Is there a man on this earth that can have 10.5 100m speed and 13:30 5K endurance?

Runningart2004 wrote:

Peder wrote:

Rudisha, Coe and Kipketer at their peak fitness could break 11 and 14. That much seems rather obvious. All 3 had a rare combination of speed and endurance. Probably Joaquin Cruz also.

Nope.

People always overestimate the 100m potential of distance or middle distance runners.

Alan

David Rudisha and Sebastian Coe weren't just distance/middle distance runners, they were two of the greatest and fastest athletes ever. Sub 11 is not that fast - it's a nationally competitive time for a 14/15 year old boy, not an unfeasible time for a grown man racing 800m for a living.

(Doubt either of them could have run 10.5 FAT though, that's different territory.)

guy being a dude wrote:

Didn't Salazar say he clocked Rupp at sub-11?

Sub 12 flying 100 yes. But people make up stories.

FAT from blocks, absolutely not.

Flying, who knows.

I feel like Cole Hocker could do this pretty easily.

I think there are dozens of athletes who have the potential to run sub 13:30-5k and sub 10.5-100M but not in the same season. You could train david rudisha to do both at different times but never in the same season.

The training demands of each event are exactly opposite of eachother. Distance runners way underestimate how good a 10.5 second 100M is. We watch the olympics and see 8 sub 10.0 second 100M performances and think...any athlete can do that! Not true.

Webb talked about this. he said that you can run a fast 10K or a fast 800M but not at the same time. And a 800M race is worlds apart from a 100M race.

NO for 10.5 and 13:30. 10.5 is flying.

Sub 11 and sub 13:30

mostly definitely WITHOUT A DOUBT

Kenenusa Bekele

Sebastian Coe

They would have to train 1-2 months on speed but they could

Rudolf Harbig is the athlete in history who would have been capable of pulling off a feat like this, at least the relative feat for the standards of his day.

He ran 10.6 when the 100m WR was 10.3. He was the WR holder in the 400, 800, and 1000m.

He ran the 1500m only several times, usually in his first outing of the season and after winning a 200m an hour before. He did this the year before he reached his prime, running 4:01 after a 22 second 200m. He went on to improve his 1000m time by 10 seconds, so you would think he was probably capable of at least sub 3:50 1500m when the WR was only 3:45. The 5000m WR was only 14:15 or something. Surely a 1;46 800m runner could break 15 minutes for the 5000m, which would be the 1940's equivalent of a sub 10.5 sprinter running 13:30.

I remember reading that in 2012 Salazar had Rupp and Farah run an all out 100m after a full recovery at the end of a workout ro test their top end speed. They both had a 2 step running start. Galen ran 10.8 and Mo ran 11.2. I'm not sure if their results are typical or not of typical top male distance runners.

robert678 wrote:

I remember reading that in 2012 Salazar had Rupp and Farah run an all out 100m after a full recovery at the end of a workout ro test their top end speed. They both had a 2 step running start. Galen ran 10.8 and Mo ran 11.2. I'm not sure if their results are typical or not of typical top male distance runners.

You would have to add at least a second for the start. Those two would be lucky to break 12.0 FAT. Again, the closest athlete we’ve seen is Rudisha who maybe could have done a 10.7 if he trained for the 100m but he would not have been in his best 5000m shape. When he broke the world record he could have run around 11.0 FAT and 14:00

I don't care what name or stats you pull out, Harbig, Everett, etc--it is not possible if you are talking 10.50 FAT from blocks. The requirements are mutually exclusive.

Look at me. Sub-10.5? Yes. As far as distance goes, maybe 2 yrs ago (50's) I did a 5k which someone age-graded, and it turns out that it was the same as a 2-miles I ran in HS. Was my distance time sub-13:30? Not even close. Could it have been with training? No way. The wiring is different, the muscle fiber composition is different, the energy systems are different, the actual musculoskeletal physiology is different, etc.

