nhlgoalie wrote:
As others have speculated, she has likely been micro-dosing and beating tests for some time. She screwed up a dosage and got caught. This is good for the sport. Get these cheaters out of there.
For sure. She has been eating at that burrito truck since 2018.
well absorbed wrote:
Harambe wrote:
Does anyone have ANY evidence nandrolone is effective orally? Orally-active steroids need specific chemical properties that nandrolone doesn't have.
it is well digested in the gasto-intestinal tract but rapidly inactivated by the liver - which is why when you take it orally it is quickly cleared, making it an ideal drug for people who wish to cheat.
Nandrolone☆
B.L. Furman, in Reference Module in Biomedical Sciences, 2017
Human Pharmacokinetics
Nandrolone esters are well absorbed from intramuscular sites with an absorption half-life of about 6–7 days (Wijnand et al., 1985). The chemical nature of the ester influences absorption rate and peak plasma concentrations, higher peak plasma concentrations (∼ 30 nM) being achieved after the phenpropionate compared with the decanoate (∼ 14 nM). Plasma concentrations of nandrolone relate well to biological effects in terms of endocrine parameters (suppression of plasma testosterone and inhibin concentrations; Minto et al., 1997). Nandrolone itself, like testosterone, is well absorbed from the gastro-intestinal tract but rapidly inactivated in the liver. Its main metabolites are 19-norandrosterone and 19-noretiocholanolone (Le et al., 2002).
Yes, exactly, first-pass hepatic metabolism means that effectively none of the drug makes it into general circulation -- only inactivated metabolites.
THOUGHTSLEADER wrote:
chipotlenextime wrote:
From what I read (if she was cheating), they do not believe she was injecting it...she must have been ingesting this. It was stated that this would leave the body in 24 hours.
So, if Shelby slipped herself some nandrolone the day before, received a random drug test call, why not avoid showing up? Can't you receive a whereabout failure once without consequences?
Wouldn't it make more sense to do this than risk a possible positive?
From another thread:
"Conte said nandrolone is often detected when an athlete is taking another banned substance—likely testosterone—that was manufactured in an illicit laboratory that doesn't adhere to strict quality standards and also makes drugs for bodybuilders, who, of course, aren't subject to drug testing. Because nandrolone can be detected in such low quantities, cross contamination from using the same equipment to manufacture other substances can happen.
For example, Conte said, testosterone is often manufactured using glassware, which needs to be cleaned with nitric and perchloric acids. But illicit labs that manufacture testosterone often don't adhere to such rigid standards. If not, it's quite possible the same equipment was cleaned with less powerful acids, leaving trace amounts of nandrolone on the equipment and, eventually, into the batch of testosterone."
I have read no other explanation of Shelby's bust that is as plausible as this one. Women taking testosterone to get an edge in sports is as effective and alluring as ever. Microdosing is safe as well...unless you get a tainted dose.
I think this explanation makes sense.
Consider also that she ordered a steak burrito. She had likely had the steak burrito as cover for the other drugs she was taking in the event she tested positive. Tainted beef is a well used excuse for other peds.
But when she tested positive for nandrolone instead (due to above mentioned possibility of contamination), they had to make up this story about how she probably had a boar burrito instead because it was extra greasy.
Free_the_thigh wrote:
I think this explanation makes sense.
Consider also that she ordered a steak burrito. She had likely had the steak burrito as cover for the other drugs she was taking in the event she tested positive. Tainted beef is a well used excuse for other peds.
But when she tested positive for nandrolone instead (due to above mentioned possibility of contamination), they had to make up this story about how she probably had a boar burrito instead because it was extra greasy.
Highly doubtful that she would be using black-market hormones when there are countless docs ready to prescribe legitimate stuff?
well absorbed wrote:
It's not really "more efficient" as much as you can avoid the liver breaking it down through intramuscular injection, so you can have it in your system for a prolonged period of time from a single does and don't need to have a needle every single day. Whereas with the pill your liver breaks it down so you have to repeat the dosage. If you are legally taking the drug it's obviously beneficial to take it by injection for long lasting effects. But if you are cheating and subject to random testing, you really want to be able to clear the drug quickly.
Oral bioavailability is extremely low though. She'd need to be taking tens of milligrams or more of the stuff which shows up as metabolites in your urine for days.
Contaminated supplement is a possibility but how could you be that careless???
Harambe wrote:
Highly doubtful that she would be using black-market hormones when there are countless docs ready to prescribe legitimate stuff?
Like a legitimate doctor prescribing testosterone to a female athlete? Don't know if that's something you'd find too easy...think of how Balco was run and operated.
Salvitore Stitchmo wrote:
All of this sounds so incredibly risky and stupid. But I don't know how to frame this up - not only did she get caught, she then compounded her problems by defending herself with an easily debunked tale? Maybe she is, well, stupid?
