Asbel Kiprop is going to court so he can represent Kenya at 2022 Eugene Worlds

xczvzxcv wrote:

It strikes me that all your posts are in support of dopers or likely dopers. Asbel Kiprop was doping for a long time and you know it. Kiprop's defenses were also ludicrous. The IAAF needs to strip him of all of his medals and pass them on to guys cheated by him out of medals.

I honestly don't know when Kiprop started doping. I really don't buy his I got framed defense, that I will say. It's tempting to think his entire career he was and that's why he was the best athlete from 2008 to 2015. However, doping is also something a desperate athlete could turn to as they are physically failing. We've seen that before.

The fact is that Kiprop was fading into obscurity at the time he was busted. In 2017 it was pretty clear he was no longer the same athlete as before, and he was soundly beaten in many races and running slower than ever before. Unless there is an underlying injury, which has not been suggested, there's no reason to think he'd ever be in the medal hunt on the world stage again even if allowed to compete. He's 32 in a month so this sort of decline really isn't too strange. He also not known as the most disciplined or endurance-focused athlete, so a decline as his footspeed diminished feels very reasonable as well.

STEVE THE ADDICT^^^^^^""""""""--^' wrote:

Ghost1 wrote:

Tenuous subject, but the Kenyan, Kiprop, never admitted to doping and stated that the case against him was flawed seriously from the start involving a certain amount of corruption and Tea money.

You're the one who should be banned from the sport of running. It's obvious you use doping runners to profit personally. GTFOH

How is it possible that Ghost would profit personally if it was like you say? How come ?

If he is a coach or an agent or manager of athletes then he is using doping athletes to make money like a pimp. He is clearly aware of doping being a problem but acts ignorant and instead defends the dopers. Fact of, these greedy agents and coaches such as Aden, Ross, Verardelli, Canova all act as if they know nothing about doping towards the public but you can bet damn well they encourage it and seek out doping athletes so they can personally make more money off their cut from the athlete. They are the problem with athletics amd are complicit in a culture of doping.

STEVE THE ADDICT^^^^^^""""""""--^' wrote:

If he is a coach or an agent or manager of athletes then he is using doping athletes to make money like a pimp. He is clearly aware of doping being a problem but acts ignorant and instead defends the dopers. Fact of, these greedy agents and coaches such as Aden, Ross, Verardelli, Canova all act as if they know nothing about doping towards the public but you can bet damn well they encourage it and seek out doping athletes so they can personally make more money off their cut from the athlete. They are the problem with athletics amd are complicit in a culture of doping.

That's just nonsense! Ghost is neither coach or manager.And to think Canova involved in doping is just ridiculous!

Ghost1 wrote:

Asbel K. remains for many, one of the most exciting if not the most exciting 1500 m runner of all time.

Settle down lol

casual obsever wrote:

John Wesley Harding wrote:

No, no. He was an immensely talented 1500 runner who would have been in the mix for medals for a decade, clean, but he doped in pursuit of the WR and dominance. He definitely doped. And by several reports he carried on like a violent jackass.

Yes we know that he doped. But we don't know how good he would have been without doping, like 0 (hi rekrunner!), 3, or 6 seconds slower. With a 3:32 PR, he might never have gotten a medal.

We also don't know whether a clean Kiprop would have beaten a clean Ramzi, for example. It's the Armstrong argument all over again.

In any case, I appreciate the plan to not let dopers compete for your country anymore. We should do the same, no more Gay or Gatlin for example.

True.

Athletic ability is a finite window. If you waste, tough sheet.

Athletes, like buses, come along fairly regularly.

Move on. He sucked the finances out of his time. He can spend it on the bench

Kipyegon absolutely skonks the field in a sit-and-kick special. Probably a 57 second type last lap with a 28 pt last 200. Not really impressed with anyone in that field outside of her...I suppose you give credit to Goule for holding on for second after taking the pace for a long time.