And I'm a guy who actually enjoys "going hard" at distance. Jack of all trades, master of none. Not one single other sub-10.5 sprinter I have ever known has come even remotely close to running distance like me. A very few of them have jogged a mile or two, once in their lives, at best. It just doesn't happen. They HATE distance, they don't get sustained pain like that.

It is not possible, unless a very young just-sub-13:30 guy completely converts to sprints and sups up massively while he is still young, think a Ryan Hall-level transformation. And even at that, there would have to be natural 100m ability. "Built" 100m sprinters don't get under 10.7-10.9 FAT. An untrained natural sprinter will smoke a trained built sprinter every time.

Imagine? wrote:

Is there anyone who might be able to have this range? What would they be capable of in the 800m? 1500m/Mile?

Honestly I love to see people with wide range very impressive to me.

The laws of physics are a thing...

There's a reason sprinters look like NFL players and marathoners look like 5 year old boys.

I have a friend who ran 10.87 FAT in college and 2:52 in the marathon post-graduation.

Have to imagine there aren't that many people out there who have gone both sub 11 and sub 3

Could Brazier run a 13:30 (when fully healthy)? Because I'm pretty sure he can do a 10.5.

KieranMac wrote:

Could Brazier run a 13:30 (when fully healthy)? Because I'm pretty sure he can do a 10.5.

Two pages and no one has stated Emmanuel Korir, even to debate one way or the other. I do not know due to injuries if Korir has the same youthful energy in his legs, but Korir a few years ago was truly F.A.T. sub-10.50 capable. If Korir had to do both within a week, then no. If Korir had 18 months between events, maybe. In regard to D. Brazier, not enough of a quality sprinter. An 800m runner not capable of F.A.T. sub-45.50 is not sprinting F.A.T. sub-10.50. Brazier is capable of sub-13:30 5000m IF Brazier felt like training in that manner.

Rupp fan wrote:

I feel like Cole Hocker could do this pretty easily.

13:30, yes easily. 10.5 from blocks, not if he dedicated his life to it.

Seen 10.5 guy run 4:20 mile. That’s about it.

I'm fairly certain Brazier would not be in any way interested in this thought experiment. But agreed that world-class 800m runners are going to be closest to meeting both standards. Milers aren't going to be close on the speed side.

I suspect you're right that a handful of elite 800 runners could do a 10.5 flying start and a 13:30 if they changed their training paradigm for 6 months, but 10.5 F.A.T. and 13:30 is a step too far.

So have to plus one those who have stated 11 seconds is not that fast / hard. 11 second is the state meet qualifying standard for many states and literally hundreds of high school runners break 11 seconds every year. An elite 5K runner could definitely break 11 without a lot of specific training.

10.5 as people have stated is a whole other beast and it comes down to different training and nutrition. Weight plays a big role for longer distances and it is an advantage to weigh less. Muscle plays a much larger role in sprinting. Someone like Bernard Lagat who was competitive over a large number of middle and longer distances was 5'8 maybe 5'9 and raced in the low 130s, Set Coe who was 5'9 raced even lighter, under 125 pounds at his prime.

Usain Bolt 6'5 and over 200 pounds, Justin Gatlin 6'1 and 175+ pounds

Distances runners tend to be shorter and slighter builds and sprinters taller and fuller builds.

I think someone like Steve Cram who was 6'1 could probably have gotten close to 10.5 had he bulked up and trained for sprinting. He raced at 152 pounds, if he added 20 to 25 pounds of muscle to have a build more like Gatlin I think he'd have a good shot at getting close to 10.5. As it was he had a sub 1:43 800M and a sub 13:30 5000M and a 3:46;32 mile. Cram was slower than Coe in the 800 but much faster in the 5000 which to be fair wasn't a focus of Coe but Cram also had a better mile PR. I'd put him ahead of Coe in terms of most likely to pull off a 10.5 and 13:30 double.

xxxdr wrote:

I think peak Webb could have been as close as anyone.

I was honestly going to at least ask about Webb. Didn't he run 1:43 / 13:10 in the same season? What does a 1:43 equate to? 11.0? 11.5? At least close enough to be worth a mention with all the other people that couldn't do it.