there is no way this post is serious. anyone who upvoted that post has little to no knowledge around athletics.
the correlation between the 400h and the 800 is known even at the high school level and only becomes more apparent as you move up to college and pro. at higher levels the training for 400h is very, very similar to what a 400/800 runner would be doing, due to the similar systems being used over the course of both events which call for extraordinarily high levels of lactic tolerance combined with a ton of speed.
the result of this is a clear correlation between the 2 events demonstrated very very easily with very little googling.
harald schmidt: 20.6, 44.9, 1:44.8, 47.4 400h
britton wilson: 49.1, 2:02.1, 53.0 400h
michaela rose: 53.4, 1:59.0, 56.8 400h
edwin moses could reportedly run under 1:50 with ease as well. this isn’t some random take about this so called “broad athleticism” between multiple events. this correlation between the 400h and the 800 continues at the highest level and you can find a number of other examples of it.
i have literally no doubt karsten warlholm could run around 1:46 with very little specific training. you really have to be stupidly strong to run either event and it crosses over very well. he would absolutely be world class if he specialized in it.
that said, jakob would win in an 800 between the 2 of them, but it would be close. karsten would only really win at 600m and under.
there is no way this post is serious. anyone who upvoted that post has little to no knowledge around athletics.
the correlation between the 400h and the 800 is known even at the high school level and only becomes more apparent as you move up to college and pro. at higher levels the training for 400h is very, very similar to what a 400/800 runner would be doing, due to the similar systems being used over the course of both events which call for extraordinarily high levels of lactic tolerance combined with a ton of speed.
the result of this is a clear correlation between the 2 events demonstrated very very easily with very little googling.
harald schmidt: 20.6, 44.9, 1:44.8, 47.4 400h
britton wilson: 49.1, 2:02.1, 53.0 400h
michaela rose: 53.4, 1:59.0, 56.8 400h
edwin moses could reportedly run under 1:50 with ease as well. this isn’t some random take about this so called “broad athleticism” between multiple events. this correlation between the 400h and the 800 continues at the highest level and you can find a number of other examples of it.
i have literally no doubt karsten warlholm could run around 1:46 with very little specific training. you really have to be stupidly strong to run either event and it crosses over very well. he would absolutely be world class if he specialized in it.
that said, jakob would win in an 800 between the 2 of them, but it would be close. karsten would only really win at 600m and under.
But it's typical and proper for an athlete of that caliber to own overboard confidence in himself.
The overconfidence on display here is from distance runners sure their long runs and endurance training make the best 800. You can see them cope and seethe at me, as if that would change anything.
Fact is, sprinters (who are as cool as distance runners are geeky) easily turn fast 400 speed into a decent 800 almost right off the bat. And if they work at it, they are sure to outperform all but a few 1500/5000 types. Many of these copers have had this proven to them the hard way on their school team. Ugly, painful memories that won't go away!
Search these boards for a video of Ashton Eaton casually running 2 flat 800 reps. Well below race effort, and he was no 400h record holder. Weighed 185 pounds too.
This post was edited 4 minutes after it was posted.
Reason provided:
you can vote that you don't like it, but you can't vote that it's false. Not up for a vote.
To them it is jog 600m and then hold form for another 200m without even any hurdles. Easy.
So many of these dumb projections of sprinters to distance races use this logic of "jogging" at world class speed at the longer event. Yes, for a guy who can run a 44 second 400, running a 400 in 52 seconds is easy. It doesn't follow that adding another 200 in 26 seconds is easy and it definitely isn't jogging. And another 200 after that, forget about it.
There are athletes with the physiology to be world class at 400/800. There just aren't that many of them and doubtful that Warholm is one of them. The fact that he's a great hurdler has zero relevance in projecting his 800 ability.
But it's typical and proper for an athlete of that caliber to own overboard confidence in himself.
The overconfidence on display here is from distance runners sure their long runs and endurance training make the best 800. You can see them cope and seethe at me, as if that would change anything.
Fact is, sprinters (who are as cool as distance runners are geeky) easily turn fast 400 speed into a decent 800 almost right off the bat. And if they work at it, they are sure to outperform all but a few 1500/5000 types. Many of these copers have had this proven to them the hard way on their school team. Ugly, painful memories that won't go away!
