No I just do 40 mpw. I did 17:50 and 36:69 off that, then sub 3 and an 80 minute half off 60 mpw.
How far were you going on the 90 minute run? It seems like you're doing 40 now with the two hour run and were doing 40 when your long run was 90 minutes. It looks like you've dropped your mileage. How long ago were you doing 60? A two hour run for someone used to doing 60 is not as long a run as for someone only used to doing 40. I wouldn't get too hung up one the percentage thing and stop doing something that's working for you.
The 90 minute run is 11-12 miles. The 2 hour run is 14-16 miles.
Yes I was doing 60 around Easter then after the marathon dropped down to 40.
When I introduced the 2 hour long run my park run time improved by 30 seconds in a short space of time. Instead of the mile splits going something like 5:50, 6:04 it was now 5:50, 5:50, then a bit of a slow down in the last mile.
How far were you going in 90min? 40mpw personally I wouldn't have someone go longer than 10 miles unless they were training for longer distances. 40mpw in general is pretty low unless there's xtraining on top of that?
No I just do 40 mpw. I did 17:50 and 36:69 off that, then sub 3 and an 80 minute half off 60 mpw.
I never consider a "rule" like that for my athletes.
The question for me when I train someone is what do they need to do for them to be consistent? The answer is a little different for everyone.
For example, If you are doing a long run that requires you to have 2-3 days recovering after it and an easy short day leading into it, then that is not an effective way to train. This is why so many runners fail to run a good Marathon. They run 20+ mile 3 1/2+ hour death marches every weekend and suffer the entire next week for little gain when they are not ready to do so.
I think I may have seen another post by you the other day. Were you the one who thought they'd have a breakthrough because they'd been doing higher mileage all summer after no training the summer before? Keep in mind, there could be a lot of other factors that made you run faster, not just doing a longer run.
Think about your leadup to this race compared to your previous ones. Did you get more sleep for a few days leading up to it? Eat something different the night before? Hydrate differently? Did you start doing workouts with your team? Did you do a really hard workout 2 weeks ago that you're starting to get the gains from? Did you run less a bit less leading up to it? Did you have an extra day between your last workout and the race? During the race, did you go out faster or slower than normal? Was your race strategy different?
I once had a teammate that PRed by almost a minute at a race and said it was because they chugged 3 bottles of water when they woke up. After a bit of questioning, it turned out that the day before every race, he'd go really hard on the 3 mile run we did, but the day before that race, he had a date so he didn't run at all the night before. Turns out he probably PRed by so much because his legs were fresher than normal. The moral of the story being that people will completely miss the actual reason they ran so much faster. It could have been the long run you started doing, or it could have been something completely different.
During times when I was too busy with work, kids, and whatnot, I would often do a single 15-mile run on a Sunday. So I've gone up to 100% of my weekly mileage from the long run. Have only had two very minor injuries over my 15+ years of running and one was because I tripped on a curb.
I think I may have seen another post by you the other day. Were you the one who thought they'd have a breakthrough because they'd been doing higher mileage all summer after no training the summer before? Keep in mind, there could be a lot of other factors that made you run faster, not just doing a longer run.
Think about your leadup to this race compared to your previous ones. Did you get more sleep for a few days leading up to it? Eat something different the night before? Hydrate differently? Did you start doing workouts with your team? Did you do a really hard workout 2 weeks ago that you're starting to get the gains from? Did you run less a bit less leading up to it? Did you have an extra day between your last workout and the race? During the race, did you go out faster or slower than normal? Was your race strategy different?
I once had a teammate that PRed by almost a minute at a race and said it was because they chugged 3 bottles of water when they woke up. After a bit of questioning, it turned out that the day before every race, he'd go really hard on the 3 mile run we did, but the day before that race, he had a date so he didn't run at all the night before. Turns out he probably PRed by so much because his legs were fresher than normal. The moral of the story being that people will completely miss the actual reason they ran so much faster. It could have been the long run you started doing, or it could have been something completely different.
No that's not me. I've been running for 2 years now and have been consistent in that time. In fact last summer I went crazy and was jogging 70 miles per week at one point.
Absolutely nothing changed before this race / parkrun except I started to do a 15-16 mile long run instead of 90 minutes. I actually did parkrun 3 weeks in a row and my time has gone down each time since introducing the longer run. I felt like hell for it yesterday though and fell asleep on the sofa.
Absolutely nothing changed before this race / parkrun except I started to do a 15-16 mile long run instead of 90 minutes. I actually did parkrun 3 weeks in a row and my time has gone down each time since introducing the longer run.
You're benefiting from the increased aerobic capacity, strength and endurance from the long runs. Keep doing them.
Everything you say here is true. You can never be absolutely sure that the change you just made was the reason you got faster. But you also can't discount it either.
During times when I was too busy with work, kids, and whatnot, I would often do a single 15-mile run on a Sunday. So I've gone up to 100% of my weekly mileage from the long run. Have only had two very minor injuries over my 15+ years of running and one was because I tripped on a curb.
There was guy in New England in the old days, 1950s I think, called Tony Mediros. At one time he worked two 40 hour jobs each week. The only free day he had was Sunday. So he did a 20 mile run on Sundays and nothing else. He could run 2:40 or so for the marathon. I have a friend who ran 2:29 at altitude on nothing but one 20 mile run a week and a very occasional mid week 10.
Malmo, I highly respect and value your advice and running achievements. You post this often and I’m interested in the specifics. Please explain (for me and the OP), “No long runs.”
How do you define “long run”?
Who shouldn’t do long runs? All non-elites? Only beginners?
All 5K/10K runners?
Even those training for marathons?
If no long run, what instead?
If amateurs shouldn’t do them, at what point and for what reason should we start?
I’m no elite (49 yo male, 3:05 marathon) but want to improve. I’m trying to figure out how eliminating long runs would allow that.
Based upon the number of downvotes to his reply, a number of others do not seem to share your deference, but I have read other posters praising him in the past. Just curious, who is Malmo, and why do you so highly respect and value his advice? Is he a legendary trainer of runners? Not trying to be difficult; I am genuinely curious.
Malmo is a former high level runner and very knowledgeable about running. but he very often makes posts like this. Basically give a STRONG yes or no opinion with little to no information to back up his assertion.
I think a major disconnect with some people, when talking about long runs, is what you consider to be a long run. To some people, a long run means 15+ miles or 2+ hours. So they say you don't need a long run. Well, my long run is 10 miles. It is long to me, and I need it. I have kids on my team who have a "Long run" of 3 miles.
I value everybody's experience and opinions. But please, give some information to back up what you are saying. Most of us, even some of the very best coaches on the boards, still come here hoping to learn something new every once in awhile.
endurance benefits08/16/2022 5:17am EDT3 years ago
I know "do both" is the answer and I do both, but these are grey areas in my training. I know that a very long run has helped me to run a good marathon, but when it comes to the 5K and 10K I am not sure it helps very much. Fo...
Help us build the best running shoe review site for a chance to win a LetsRun t-shirt.Help us build the best running shoe review site for a chance to win one of 10 LetsRun t-shirts.