I can see Josh Kerr in 3:28 shape this year, too, but I have to take a lot of peyote to make it happen.
Doubtful we’ll see that again anytime soon.
I feel like I’m taking crazy pills. Does nobody remember how last season the Brooks Beasts looked lost in the majority of races leading up to USA’s/Olympics, and then they peaked at the right time and were pretty competitive?
No chance am I writing off Kerr before the actual big races this season.
Probably, the medal gives him some credibility. But they did not select Grice who had a 3:30.6 in 2019 after he finished 4th. Nothings guaranteed with 4 guys who have made finals in it.
Grice has had a reputation for not performing when it matters for years now. There's no way Kerr isn't selected if he's fit. He's got an Olympic medal from last year and broke two British indoor records this year. Gourley struggled to get the qualifying mark. It wouldn't surprise me if Kerr is allowed to skip the trials just as it seems Hodgkinson is being given permission to skip the 800, and just as Laura Muir was allowed to skip the 1500 at last year's Olympic trials.
Hodgkinson is given permission to skip the 800 not because she won a medal last year but because she has a wildcard for Eugene after winning DL final in Zurich last year.
And you say if he’s fit…he will likely need to be if he is going to be top 3 at UK Trials. Not that Gourley or Heyward are incredible or anything but they will close competitively in a slower race. Kerr was in great form last year running 3:31 by himself. This year is not the same as far as what we’ve seen on the track. Maybe he’s been holding something back.
No. The way to beat J.I. is in a slower pace 1500m race. A race with a rabbit is the not the race to beat J.I.
My point was actually twofold. One, it would have been a great race for a fast time. And of course Kerr runs his best off a hot pace.
And two, he does a great job of closing hard off a hot pace. In Tokyo he ran a second quicker than Jakob in the last 480 or so.
Did Josh Kerr beat J.I. in Tokyo? I must of missed that. Saying he ran a second faster than Jakob over the last 480 is such a dumb argument. Kerr can have a better kick than Jakob if he runs the first part of the race so slow that he won’t be able to catch him. If he stayed with Jakob while running the 3:46 mile, he would not have had that same kick. Since when do you get credit for out kicking someone when you lose the race by almost a second?
I feel like I’m taking crazy pills. Does nobody remember how last season the Brooks Beasts looked lost in the majority of races leading up to USA’s/Olympics, and then they peaked at the right time and were pretty competitive?
No chance am I writing off Kerr before the actual big races this season.
I feel like I’m taking crazy pills. Does nobody remember how last season the Brooks Beasts looked lost in the majority of races leading up to USA’s/Olympics, and then they peaked at the right time and were pretty competitive?
No chance am I writing off Kerr before the actual big races this season.
Other than Kerr, who from Brooks Beasts performed well at the Olympics/other big races?
Did Josh Kerr beat J.I. in Tokyo? I must of missed that.
Saying he ran a second faster than Jakob over the last 480 is such a dumb argument.
Since when do you get credit for out kicking someone when you lose the race by almost a second?
What we do when we discuss past and future races is to play the hypothetical game.
My argument regarding the Olympic 1500 was entirely factual and directly relevant to the matter at hand (the bronze medalist closed significantly quicker than the top two) and I said nothing of the sort you conjectured I did, and certainly nothing foolish or dumb.
I was in fact unaware of the Kerr hate on letsrun, so this has been an eye-opening thread for me.
Did Josh Kerr beat J.I. in Tokyo? I must of missed that.
Saying he ran a second faster than Jakob over the last 480 is such a dumb argument.
Since when do you get credit for out kicking someone when you lose the race by almost a second?
What we do when we discuss past and future races is to play the hypothetical game.
My argument regarding the Olympic 1500 was entirely factual and directly relevant to the matter at hand (the bronze medalist closed significantly quicker than the top two) and I said nothing of the sort you conjectured I did, and certainly nothing foolish or dumb.
I was in fact unaware of the Kerr hate on letsrun, so this has been an eye-opening thread for me.
You right that Kerr closed faster than Tim but faster than Jakob?
As far as I can see Kerr and Jakob closed the last 150-125m (the sprint finish) equally fast!?
Did Josh Kerr beat J.I. in Tokyo? I must of missed that.
Saying he ran a second faster than Jakob over the last 480 is such a dumb argument.
Since when do you get credit for out kicking someone when you lose the race by almost a second?
What we do when we discuss past and future races is to play the hypothetical game.
My argument regarding the Olympic 1500 was entirely factual and directly relevant to the matter at hand (the bronze medalist closed significantly quicker than the top two) and I said nothing of the sort you conjectured I did, and certainly nothing foolish or dumb.
I was in fact unaware of the Kerr hate on letsrun, so this has been an eye-opening thread for me.
Its such a daft argument and uninteresting statistic hough. Ofcourse he was running faster, he was trying to catch up. Its like thinking that its significant that Usain Bolt wasnt the fastest from 90m to the finish line in the Beijing Olympics. He was busy celebrating.
No. The way to beat J.I. is in a slower pace 1500m race. A race with a rabbit is the not the race to beat J.I.
Yes, Jacob's weakness is his speed so in the WC final with no pacemaker the field should just sit on Jacob and force him to choose between two bad alternatives: Either let the race crawl or lead the entire race.
[Kerr] does a great job of closing hard off a hot pace. In Tokyo he ran a second quicker than Jakob in the last 480 or so.