Stupid? No as it was probably at the lawyers advice to go down this road. As with a murder case in which a suspect has his or her fingerprint show up at the murder site, every piece of evidence against her has to be defeated and there aren't a whole lot of ready made reasons which sound creditable for how Nandrolone showed up in her system.
THOUGHTSLEADER wrote:
Harambe wrote:
Highly doubtful that she would be using black-market hormones when there are countless docs ready to prescribe legitimate stuff?
Like a legitimate doctor prescribing testosterone to a female athlete? Don't know if that's something you'd find too easy...think of how Balco was run and operated.
I imagine BALCO was doing pretty rigorous organic chemistry considering their work went basically undetected until someone ratted them out.
TTH wrote:
Stupid? No as it was probably at the lawyers advice to go down this road. As with a murder case in which a suspect has his or her fingerprint show up at the murder site, every piece of evidence against her has to be defeated and there aren't a whole lot of ready made reasons which sound creditable for how Nandrolone showed up in her system.
Dude - I meant stupid as in the f--king around with substances that could get her banned for 4 years and basically end her career in the first place.
The defense of the ginormous burrito full of "tainted" pork - yeah I understand that. You either own it or you concoct a story like this.
I have a totally uneducated guess that she was microdosing and the burrito put her over. Her levels were already high but below threshold, and then the burrito with offals put her over. I’d love to see where her previous tests put her for nandrolone, something I’m sure the court of arbitration took into account when imposing the 4 year ban.
Harambe wrote:
I imagine BALCO was doing pretty rigorous organic chemistry considering their work went basically undetected until someone ratted them out.
Sorry I meant more that BALCO's popularity and prominence. You could lump in Biogenesis with this. They both had a huge pro athlete client base for what they were.
My point is there might be fewer options to get untainted illegal supplements than we think. The big boys have been getting taken down. Is there a doctor like Dr. Brown (for Salazar) who is known to provide testosterone for female athletes from high-quality labs. Maybe there is, and a big scandal is coming or maybe this is a fragmented business, and Shelby got burned.
She may have thought she would pass the test, as she always had.
But most likely, she or someone answered the door when the tester arrived.
At that point, her goose was cooked.
You cannot then use whereabouts failure to dodge a test - your whereabouts is known.
Failure to provide a sample is a 2-year suspension.
Surely it’s not as simple as fitting into a natural range? I know blood passports were supposed to help tackle micro dosing up to a given limit, but does anyone know if the tests themselves can differentiate between natural and synthetic levels?
2.0 ng/mL is the threshold WADA has set, which is above normal for an adult female. She could’ve been popping 1.99s for years and never hitting positive. But like I said, just an uneducated guess.
Harambe wrote:
Free_the_thigh wrote:
I think this explanation makes sense.
Consider also that she ordered a steak burrito. She had likely had the steak burrito as cover for the other drugs she was taking in the event she tested positive. Tainted beef is a well used excuse for other peds.
But when she tested positive for nandrolone instead (due to above mentioned possibility of contamination), they had to make up this story about how she probably had a boar burrito instead because it was extra greasy.
Highly doubtful that she would be using black-market hormones when there are countless docs ready to prescribe legitimate stuff?
More doubtful than she happened to go to Mexican food truck which happened to serve boar tacos, the Mexican food truck then screwed up her order and gave her a boar taco, then she choose to not to get her taco remade correctly, and then she happened to get tested the very next day?
In addition a month later she recalled that taco was extra greasy and therefore it must have been a boar taco?
More unlikely than that?
Black market implies a sketch guy in a parking lot at night, but in reality it also includes numerous websites shipping what appear to be legitimate substances.
But in that case wouldn’t it make sense - especially for male athletes - to basically on TRT (fertility issues aside)?
nandrolone is an injectiable steroid,much like trenbolone only nowhere near as harsh.i doubt she was only on nandrolone.She had to be using EPO as well,because the two drugs together would explain her improvements.Steroids alone arent as good in middle and long distance as EPO and put the two together,and youve got a firecraker up your butt.....
jeff tallon wrote:
nandrolone is an injectiable steroid,much like trenbolone only nowhere near as harsh.i doubt she was only on nandrolone.She had to be using EPO as well,because the two drugs together would explain her improvements.Steroids alone arent as good in middle and long distance as EPO and put the two together,and youve got a firecraker up your butt.....
YES
greg doucette analysis
If she were micro-dosing (my best guess), the burrito or whatever she claims to have eaten could have pushed the amount of nandrolone above the legal threshold. If you're cheating why not be smart about it and avoid consuming foods that contain the substance you're administering yourself? Anyways, I think you brought up a relevant point