Wrong thread but a comment on this. I hope Kenya holds strong. The lifetime ban from representing the country is a GREAT measure. I would take it out for stimulants or more gray area situations, but this is not one of those.

SUPERIOR COACH JS wrote:

xczvzxcv wrote:

It strikes me that all your posts are in support of dopers or likely dopers. Asbel Kiprop was doping for a long time and you know it. Kiprop's defenses were also ludicrous. The IAAF needs to strip him of all of his medals and pass them on to guys cheated by him out of medals.

Well.........this is one of the most strange doping cases ever. It`s no doubt the samples A and B were positive, but many strange circumstances they became to be .

Did you read the details of the case? Kiprop threw a lot a laundry list of excuses for his doping ban and none stuck.

The man sets a terrible example with his running and life outside running.

trollism wrote:

Dopers hardly ever admit to their doping.

I have never seen this one trying to defend himself

Even when the Moroccan public was "furious" against his Bahraini escale, he never reacted.

The cold war man.

I have never followed Alaoui Selsouli era, but according to a youtube video she was extremely talented, had more than 60 anti-dopage tests in two years and one of them was fatal.

It's a bit unfortunate. I think a lout of runners are discouraged by the new severe IAAF restrictions from IAAF.

https://en.africatopsports.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/Mariem-Alaoui-Selsouli_2800421.jpg

Passant wrote:

I have never followed Alaoui Selsouli era, but according to a youtube video she was extremely talented, had more than 60 anti-dopage tests in two years and one of them was fatal.

It's a bit unfortunate. I think a lout of runners are discouraged by the new severe IAAF restrictions from IAAF.

It's unfortunate indeed that so many African runners are being discouraged by stricter anti-doping. All they are trying to do is to raise their families out of poverty.

casual obsever wrote:

John Wesley Harding wrote:

No, no. He was an immensely talented 1500 runner who would have been in the mix for medals for a decade, clean, but he doped in pursuit of the WR and dominance. He definitely doped. And by several reports he carried on like a violent jackass.

Yes we know that he doped. But we don't know how good he would have been without doping, like 0 (hi rekrunner!), 3, or 6 seconds slower. With a 3:32 PR, he might never have gotten a medal.

We also don't know whether a clean Kiprop would have beaten a clean Ramzi, for example. It's the Armstrong argument all over again.

In any case, I appreciate the plan to not let dopers compete for your country anymore. We should do the same, no more Gay or Gatlin for example.

Well hello casual.

Why limit the range of improvement from 0 to 3 to 6 seconds slower, and not 0 to 3 to 6 seconds faster? We know that once Kiprop became suspicious of doping, Kiprop got 3 seconds slower in 2016, and 7 seconds slower in 2017.

But do we even know he doped? We know he was convicted based on a lab indicating a positive test result. Again, I recall the details from similar cases of athletes Vojtěch Sommer, Steven Colvert, and Benedikt Karus that show that some labs get this urine test for EPO wrong, contaminating samples during testing and then giving the wrong interpretation. Then it is virtually impossible that the athletes get the raw data in time to defend themselves, and mounting such a legal defense comes at great personal expense, at a time when their income has dried up. Prof. Erik Boye has written a great deal about this bias against athletes once a lab says a test is positive, but will not share the raw results.

Before talking about lifetime bans, the process has to be 100% accurate against false positives.

I never though he was as good as people say.

The records seemed out of reach for him.

rojo wrote:

His ban is up in February.

https://www.standardmedia.co.ke/amp/athletics/article/2001413953/ill-take-ak-to-court-to-run-again-says-asbel-kiprop

This reminds me of Dwain Chambers, who lost his bid to compete for the UK in the Olympics, arguing that such a ban was being punished twice for same crime..

Ghost1 wrote:

lookism wrote:

Doping leaves lasting advantages, like more nuclei in the muscle bellies, allowing them to grow larger more easily.

You make a large generalization which does not encompass EPO which only has a short duration effect and does not last long. Kiprop was suspected of EPO.

I'm sure he only used a few PEDs, no more than what they found, not the whole arsenal.