This isn't rocket science. When Kerr races JI, he faces a dilemma: If Kerr runs the first 1020 slowly enough to have a kick left, he ends up as he did in Tokyo -- too far behind JI to catch him; but if Kerr runs the first 1020 fast enough to stay closer to JI, he will end up too tired to run the final 480 fast enough to catch JI.
Kerr has two choices, neither attractive: Too far behind, or too pooped to pop.
No. The way to beat J.I. is in a slower pace 1500m race. A race with a rabbit is the not the race to beat J.I.
Yes, Jacob's weakness is his speed so in the WC final with no pacemaker the field should just sit on Jacob and force him to choose between two bad alternatives: Either let the race crawl or lead the entire race.
In the Bowerman mile Jakob was frontrunning the last 900m and the field "just" had to sit on him. How do think that turned out?
And since the DL Eugene Jakob has run more than 3 seconds faster in the mile. Do you believe the odds (for beating Jakob) will be better in Eugene at the Worlds?
What we do when we discuss past and future races is to play the hypothetical game.
My argument regarding the Olympic 1500 was entirely factual and directly relevant to the matter at hand (the bronze medalist closed significantly quicker than the top two).
I was in fact unaware of the Kerr hate on letsrun, so this has been an eye-opening thread for me.
Its such a daft argument and uninteresting statistic hough. Ofcourse he was running faster, he was trying to catch up.
LMAO, this comment is the definition of daft.
Anyway, I hope you are at least consistent and equally angered by any of the dozens of Rui Silva threads on these boards.
Its such a daft argument and uninteresting statistic hough. Ofcourse he was running faster, he was trying to catch up.
LMAO, this comment is the definition of daft.
Anyway, I hope you are at least consistent and equally angered by any of the dozens of Rui Silva threads on these boards.
Didn't mean to hurt your feelings or anything, but it should be quite obvious that the second runs as fast as he can while the first is running as fast as he have to to control the lead. And as others have pointed out, you also have to put into account the effort they have put in up to that point.
Other than Kerr, who from Brooks Beasts performed well at the Olympics/other big races?
With respect to the USA trials, they finished 5th, 11th, and 12th in the 1500m. That is performing well relative to expectations given qualifying, semis, and finals. Nike/Adidas/NB/Brooks are the historic big 4 of shoes. To have 25% of finalists is at or better than expectations given Brooks' perceived more modest resources. They had another athlete reach the semis too. Aside from final places, they were quite visual and noted on commentary. Brooks absolutely had the best ROI/marketing in that event. That said, aside from Kerr and maybe Isaiah Harris, they aren't as competitive at world events as some other shoe sponsored teams. I think it's true: leading up to the 2020(21) trials, Brooks Beasts didn't look strong, but then had an impressive showing.
Other than Kerr, who from Brooks Beasts performed well at the Olympics/other big races?
With respect to the USA trials, they finished 5th, 11th, and 12th in the 1500m. That is performing well relative to expectations given qualifying, semis, and finals. Nike/Adidas/NB/Brooks are the historic big 4 of shoes. To have 25% of finalists is at or better than expectations given Brooks' perceived more modest resources. They had another athlete reach the semis too. Aside from final places, they were quite visual and noted on commentary. Brooks absolutely had the best ROI/marketing in that event. That said, aside from Kerr and maybe Isaiah Harris, they aren't as competitive at world events as some other shoe sponsored teams. I think it's true: leading up to the 2020(21) trials, Brooks Beasts didn't look strong, but then had an impressive showing.
Brandon Kidder made it through rounds to the 800m final and took 5th.
David Ribich did not look that strong last year leading up to the trials...then he made the final in the 1500m.
Henry Wynne did not look that strong last year leading up to the trials....then he took 5th in the 1500m.
Garrett Heath made it through to the finals of the 5000m and then led for a chunk of the race.
Those results all surprised me based on where the Brooks Beasts appeared to be fitness-wise in the races leading up to the trials.
This isn't rocket science. When Kerr races JI, he faces a dilemma: If Kerr runs the first 1020 slowly enough to have a kick left, he ends up as he did in Tokyo -- too far behind JI to catch him; but if Kerr runs the first 1020 fast enough to stay closer to JI, he will end up too tired to run the final 480 fast enough to catch JI.
Kerr has two choices, neither attractive: Too far behind, or too pooped to pop.
I mean fit Kerr is very good at running a quick last 350-500 meters. His best scenario is a fast race from the gun because tactically/physically he is not a shifter. So unless he's leading or very aggressive he is going to be wasting energy and falling back and then surging if the pace isn't stringing out the field. Tokyo worked great for him because it was fast enough that he just went hard once it was time to. Maybe he waited a little too long given Tim's constraints with his hamstring. He can finish like a train so if it's a 3:32 or faster race go outside in lane 2 with 475-500m to go and get as close to the leaders as possible before tucking in. Try to outkick Jakob or Tim who don't have a crazy fast last 100 meters. If it's a slower race either take the lead and hold people off surging hard with 350 to go and holding to the finish. Or if stuck in the pack, accept that position and make a big move at 450 to get the lead and then try to hold it to the finish. I don't think waiting until 150 like a Hocker suits him. I don't think controlling from 650-700 out like Tim or Jakob would do is his best move either. It's the hard, extended finish with ideally not much jockeying in the pack beforehand.
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