Jenny Simpson was a better runner than Sifan Hassan until last year

nothing to see here wrote:

Armstronglivs wrote:

I can believe Simpson was clean. Does that count?

She was a patient of Dr. Brown.

But not coached by Salazar.

She also used inhalers. Lewis Johnson asked her about it once after a race.

Jo72 wrote:

Hassan was even in 2017 with big wins and a bronze in London WC a rather poor/inconsistent tactictian.

I remember when Hassan lost to Meraf Bahta in the European Championship 5000m final. She ran like a complete beginner.

Armstronglivs wrote:

Armstronglivs wrote:

So that explains how some are so much faster now? But other aren't? Right.

So your point was?

The Earth's orbit around the Sun is obviously drug assisted. You know it, I know it WADA know it.

Anyone with any common sense knows it. But some people are in denial.

The only way an American is touching her is if they are willing to lose 15 pounds.

fghrunner wrote:

Jenny and Hassan have traded wins since 2014, with Jenny winning more important battles at worlds, olympics, etc. Hassan in 2019 to now seems superhuman. Could Jenny keep up with her for the last mile of her 10K?? Now that she's not working with Alberto and still running well, can we assume she is/was clean?

No Hassan’s 1500 10k double was one of the greatest achievements in running ever her range has always been unmatched and we will continue to see that when she decideds to go all in on the half and full

linelkneen wrote:

She also used inhalers. Lewis Johnson asked her about it once after a race.

Did they contain EPO? I suspect Hassan uses something much more potent than inhalers.

Sniff and Hands On wrote:

The only way an American is touching her is if they are willing to lose 15 pounds.

I suspect it will take something other than weight loss.

well,, wrote:

Jo72 wrote:

Hassan was even in 2017 with big wins and a bronze in London WC a rather poor/inconsistent tactictian.

I remember when Hassan lost to Meraf Bahta in the European Championship 5000m final. She ran like a complete beginner.

Until her transformation in 2018/19 I would never have picked Hassan to dominate women's distance running. The Africans looked like they had it all over her. But she has left the field faster than Ben Johnson at Seoul.

Jo72 wrote:

Jenny Simpson was a supreme tactician and therefore gained considerably more victories at big events than would correspond to her raw running abilities. (Krause is a bit similar on a lower level, she managed to get two WC Bronze medals from #6-8 seed before the event.)

As a quick look at the stats shows, Hassan was already better at 21 in the 1500m as far as raw running goes. Hassan was even in 2017 with big wins and a bronze in London WC a rather poor/inconsistent tactictian. She has become better but proportionally not as much as at least a handful of other top runners (most of whom didn't run as fast at 20-21 as she did)

When a runner races in 5th place until 200m to go and then said runner takes advantage of runners who raced to win and falling apart on homestretch, I am not calling those runners superior anything. Sifan Hassan has always raced to win, every international race in which Hassan has entered. Simpson is in the same class as: Paul Heinz-Wellmann, FRG, Klaus Peter Hildenbrand, FRG and Ian Stewart, GBR. Runners who raced in 5th place until 200m to go then earned bronze medal. Hassan could have stayed back in the pack with Simpson and raced for bronze. If a runner races back in the back and then prevails with gold medal as did John Walker, 1976 1500m final and Fermin Cacho, 1992 1500m final, I congratulate them, not runners who race tactically for a bronze.

Armstronglivs wrote:

well,, wrote:

I remember when Hassan lost to Meraf Bahta in the European Championship 5000m final. She ran like a complete beginner.

Until her transformation in 2018/19 I would never have picked Hassan to dominate women's distance running. The Africans looked like they had it all over her. But she has left the field faster than Ben Johnson at Seoul.

I still consider her to be African.

Armstronglivs wrote:

well,, wrote:

I remember when Hassan lost to Meraf Bahta in the European Championship 5000m final. She ran like a complete beginner.

Until her transformation in 2018/19 I would never have picked Hassan to dominate women's distance running. The Africans looked like they had it all over her.

Then you didn't pay attention in 2017. Hassan was mostly focussing on the 1500m in 2017 and a dominating runner in the DL, losing in the WC final partly because of horrible tactics but getting a bronze in the 5k which had clearly been only her "B event". One can just look this up, she was top 3 in the world in the 1500 from 2014-17; it's true that she was beaten by the likes of Dibaba and Kipyegon but it's simply untrue that she was not a world class runner in 2014-16 before Salazar. With sub 8:30 3k it was also not a surprise that she would be able to run a very strong 5000m as soon as she made it a focus.

Sure, the half marathon in 2018 and since 2019 was extraordinary. There is no denying this. I am not denying that she is suspicious but that's in no way unique about her. Even disregarding roads (where the shoes might be a factor) there plenty of equally suspicious runners (who often rose to the top far more quickly) in the last 6 years or so.

Haida Pigskin wrote:

Armstronglivs wrote:

Until her transformation in 2018/19 I would never have picked Hassan to dominate women's distance running. The Africans looked like they had it all over her. But she has left the field faster than Ben Johnson at Seoul.

I still consider her to be African.

She doesn't.

I didnt say she wasn't world class. But she wasn't beating the best. But her transformation has been off the charts. Through the stratosphere. That I wouldn't have picked. No one did.