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Kobbs Hessler wrote:
Who are those guys? You still have to be a strong runner to post a 2:27 (and be capable of 2:20). But if you're that good, why would you waste a marathon at a 95% effort for, what, a thousand bucks?
solid long run workout for a 2 teens guy. Or you could be dirt poor and a thousand bucks is worth a ton to you. Anyways, its probably a few thousand, not 1k, which is how they get the pacers.
The pacers were not hired by the Chicago marathon. So they had no reason to go with Emma when she passed Sara. Emma had a pacer past 20 miles so she wasn't alone, she had a great race. Anyone can hire pacers, so maybe she should of.
I loved it when Chepnegetich burned off her male pacer at about 10 miles.
sticks to 10 wrote:
This is why track will always be more pure than road running. No super shoes, no male pacers running the whole way with women.
And certainly no light you can use to know exactly how fast to run.
Agreed. Blatantly against the rules to run alongside and coach. Every noob knows this.
If I had an athlete in that race, I'd protest.
wejo wrote:
I guess this is legal as they are making no attempt to hide it but Sara Hall has had private male pacers the entire way in Chicago.
What do you all think of this? The lead women had no pacers since I'm not sure when, halfway? Emma Bates didn't have a pacer for sure at the end.
Thanks for starting this thread Wejo. The Paula case came to mind immediately for me and I'm glad that you clarified that particular situation.
But I agree, it looked funny and also seems unfair to other top competitors who may not have deep pockets. There was prize money at stake. It is not a level field when this is allowed.
Many people do not like personal pacers in marathons. If personal pacers are legal then women should only be allowed women pacers.
However, ANY personal pacers in a race with prize money seems unethical.
NAIA nobody wrote:
I loved it when Chepnegetich burned off her male pacer at about 10 miles.
Could he simply not keep up at that point?
Cheat wrote:
She’s a cheating skank. Just like Rupp ‘Salazar Juice’ Gaylen. He loves the sauce, inside him and all over him. He’s also got awful teeth and is an imbecile. Stupid cheating prick.
Wow, just wow!!!!!
She is obviously capable of breaking 2:20 but was not going to do it in the conditions today.
It's 26.2 miles, not a mile. People aren't on every time. She ran 2:22:01 last year in London and 2.5 months later she ran 2:20:32.
Ryan running a small section here and there encouraging her means what? If he didn't show up at those spots, would she have run a slower time? Did you see her noticeably slow or down or accelerate when he was present?
Do you guys actually believe there weren't coaches out there for other teams doing the same thing. You didn't see them on camera, but they were there.
On the sauce? If I were her I'd get an attorney and sue the posters who are claiming this with zero evidence.
Calling her a cheating skank on an anonymous message board is weak, really weak. If you met her in person you'd pee your pants.
I am seriously beginning to think that there truly are a lot of actual hobby joggers on this site. A lot of you are low-lifes, evil jealous low-lifes.
RunnerNerdKnowItAll wrote:
The pacers were not hired by the Chicago marathon. So they had no reason to go with Emma when she passed Sara. Emma had a pacer past 20 miles so she wasn't alone, she had a great race. Anyone can hire pacers, so maybe she should of.
There was a guy wearing a headband with a PACER bib and Nike gear (white singlet/black shorts) who ran slighly in front of the two Asics guys (blue singlets/black shorts). Based on the camera angle, he was in some shots, but not others.
Kobbs Hessler wrote:
Who are those guys? You still have to be a strong runner to post a 2:27 (and be capable of 2:20). But if you're that good, why would you waste a marathon at a 95% effort for, what, a thousand bucks?
Because a thousand bucks is far more than what a man could expect to otherwise earn to competitively run a 2:20 marathon.
What would you rather do? Run 2:20 and finish way back of the top men while being otherwise forgotten or unnoticed? Or run a steady 2:27 to pace somebody and pocket $1,000?
Equality: the state of being equal, especially in status, rights, and opportunities.
I think these types of situations result in an issue of inequality of opportunity for elite men as compared to elite women.
If a race wants to prop up a world record effort for an Eliud Kipchoge type, who are they going to pay to run with him the entire race? Answer: nobody. They don’t exist.
Yet, if a race wants to prop up a world record effort for a women’s race, all they have to do is bring in some 2:10-2:15 male runners and they are allowed to have that company for the entirety of the race.
For the purity of the sport, I think attempts should only be considered record eligible if your pacers and support are participating in the same race division.
I understand, but there's also a performance benefit, and I'd love to see it accounted for (it never will be, but that's my personal annoyance).
inequality of opportunity wrote:
Equality: the state of being equal, especially in status, rights, and opportunities.
I think these types of situations result in an issue of inequality of opportunity for elite men as compared to elite women.
If a race wants to prop up a world record effort for an Eliud Kipchoge type, who are they going to pay to run with him the entire race? Answer: nobody. They don’t exist.
Yet, if a race wants to prop up a world record effort for a women’s race, all they have to do is bring in some 2:10-2:15 male runners and they are allowed to have that company for the entirety of the race.
For the purity of the sport, I think attempts should only be considered record eligible if your pacers and support are participating in the same race division.
I agree. And events with pacers who just jump in to the race like in the sub-2 hour "record" attempts are a joke.
All it takes are some lawsuits from angry runners who lost out on prize money to make the race organizers change their tune. Of course the plaintiffs would then end up being blacklisted and labeled as poor losers.
Emma was paced well past 22 miles. She had a group of 3-4 runners who were supposed to go with her as well but she became the lone person after a while. Sara had 3 personal pacers. The leader had a pacer. The men had pacers. They all had pacers to help work through the day.
It was a mixed race. World Athletic rules allow for men pacing women. The greater concern is Ryan, who was not entered, running on the sidewalk and yelling at Sara.
Wejo,
With the pacing lights on tracks now, pacers for everything and anything, yes, this is totally fair. She still has to run the pace. Not even a hint of a problem for me here.
assistance. wrote:
It was a mixed race. World Athletic rules allow for men pacing women. The greater concern is Ryan, who was not entered, running on the sidewalk and yelling at Sara.
Spectators can run alongside the course and yell if they're able (they usually aren't once there's a lot of spectators or obstacles), so long as they don't cause any significant problems for other spectators, or enter the actual course itself.
I don't believe pacers should be allowed in major marathons or ultras. Times will be slower, but the racing will be better.
Breakfast In Bed wrote:
Kobbs Hessler wrote:
Who are those guys? You still have to be a strong runner to post a 2:27 (and be capable of 2:20). But if you're that good, why would you waste a marathon at a 95% effort for, what, a thousand bucks?
Because a thousand bucks is far more than what a man could expect to otherwise earn to competitively run a 2:20 marathon.
What would you rather do? Run 2:20 and finish way back of the top men while being otherwise forgotten or unnoticed? Or run a steady 2:27 to pace somebody and pocket $1,000?
I'd just be happy to run that fast in the first place. But genuinely curious how much these guys got paid to pace Sara. $1000 is a reasonable guess, but if anyone knows for sure, would love to hear it. If these are 2:15-2:17 guys when running alone, being asked to run as fast as 2:20 is a major effort. Not too many guys that good who would pace a chick for a couple bucks.