and women are that superficial. It also flys in face of biological facts.
By the way, I do not think a male can transition to being a female by any medical procedure or medication! The differences between a male and female are in every single cell in the human body. This cannot be altered by surgery or drugs. Lowering testosterone and wearing women’s clothing is a farcical, superficial attempt at changing a man into a woman. It’s an insult to women to believe the differences between men and women are that superficial. It also flys in face of biological facts.
Not all school records are created equal and the Rochester Institute of Technology is not a track powerhouse. There are hundreds, maybe thousands, of women in the U.S. that can run faster than 41.8 for 300m.
And yet there are none in the history of that university.
You can support trans rights without supporting this. They have the right to roleplaying. But as soon as their kink starts interfering with the lives of other people then it isn’t right anymore.
a. : a male person : a man or a boy. b. : an individual of the sex that is typically capable of producing small, usually motile gametes (such as sperm or spermatozoa) which fertilize the eggs of a female.
of, relating to, or being the sex that typically has the capacity to produce relatively small, usually motile gametes which fertilize the eggs of a female; having or producing only stamens or staminate flowers; having a gende...
a. : a male person : a man or a boy. b. : an individual of the sex that is typically capable of producing small, usually motile gametes (such as sperm or spermatozoa) which fertilize the eggs of a female.
I think there are two different views on what is "unfair."
The first is that if someone performs relatively better after transition, it is unfair. So if someone ranked #50 as a man is ranked #1 as a women, it is unfair. However, if someone ranked #50 as a man becomes #50 ranked woman, it is not unfair' according to this view.
The second view is that it is unfair whenever something of value is taken away from a cis woman, no matter small it might be. According to this view, it is unfair unless the trans person finishes DFL every single time. Because someone places one spot lower as a result of a trans person's participation. And there is no way for trans person to play any team sport, because whatever playing time she gets would have gone to a cis woman.
I think most sports organizations take the first view, while most posters on this board take the second view. That's why they remain enraged until all trans people are banned from all competitions regardless of their "advantage."
There is a in between view that most people here hold and that is the first view is just not possible. No such thing as #50 to #50 for male to female transition. This is why the discussion is always about male to female transition. You won’t find any threads about female to male transition athletes.
a. : a male person : a man or a boy. b. : an individual of the sex that is typically capable of producing small, usually motile gametes (such as sperm or spermatozoa) which fertilize the eggs of a female.
Typically? So are there any men who cannot produce small, motile gametes? Or is the ability to produce small motile gametes a requirement to be a man?
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