USATF being sued for negligence in 2021 US Olympic Trials, and sadly I agree.

No. He said that "3 million dollars can buy some good lawyers." What does that have to do with this case? The plaintiff's lawyer is already known, and there's no way that she's paying anything significant for him. I don't know who USATF's lawyers are these days, but they don't cost $3 million, and they don't need to be good or expensive. Among other things, they're starting with a written waiver of liability that the plaintiff signed. I realize that her lawyer is arguing that this was an unenforceable contract of adhesion, and it's possible that will get her past the Rule 12 stage. But it's still a cheap case to litigate from both sides.

I don't know, but it's a perfectly reasonable thing to ask. Unfortunately, all of these other people seem to believe that they already know everything there is to know about this case, so don't expect them to take the trouble to find out.

To be clear, you're not disagreeing with my statement that "USATF rescheduled a number of events, particularly distance events"; you're disagreeing with my statement that "[t]his woman just had a slow 800 meters to get through," since she actually passed out warming up for the javelin," and never even got to the 800. That's fair. And as far as I can tell, it doesn't help her case a whit.

If this passes, might as well forget about any "good old fashioned" nasty cross country courses for USATF events. Why would they set themselves up for another lawsuit from a "delicate" athlete?

I thought this thread would be about the timing and FS hackery.

I'm down with it either way. How they eff things up so much is beyond me.

I see your point, but respectfully disagree. I understand that suing someone comes off a money-grab, but what do you think is more likely to lead to USATF changing the weather policy: Athletes and coaches signing a non-binding petition of some sort, or USATF losing money because of a lawsuit. I think the latter is the case. Sadly, for an organization like USATF, losing money is going to have more of an impact on behavior than conscience. I could be wrong though.

Just just should have set up some cones for an indoor race in Mac Court.

I don't see how it could've been 150F as an air temperature (taken properly, i.e. in the shade as all standard temps are taken). How hot was it? Are we saying 111F? That's 44C which is extreme. Maybe there needs to be a temperature cut-off for competitions. However that's tricky as would it vary from event to event?

Couldn’t this be used against USATF? They acknowledged that the weather was unsafe for athletes by rescheduling events. Why didn’t they reschedule ALL events? Who is making decisions on which events can handle the weather and which can’t? Why were some athletes put in harms way and others not?

I'm sure someone will correct me if I am wrong. After Taliyah Brooks collapsed and was cared for by the medical staff at the Trials, I believe she attempted to reenter the competition. It was the medical staff that refused to allow her to continue in the competition.

I don't know. I welcome hearing additional facts, especially if they're plausible (unlike 150 degree temperatures). Most people in these matters simply make up their minds without bothering with the facts.

Written liability waivers have very little legal impact in the case of negligence, as here. Their purpose is primarily to depress the chances of lawsuits, because they make people think they can't sue if something goes wrong, which is false. USATF admitted shortly after she passed out that conditions were dangerous by stopping competition, so they don't have a great case.

Hard for me to understand. Many events are run in unsafe conditions, some are run that way on purpose, like that death valley ultra. Boston marathon's freezing temps in 2018 or whatever were just as unsafe...

To be honest I don't think any of these are that unsafe with proper preparation. Most runners have done long runs in 110+ heat with little to no water. Yeah your times will suck, but so will your competitors. If you're somehow very heat sensitive, they sell those shirts where you literally put ice cubes in the pockets. I've tried variations of soaking my shirts in ice cold water and they'll keep you cool enough for any of the relatively short events in the hep.

If you're coming from the angle of, "I suck in suboptimal conditions so events should be setup for optimal conditions", then that's an argument I can understand. But the danger is pretty overblown and no one has yet to prove these temps are unsafe WITH proper prep.

Totally agree with everything you wrote here. The craziest thing about that day in particular is that everyone knew it is was coming and yet they still tried to roll with it despite knowing full well how dangerous it was. Every day that week heading into the absolute furnace of the weekend was at or even above the forecasted temperature and that Sunday was no different. This for me personally is where the issue is - it's not like this day was forecasted to be 100 (which is obviously not ideal but not dangerously hot as we have seen 100 degree days at trials/USATF champs before) and unexpectedly was 115 - it was insane to hold a meet and they knew it. So it's premeditated negligence.

The thing is, it was so easy to avoid - announce on Friday that the weekend events will start at 8.00pm, don't f--k around between events and go as long as you need to. I mean "what about TV"? Seriously how many people watch this anyway? - sorry to the East Coaster TV audience, athletes come first each and every time. This way you avoid 1) issues with the health and wellbeing of the athletes and 2) issues with your fans who didn't come to the meet anyway but would have if they could have planned for it slightly in advance.

It was a total mess but totally avoidable - good luck to Brooks, I don't blame her and I hope she gets some compensation out of this.

Are you kidding me?

"Ice cubes in pockets"? "Soaking shirts in ice cold water"?

How f-ing stupid are you - it's not about the "relatively short events in the hep" - you think the athletes walk back into an air conditioned hut between events? They are basically out there the entire time and before you give some insanely ignorant response like "just sit in the shade" this is what you won't understand because you weren't there (and yes, I was), it was so hot air temperature wise that shade or even circulating air was meaningless.

Runners do long runs in 110+ with no water? Who? What "runners" do runs in 110+ with no water? One's that die like this guy famously and tragically did?

kron4.com

Pleasanton runner Philip Kreycik likely died from heatstroke in 106-degree weather, investigators say

Amy Larson

GPS data from a runner’s smartwatch is giving investigators valuable information for solving the mystery of what happened to Philip Kreycik, an ultramarathon athlete who went missing for near…

Open link

and this was a "runner" who was young, in shape and was used to running in warm weather.

Furthermore go do some research about the dangers of exercising in excessive heat - actually educate yourself with some science mate. Your post is up there with the dumbest I've ever read on this forum.

Subsequent remedial measures are not admissible to prove negligence. FRE 407.

I don't agree with any of this at all, but if you have authoritative sources for these statements, please set them forth or provide links for me. (For these purposes, "authoritative sources" include only sources that know more about this stuff than I do.)

Having put on numerous meets, always told by lawyers that waivers are necessary but not sufficient. IF you are negligent, throw the waivers in the garbage, they are then useless. But negligence has to be proved. That nothing was changed (except the distance races?) until this girl passed out is the smoking gun here. Is that enough to prove negligence? That is what the lawyers are for. At the time I wondered why they didn't just delay the meet for another day (as said above) knowing that these conditions were going to occur. That is the problem with the attitude - schedule or be damned. I thought it too hot for the distance races as well. This was extreme. Nobody signs up to compete for the OT in this weather. The events are NOT about who can tolerate the most heat, regardless of hydration protocols.

"IF you are negligent, throw the waivers in the garbage, they are then useless." You've actually been told this by real lawyers? Did these lawyers bother to tell you that the effect of a written waiver of liability for negligence can vary greatly depending upon the particular state law that applies? Did these lawyers tell you that the effect of such a waiver may depend upon whether there is a finding of simple negligence or gross negligence? Did these lawyers tell you that the effect of a waiver of liability for negligence may depend upon the particular sport or activity, which is not infrequently determined by state statute? How could your lawyers not know these things?