Your Top Three 10000m runners All-Time, Lady easily runs 4:28.67 last 1600m of a 10000m

Check out the video, seriously Wang Junxia could have run sub 4:20 for her last 1600m if she really wanted at the 1993 World 10000m final:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S0IytBXo6HE

I don't know what the Chinese women was doing during that time period. I just looked at the video and she strided her last 800m in 2:08.07 of a very fast 10000m and wasn't even winded- incredible.

Do you think 1993 Wang Junixa could beat a healthy Tirunesh Dibaba (who is undefeated) at 10000m?

They were taking unbelievable drugs, I don't know many people who think they were clean. Didn't they have like 3 or the top 5 or 5 of the top 7 1500 times ever in one race? It was insane.

AlarmsAlarms wrote:

I don't know what the Chinese women was doing during that time period. I just looked at the video and she strided her last 800m in 2:08.07 of a very fast 10000m and wasn't even winded- incredible.

Do you think 1993 Wang Junixa could beat a healthy Tirunesh Dibaba (who is undefeated) at 10000m?

I was formerly of the opinion that the 29:31 was short-track aided, but now after watching that video I am not nearly as sure!

2:43 final Kilometer... absolutely incredible with an unpressed 61.0 final lap.

asdfasd...

I also previously thought the 29:31.78 may have been do to incorrect lap count or something of that nature; however, after seeing how easily she soloed 4:28 (1600m). I'm now sure she ran the full 10000m of her 10000m WR. What is in doubt is the EXACT type of aid she used at the time?

If Tadese, Tirunesh, & Kenenisa got a hold of the Wang Junxia secret the WR 3000m - marathon would be destroyed.

AlarmsAlarms

I think that (1993 top form) Wang Junxia would have beaten a healthy Tirunesh Dibaba everytime they raced at 10000m; however, after 1994 when Wang left Ma's Army she lost a step but was still incredible. I think Tirunesh then would have beaten Wang every year except in 1993.

Wang Junxia pb's

1500m- 3:51.92

seem to be near her limit

3000m- 8:06.11

don't know as accurate spilts or video never surfaced

5000m- 14:51.87

think she was stronger in this event than the 3000m and was capable of 14:09 if she had ever targeted sub 14:10

10000m-29:31.78

her strongest event and I'm sure the lady could have run 29:16-29:19 if she was paced evenly in 1993

marathon- 2:24:07

her weakest event, there are some 5000m/10000m runners who never equal their track performances when moving up to the marathon

All those Chinese women's former world records should be struck from the books, but we can't when there is no proof. In this Junior Women's 1500m race in 1997 in Shanghai, 4th place was 3:54.52

800 m (former WR) 1:57.18 Wang Yuan (CHN) 8 Sep 1993 Beijing

1500 m

3:51.34 Yinglai Lang

CHN Shanghai 18/10/1997

3:53.91 Lili Yin

CHN Shanghai 18/10/1997

3:53.97 Lixin Lan

CHN Shanghai 18/10/1997

3:54.52 Ling Zhang

CHN Shanghai 18/10/1997

5000 m 14:39.96 Lili Yin CHN Shanghai 23/10/1997

10000 m former WR) 30:31.55 Xing Huina (CHN) 23 Aug 2003 Saint-Denis (SF)

Ummm I would say Geb and Bekele are at least only equal. Bekele's times are only 2 and 5 seconds faster. Geb had to fight back and reclaim his WR's in the 5k and 10k 2 more times.

They had the same olympic golds, but for outdoor WC's Bekele has the leg up with 5 vs 4. However, Geb has 2 silvers and a bronze and Bekele has only the bronze. 2 silvers are at least equal to a gold in my book.

So for just like the 10k, theyre about equal.

For indoors WC's, sure theyre shorter, but still if youre only 2 and 5 seconds off in those 2 events then Gebs 4 golds vs Bekele's 1 gold mean something.

In other words, they weren't against each other in the world record setting races, just in 13ish and 27ish races and the times Bekele won were mainly only in the kick. The 2 and 5 seconds could easily have been switched up and mayeb the WR lowered even more.

In deciding who was #1 I looked at how dominant Kenenisa and Geb has been in the 10000m.

Geb primary opposition was Paul Tergat and Tergat came close to beating Geb a couple times in major championships. Then add that Haile actually lost the 2001 World Championships to Charles Kamathia (Ken) and there was no way he could be ranked added of Bekele in my opinion. Bekele is undefeated and against great opposition, Tadese, Sileshi, and Gebrmarium. Those three would have destroyed the field if not for Kenenisa and he in turn never allowed them a chance to even smell victory (that how dominate he is in the 10000m) compared to Haile who actually lost TWO 10000m during his prime.

Those loses is what tied Haile with (incredible but suspect) Wang Junxia for #2.

Tirunesh Dibaba does get an honorable mention and should move up once she grabs another Gold or if/when she can take down the 10000mWR.