Search these boards for a video of Ashton Eaton casually running 2 flat 800 reps. Well below race effort, and he was no 400h record holder. Weighed 185 pounds too.
Ashton Eaton (one of the better middle distance runners in the decathalon) has PRs of:
400 - 45.00
1000 - 2:32.67
1500 - 4:14.58
If he could casually run 2 flat 800 reps, I think his PRs would have been faster at 1000 and 1500. Also keep in mind, we have no evidence that Warholm is as capable of a middle distance runner as Eaton was. His PRs when doing multi-events from what I can find are:
But it's typical and proper for an athlete of that caliber to own overboard confidence in himself.
The overconfidence on display here is from distance runners sure their long runs and endurance training make the best 800. You can see them cope and seethe at me, as if that would change anything.
Fact is, sprinters (who are as cool as distance runners are geeky) easily turn fast 400 speed into a decent 800 almost right off the bat. And if they work at it, they are sure to outperform all but a few 1500/5000 types. Many of these copers have had this proven to them the hard way on their school team. Ugly, painful memories that won't go away!
Search these boards for a video of Ashton Eaton casually running 2 flat 800 reps. Well below race effort, and he was no 400h record holder. Weighed 185 pounds too.
If he's casually running 2:00 800m reps in practice, he should be able to easily string together enough of them in a row for a 7:30 3000m with his superior athleticism. Amazing!
Ashton Eaton (one of the better middle distance runners in the decathalon) has PRs of:
400 - 45.00
1000 - 2:32.67
1500 - 4:14.58
If he could casually run 2 flat 800 reps, I think his PRs would have been faster at 1000 and 1500. Also keep in mind, we have no evidence that Warholm is as capable of a middle distance runner as Eaton was. His PRs when doing multi-events from what I can find are:
1000 - 2:45
1500 - 4:44
Bingo! A guy who can crank out 2:00 800s as reps "well below race effort" isn't going to struggle to hold that same pace for another 200m. Yet his 1k PR is 2:32. Hmm... nah, can't be more of Bad Wigins' bad takes.
Before being arrogant, make sure everything you say is correct. The 400 and 800 are two very different events physiologically. Sure they both require a lot of lactic tolerance. But the 800 requires so much endurance that it is not comparable. Some 400m runners do well at the 800 but that's after some serious training for the 800, not right away. And they are rare. It's more an exception than the rule. Wariner, the kind of 400 runner everybody thought was able to do very well in the 800, only ran 1:53. Moreover, Warholm is more a 200/400 guy than a 400/800 guy. He is not the type of guy able to run a 800 at the same level as his 400 even with a lot of training. He has 0 chance vs Jakob at the 800, not close. Warholm would be like 5sec behind, running 49/1:0x while Jakob would be jogging a 53/53.
“The 400 and 800 are two very different events physiologically.”
nice job ignoring my argument entirely. nowhere did i say the 400 and 800 were similar events. they are not. i was arguing the 400h and 800 are similar events, which i stand by. they obviously aren’t identical but the 400h requires an amount of conditioning and endurance on par with the 800 to run successfully.
“Wariner, the kind of 400 runner everybody thought was able to do very well in the 800, only ran 1:53.”
wariner ran 1:53 in 2015, 8 years removed from his 400 PR in 2007. additionally, it was during his short comeback, and was run in march as one of his first races of the year. that 1:53 was not representational of his 800 capability in the slightest.
“Moreover, Warholm is more a 200/400 guy than a 400/800 guy. ”
huh? what evidence can you point to that supports this? he ran 20.91 indoors at the same time when he ran 45.96, when the majority of athletes running similar 400 times indoors run in the range of 20.4-20.7, which is pretty far away from 20.9, especially indoors. he did also run 44.87 outdoors in the same year he ran that 20.91, but because it was run in june and outdoors, i think that’s a poor argument to make.
“He is not the type of guy able to run a 800 at the same level as his 400 even with a lot of training.”
i think i have established the following:
1. there is a relationship between the 400h and 800
2. karsten warholm is not a 200/400 runner.
therefore, i argue the opposite. he would be good at the 800, and would be even better if he specialized in it.
As if adding hurdles and runnind an event that lasts 3sec more was making a big difference. The 400 and 400h are similar event. Not the the 400h and 800.
