Should men coach women?

OP -- this is a simple one. Drop this trash narrative & if you're a man don't sexually assault women. You have nothing to fear. Men like Alberto Salazar aren't being wronged. If you think he's being wronged, maybe you should reevaluate what your interactions with women are like.

Don't commit sexual assault. It's not that hard.

Yes they should. But very very carefully

You dumb dumbs can't even read! AGAIN, as a Mom, daughter, and sister, I don't think my assaulting children is my concern! lol

NERunner03533 wrote:

Don't commit sexual assault. It's not that hard.

What a trite summary. In a society with an ever-expanding concept of what sexual assault constitutes, it is entirely possible that an innocent misunderstanding can lead to severe repercussions. What you’re saying here is absolutely true on its face, but still facile. Would you tell people at a BLM rally that as long as they don’t commit a crime, there’s nothing to worry about from police?

You definitely seem earnest, so I’m guessing you’re not trolling, but has it never occurred to you that women falsely accuse men? Do you really need examples laid out for you? Ones that have derailed lives and caused untold damage to real victims and innocent people alike?

Otter, you have a weird sense of family and propriety if you ‘feel like they are your daughters,’ but are afraid to be alone with them.

Also your assertion that almost all accusations are true is laughably false. You have literally nothing to back that up.

My only advice would be is that any male coaching any females, ANY females is that you cannot be too careful.

Never alone.

Never text.

Never discuss anything other than the work to be done today. Nothing personal.

Sexual assault or harassment is one of those things where you can have a lifetime of spotless behavior and all it takes it one accusation, and you are toast.

If people think you are being too careful and too paranoid about it, you're probably doing it right.

kreipnn wrote:

Thousands of men are capable of doing it every day. Some crappy coaches are not.

Exactly. So many have shown themselves to be perfectly capable of it. But some Letsrun losers want to have you believe female athletes are just waiting to falsely accuse you and ruin your life.

YersiniaPestis wrote:

My only advice would be is that any male coaching any females, ANY females is that you cannot be too careful.

Never alone.

Never text.

Never discuss anything other than the work to be done today. Nothing personal.

Sexual assault or harassment is one of those things where you can have a lifetime of spotless behavior and all it takes it one accusation, and you are toast.

If people think you are being too careful and too paranoid about it, you're probably doing it right.

^^ This. Turns out Mike Pence had been playing this issue right all along and never let the mockery change his course. Hence, zero accusations of sexual impropriety.

surveysays wrote:

kreipnn wrote:

Thousands of men are capable of doing it every day. Some crappy coaches are not.

Exactly. So many have shown themselves to be perfectly capable of it. But some Letsrun losers want to have you believe female athletes are just waiting to falsely accuse you and ruin your life.

thats a stupid argument. the abusive women who talk about patriarchy are a minority. so obviously in the vast majority of cases the male boss/coach etc will be fine. that does not mean the danger has incrreased greatly because society is empowering those few abusive women.

noglacierforyougfdgdf wrote:

surveysays wrote:

Exactly. So many have shown themselves to be perfectly capable of it. But some Letsrun losers want to have you believe female athletes are just waiting to falsely accuse you and ruin your life.

thats a stupid argument. the abusive women who talk about patriarchy are a minority. so obviously in the vast majority of cases the male boss/coach etc will be fine. that does not mean the danger has incrreased greatly because society is empowering those few abusive women.

“ that does not mean the danger has incrreased greatly”

You’re arguing against yourself.

It’s not hard for men to coach women with extremely little risk if you are competent. Statistics prove that.

What statistics prove this?

D@db0d wrote:

NERunner03533 wrote:

Don't commit sexual assault. It's not that hard.

What a trite summary. In a society with an ever-expanding concept of what sexual assault constitutes, it is entirely possible that an innocent misunderstanding can lead to severe repercussions. What you’re saying here is absolutely true on its face, but still facile. Would you tell people at a BLM rally that as long as they don’t commit a crime, there’s nothing to worry about from police?

You definitely seem earnest, so I’m guessing you’re not trolling, but has it never occurred to you that women falsely accuse men? Do you really need examples laid out for you? Ones that have derailed lives and caused untold damage to real victims and innocent people alike?