..............

Seriously does anyone who saw (link in earlier post) the 1993 women's 10000m doubt that Wang Junxia could have probably broken sub 4:20 for her last 1600m if she had been pushed?

Seriously, yes.

VIPAM wrote:

Seriously does anyone who saw (link in earlier post) the 1993 women's 10000m doubt that Wang Junxia could have probably broken sub 4:20 for her last 1600m if she had been pushed?

I have to agree it was a great race but it has an asterik beside it in my book. The field she destroyed in the 1993 women's 10000m final was a Whose Who Among Women Distance Running

Lynn Jennings

Alberta Dias

Elana Meyer

Uta Pipig

Tegla Loroupe

Sally Bariosio

Zhong Huandi

surely a few more I missed

WhoseWho wrote:

The field she destroyed in the 1993 women's 10000m final was a Whose Who Among Women Distance Running

It was a WHAT????

Just whose who are you talking about?

You mean Who's Who ... as in Who is Who in distance running.

Bekele never had a Tergat to contend with. Hard to not pick him though.

The idea that you consider Wang Junxia the second-best 10,000 runner the world has ever seen makes anything else you write irrelevant.

How can you even consider yourself qualified to make that statement? or to even be a fan?

By any standard you use: sequence of marks, honors won, World-ranking points, gold medals in Championships, she takes a backseat to so many people.

It depends on the way you judge this, but either your "knowledge" is extremely recent, or you are just stupid.

These may not be in the top-3 all-time, but they would rank ahead of Junxia:

(in no particular order)

Ron Clarke

Alberto Cova

Miruts Yifter

Lasse Viren

Pyotr Bolotnikov

Emil Zátopek

Vladimir Kuts

Paul Tergat

If its fast times at the top of the annual lists that impress you, add these guys ....

Fernando Mamede

Carlos Lopes

Get a clue before you post something like you are the definitive word.

she did destroy the world record and her time has never been approached in 17 years. clarke's and zatopek's destruction of the wr came well before what anyone would consider the modern era of distance running.

jjjjjjjj wrote:

clarke's and zatopek's destruction of the wr came well before what anyone would consider the modern era of distance running.

See the subject line for this thread.

One thing that always cracks me up about people who believe that all top runners are not on drugs is whatever the Chinese women of 1993 were on that allowed them to be world record level at 1500-3000-5000 and 10,000 it allowed them to be about 60 seconds ahead of the other dopers in the 10,000 and set new World Records that doped-Eastern-Bloc runners had set in the 1500-3000.

Whatever they were on, the runners of today have available to them. My guess is that there was no doping control leading up to the event at all and it was skirted or non-existent after the races in China.

But yeah, realize that even though we have all kinds of dopers in women's running NOW and for the last 40 years, those Chinese crushed all of them. And whatever they were on that allowed them to crush EVERY distance WR, today's runners have available to them.

My hunch (because of the time frame) is that they were on every PED that had normally been used for the previous 25 years (every one that made sense) and then just used EPO to take their hematocrit up to 60% or 70%. Who knows, maybe Chinese have a unique ability to tolerate a really high hematocrit without dying? Their swimmers made huge unexplained improvements also. Their rowers have too. But that was more recent, when they realized that rowing was one more sport they could dope their way to world-class ability in time for Beijing.

CORRECTION:I should have clarified as I'm more interested in your top three 10000m runners of the modern era. I know Viren, Cova, Kristansen, Yifter etc were all incredible champions; however, who makes your list of all the 10000m runners from 1985 to present?........

You have to look at a few things when analyzing whether a performance is suspect. And no, not all distance runners are doped up. #1 Did this runner gradually improve? #2 Did they last a while at that performance level?#3 Does that country / coach have a record of performances at that level?All of a sudden, 4 Junior women ran under 3:55 in a race in Shanghai in 1997. No male distance runners of note in China.Quick Google search Update:"Liquing Song and Lili Yin are among three Chinese athletes who have been banned for two years by the International Amateur Athletic Federation after testing positive for the banned body-building drug testosterone more than a year ago. Yunfeng Lui, a male race walker, has also been suspended.Suspicion has surrounded Ma's runners since 1993 when his team of unknown peasant women took all three medals in the 3,000 metres as well as gold and silver in the 10,000m at the world championships in Stuttgart. But Liquing and Lili are the first athletes he coaches to be banned by the IAAF.Liquing finished third in the 10,000m at China's Olympic trials last year but was subsequently dropped, along with five other Ma athletes, from the team for Sydney after a blood test taken by the authorities in Beijing indicated she may have been taking the banned blood-boosting drug erythropoietin. However she and the others were all allowed to continue to run competitively.It has now emerged that Liquing had also tested positive for testosterone on July 12 2000, along with Lili, during an out-of-competition test, but it has taken 12 months for the Chinese to inform the IAAF."