OSU men super long stride right before NCAA XC race, was this the secret to their incredible performance?

Yep, it caught my attention when the women did it first. They took it right to where the hill steepened and stopped just before that (I'm guessing about 400m from the start). The men actually took it beyond that, up that fairly steep hill about 75m or so. Definitely a pretty brisk pace (maybe simulated start pace?). Both teams got out fast and were packed near the lead at the start. They obviously had enough time to recover after the long stride, which I didn't time, but must have been at least 5 minutes. No other team did anything remotely close to that, at least off the starting line.

To clarify, the recovery time after the stride (not the stride itself) was at least 5 minutes.

I do something similar before my own races. If you think about your own workouts, the first repeat of a workout almost always feels the worst. You’re kinda getting that out of the way by doing a longer effort. I tend to do something like 4-800m at 10K+ effort, followed by a few shorter 50-100m strides after a full recovery, and then just very light jogging until the start. This is similar to what I’ve read many pros do as a warm up.

Does your first repetition of an interval workout ever feel the best? Almost never (unless it’s a long interval such as 1-2 mile repeats or something crazy hard like 3x600 at 800m race pace).

You almost always feel more relaxed, smooth, and comfortable that 2nd rep. In high school, I remember reading an article about doing a roughly 1 min “stride” at around VO2 max pace. So basically 300-400m at around 3k race pace, but it doesn’t have to be exact. This was recommended to do about 5-10 mins before the start of the race. I felt good when I did.

IIRC, Cooper Teare has mentioned that the Oregon squad (him, Hocker, Hunter, etc.) used to do this before track races back when Ben Thomas ran the show. Maybe there's something to it, given how successful that group was.

Yeah... NIL $$$.

Could someone try to dig up that high school 800m thread where the coach posted detailed training plans of how he took a kid from mediocre to low 1:50s in one season? I always found it interesting because he posted about having his athlete do a 250-350m "stride" at like 95% speed shortly before the race. I've tried it a few times and have felt good, kinda like how your 2nd/3rd rep of a track workout always feels better than rep 1. I think this observation might point to something similar. Would be interested to learn more about this.

AFAIK well-designed studies have never supported the use of nasal strips.

Studies and experts suggest that nasal strips like Breathe Right don’t improve athletic performance in adults in any measure—no improved VO2 max, ventilation, maximal work rate, lactate threshold, or lowered ratings of perceived exertion.

outsideonline.com

Do Nasal Strips Improve Performance?

sperkins-pom

Studies and experts suggest that nasal strips like Breathe Right don’t improve athletic performance in adults in any measure—no improved VO2 max, ventilation, maximal work rate, lactate threshold, or lowered ratings of percei...

Open link

But, as they say around here, "It couldn't hoit." I don't know of any documented negative effects from wearing them--and if they make a runner feel more confident, why not? As my doctor has observed, "Placebo effect is still an effect."

I don't think there's necessarily anything *wrong* with those studies, but there's a difference between a lab test in a controlled environment and being outside in (potentially) much colder weather. Personally I use nasal strips when it's cold because my nose tends to run, and it's easier than having to shoot snot rockets every other minute.

At the end of the day, it's like $0.20 per strip, which if it has any ergogenic benefit at all would probably be one of the best ROI extra things you could do. Placebo effects are still effects after all!

It's really obvious you're a chatbot talking in circles. Get some new material.

VO2 kinetics… though CP cost of 61 400 would cut some into race benefit.

I don't think there would be much of a CP loss, if any. For me, absolutely, but not for someone well trained.

The research shows that there is actually an increase of W' following priming for events lasting 2-30 minutes in aerobically trained athletes. The upregulation of intracellular O2 utilization may be the reasoning.

Daniels recommended this. "Is the first repeat of a workout the best?"

I took my son on a official visit there more than a year ago. They do it to activate certain systems since 50 meter chump strides wont do it. Makes sense if you think about.

Think of a interval workout. Your first one is usually slower than your second one.

Seems to be something more teams/athletes are doing. Another piece from the Ingebrigtson’s!!! Jakob is known for doing 400m strides before racing even 1500m.

Well, of the 62 teams competing on Saturday, the only teams I witnessed doing this were the OSU men and the OSU women. Possibly a few individuals did something like that but that's about it. If anyone else did, it was at least 15 minutes before the start of the race because all the teams were corralled in the start area by then.

I saw the FM pro group (Stotan) warming up before Club xc nationals years ago. I believe they would start their warmup 40 minutes out and do 3x200m at race pace 20 minutes ahead of the race. Most groups then do strides of 50-100m shortly before the race. I haven't seen longer strides that soon but then I agree that the first rep never feels easy.

Only because you asked, Malmo!! LOL

Doing an effort (i.e. vasodilation) of 30 seconds to 6 minutes (that's the range I've observed; and there are pros/cons for the time in relation to the race duration and intensities) at near maximal heart rate is a way to prep the heart (specifically the left ventricle) for the work it is about to do (in racing and intense workouts).

Vasodilation has less (if anything) to do with the legs feeling fresh; though, psychologically I would imagine this would be difficult to do/sale to runners if only done on race days and not included in a typical intense workout routine.

I'm no medical scientist, but I also don't believe the purpose of vasodilation has much (if anything) to do with muscle pH levels associated with Lactate Tolerance work. Lactate Tolerance work is geared towards what happens at the END of a race, not the beginning (Vasodilation prep).

If Lactate Tolerance is "needed" or used at the beginning of a distance race, the runner has likely gone faster than what they physiologically can handle - and it will show in the later stages of a XC race (see other threads on how some people feel some teams/individuals may have been too aggressive from the start at XC Nats). There is a reason running even splits (efforts) and negative splits (increased efforts) yield some of the fastest times/performances.

On the track, this is relatively easy to do from a physiological standpoint. XC courses, on the other hand, require a bit more nuance in trying to figure out how to run the course (hills, turns, etc...) in relation to everything else that is going on (psychological, race dynamics, other potential environmental influences).

Lastly, Vasodilation is not a "new thing" we are learning from the Ingebrigtsen camp; it has been around for quite some time and runners/coaches have been doing this for years.

Apologies for the lengthy post, but Malmo did ask!!! LOL