Whataboutism 101. Not interested. It is that cut & dry. There are not a significant number of examples to back up what you're saying compared to the systemic trends on this issue. One woman falsely accuses a man so, what, women don't face very real sexual assault threats from men? Do you think it's a 50/50 between false accusers & violence towards women? It's not. Don't sexually assault women. You're regurgitating right wing talking points that posit men as victims, which doesn't help women in the slightest when they do come forward. Everything is already going to get turned into a he said/she said. Let the accused make that argument. You don't need to do it for them. You do not have to be cautious during women. You just have to not commit crimes.

&, no, your BLM example is not a good one. Again, non-white folks are systematically treated differently in interactions with police & in our criminal justice situation. Your example would actually be telling police they have nothing to fear in interactions with non-white folks. Police shouldn't have anything to fear. Just don't kill someone who isn't armed. Don't use excessive force & learn do deescalate situations. Don't act on biases. Cops shouldn't be fearful of not treating people equally -- they should treat people equally.

Well, women should not coach men, so it seems fair.

Statistics of how many millions of interactions there have been between male coaches and female athletes compared to the limited number of instances of the male coach's life being ruined by false accusations from a scorned female athlete.

Feel free to prove me wrong. It's just not that hard to stay out of trouble if you're competent.

"You do not have to be cautious during women"

I assume you mean you don't have to be cautious when you are coaching women?

That would be very very stupid. A teacher and a coach should be very cautious about being alone with of any athlete, male or female.

I don't think there's a mass movement of women out there looking to falsely accuse men, but people are hyper sensitive to stuff like this these days, and if you think for some reason that you are immune to the dangers of being accused of inappropriate behavior just because you are a "good guy" you are very naïve.

surveysays wrote:

Statistics of how many millions of interactions there have been between male coaches and female athletes compared to the limited number of instances of the male coach's life being ruined by false accusations from a scorned female athlete.

Feel free to prove me wrong. It's just not that hard to stay out of trouble if you're competent.

Well it's what risk you are prepared to take. The risk of being falsely accused is certainly not 'millions to one' as you imply. If this is the start of a #MeToo for track then there will be plenty of.coaches having their lives destroyed over the next few years. It's also that punishments are generally now way excessive for the crime when they do occur. Only hypocrites or the dead could have 100% confidence they would never give in to any temptation, whatever the situation. Why place yourself in an environment where you're in close contact for maybe years with attractive, healthy young females, when the merest 'inappropriate contact' could lead you to spending years in a brutal prison and a life of shame and fear on the public sex offenders register afterwards?

Regardless, men will increasingly thi k twice before entering coaching, just as they increasingly do teaching etc. In fact, pretty sure it started happening years ago, which is why an increasing number of great talents are coached by their dad's, such as the Ingebrigtsens, Max Burgin, Jake Wightman. Female athletes will be the losers.

D@db0d wrote:

Otter, you have a weird sense of family and propriety if you ‘feel like they are your daughters,’ but are afraid to be alone with them.

Also your assertion that almost all accusations are true is laughably false. You have literally nothing to back that up.

Apart from taking my statement directed at the OP for objectifying athletes out of context did not understanding me or maybe I did not explain it well enough.

Your viewpoint which is shared by many can be damaging. Let me explain.

I am not afraid to be alone with my athletes. It is not proper protocol for me to be alone with them. Part of the deal, and I have talked to my team about this is if they are in a situation later in life where there is a power imbalance like for example on their college team and the coach is having private meetings with them, they should have their guards up and have an exit strategy.

Part of the Safesport course is learning that almost all accusations are true. In a team environment the victim has little to nothing to gain from spreading false accusations. They usually feel at fault for what has happened and don't want to deal with the aftermath of the community judging them. Often the coach is well liked by athletes, parents, and the community. The victim is aware that there is a high potential to be isolated if they come out.

In a sad way, attitudes like yours keep the abuse secret and open up the potential for more athletes to be victimized.

The real question is, would female athletes prefer to be coached by women? Hard to get an accurate picture on Letsrun because female athletes avoid this site.

We can certainly agree that you should not coach women.