Wariner still ran 45 the same year he ran 1:53. He could probobly do a bit better at the 800 but still far from world class.
I did not say he was as good in the 200 as in the 400 but that he was more a 200/400 guy than a 400/800 guy which is easily proven by his PBs in the 100 and 200 (10.49/20.91) compared to his PBs in the 1000 and 1500 (2:45/4:44).
Warholm did 1.15 in the 600m a few years back acording to rumors. He also did 20.86 on the way to his 400m indoor victory this year which should indicate a much faster time outdoors. I think he and his coach have a decent understanding of his potential in the 800m
The overconfidence on display here is from distance runners sure their long runs and endurance training make the best 800. You can see them cope and seethe at me, as if that would change anything.
Fact is, sprinters (who are as cool as distance runners are geeky) easily turn fast 400 speed into a decent 800 almost right off the bat. And if they work at it, they are sure to outperform all but a few 1500/5000 types. Many of these copers have had this proven to them the hard way on their school team. Ugly, painful memories that won't go away!
Search these boards for a video of Ashton Eaton casually running 2 flat 800 reps. Well below race effort, and he was no 400h record holder. Weighed 185 pounds too.
Ashton Eaton (one of the better middle distance runners in the decathalon) has PRs of:
400 - 45.00
1000 - 2:32.67
1500 - 4:14.58
If he could casually run 2 flat 800 reps, I think his PRs would have been faster at 1000 and 1500. Also keep in mind, we have no evidence that Warholm is as capable of a middle distance runner as Eaton was. His PRs when doing multi-events from what I can find are:
1000 - 2:45
1500 - 4:44
Eaton's 1500m PR's were set at the end of a decathlon, I believe. Would turn out different if he was fresh. Warholm has likely improved as an athlete since he last competed in a multi.
Also, seems reasonable that a 45 flat 400m guy who trains to be a well rounded athlete could jog a 2:00 800m.
Warholm did 1.15 in the 600m a few years back acording to rumors. He also did 20.86 on the way to his 400m indoor victory this year which should indicate a much faster time outdoors. I think he and his coach have a decent understanding of his potential in the 800m
One and a half year ago Warholm was asked why he thought he could run a stellar 800m. He then answered that he had run some fast 600m as a child. But he didn’t say a word about any 1.15. Peculiar don’t you think?….. And what about his “43 low in the 400m flat”…? And why can’t anybody give a little more details about the 1.15 when I repeatedly ask? And why didn’t Karsten mention the 1.15 in the interview with Ciitius Mag (being specifically asked about 600m)?
Eaton's 1500m PR's were set at the end of a decathlon, I believe. Would turn out different if he was fresh. Warholm has likely improved as an athlete since he last competed in a multi.
Also, seems reasonable that a 45 flat 400m guy who trains to be a well rounded athlete could jog a 2:00 800m.
Sure Eaton would have run faster in a fresh 1500, but I don't think by a substantial amount.
Yes, Warholm has improved as an athlete, although he's not training for middle distance events anymore. Sure if he wanted to he could run faster than those PRs. But those PRs are a long ways beyond elite and weren't that good even by decathlon standards.
No one is doubting that Eaton (or Warholm) could run an 800 in 2:00. That's besides the point of saying he'd be competitive with Jakob in the 800 (who can do better than 4 of those with no rest). But if an 800 in 2:00 was "jogging" for Eaton, he would have been able to hold that pace for another 200 and break 2:30 in the 1000.
There’s this long-held belief here that somehow hurdlers should have better endurance than flat 400 runners. I’ve never seen any evidence of that. Plus Warholm is not a 400/800 guy, he’s a sprinter. He split like 20.8 indoors and he’s split 21.x in his hurdle races, he could probably run 20.3-4 in an open 200 and is not breaking 1:48 in the 800.
We had a national class D3 400 hurdler (making outdoor finals, AA, etc) run on our 4x800 that broke the school record, won Drake relays, etc. He split a good 4-5 seconds slower than the other guys on the 4x8 who were AAs in the 800 and 1500. He was never gonna run much faster than 1:55-:56 without some more specific some endurance training. And he was much less of a sprint-type than Warholm, who I think would pull a Jeremy Warnier and run around 1:50.
