The sub 30:00 10k thread, which popped up in another thread recently, got me craving specifics from people who have gone sub 2:30.
How do you set up your training?
The sub 30:00 10k thread, which popped up in another thread recently, got me craving specifics from people who have gone sub 2:30.
How do you set up your training?
There's no magic formula here....decent workouts and volume:
M - easy 8-12 miles
T - AM easy 0-6 miles; PM track workout 8-10 miles total with 3-5 miles of intervals around 5K pace with short recoveries (ie 8X800 in 2:22-2:26 90sec recovery)
W - AM easy 0-6 miles; PM easy 8-12 miles
R - 12-14 miles with tempo fartleks or long tempo of 6-10 miles
F - AM, easy 0-6 miles; PM easy 10-12 miles
Sa - 10-12 miles with faster finish
Su - 16-22 miles usually with fast finish
Total - 80-105 miles
someone with a 40-hour/week job and social life post their 2:30 schedule
No such thing.
Da Real BQer wrote:
someone with a 40-hour/week job and social life post their 2:30 schedule
First off, 2:30 and sub 30 are in different universes. That being said, I am currently only allowed in the former, so I'll share my plan.
Like the previous poster said, there is no real magic in running 2:30. Anything that will make you a better distance runner at any distance from 5k up will help. However, the few specifics that have helped me transition from 5k/10k training in college to marathon training over the course of two years or so has been a lot more long runs, long AT's, and really easy doubles 3x/wk.
My favorite training device is my long run. I'd say 20 milers with a relatively long marathon pace segment (30-60 mins) in the latter stages have been my most worthwhile runs. Here's a quick outline of a week when I'm 3-6 weeks out, when I'm doing a lot of marathon specific training.
M - 9 easy w/ striders
T - am 5 easy, PM 13 w/ 20-50 min AT
W - 10 easy
H - am 4 easy, pm 14 easy
F - am 4 easy, lunch 9 w/ 30 min marathon pace segment
S - 12 easy
S - 20 w/ 30-50 min MP or AT segment
oh btw, I'm in graduate school, working 50-60 hrs/wk. not much of a social life, but i live with my gf, so that's gotta count for something!
if you're looking for the quick and easy social way to run fast, i think a prescription for EPO or a lot of talent might be a better route.
marathon training is a lot like having a girlfriend, except you only might get laid once or twice a year if you're lucky.
I work roughly 45-50 hours a week and have a girlfriend, all while running 120-140mpw. I have run under 2:30 and hope to run quite a bit faster going forward.
Do I go to happy hour after work? No.
Do I get hammered on an average Saturday night? No.
Do I get to watch primetime TV every night? No.
I do get ~8-9 hours of sleep a night, have fun and watch football with friends on the weekend. My girlfriend and I go out to eat, see movies, go to the beach, etc. I don't get what people do if they don't train hard.
bw, I thought you were still trying to run under 2:30?
"The message I got today was that the list is not finalized, and won't be until next week. I just ran a 1:10:49 on Saturday (and have a 2:34 marathon best) and I got the impression that I'm on the bubble."
Best times: 3 miles (indoor) 14:42, 10.000 track 32:22, 10 miles road - 51:20, 20 miles road 1:50.49, marathon - 2:30.47
This is from my best years in 1978-1981
Monday - 8 miles steady run, after work in 56 minutes
Tuesday - 8 miles, with some fartlek in the middle
Wednesday - 12 miles run home from work in about 1.30 minutes
Thursday - 8 miles steady in around 56 minutes
Friday - 5 miles steady
Saturday - short race or cross country (5 miles) and warmup and warmdown, total 10 miles
Sunday - 15 - 20 miles run, steady pace over country or roads.
Basically no speed work, except for races. The most important thing was consistency in training.
From 1978-1980 in England, with Hercules Wimbledon A.C. - home to Dave Clarke (13:222, 27:56, 2:13) and Bob Holt 97:59, 13:48, 28:39, 2:16) and then when running for Mansfield State College (PSAC Division 11) under coach Winrow.
But I always did my own kind of training, and just ran mileage and tempo.
Ghost in Saudi Arabia
You got me! Yes I suppose I haven't quite run under 2:30 yet...but my magic 8 ball says I will, and it's right like 95% of the time.Pay no attention to my previous post until next sunday around 12:10.
cmonnow wrote:
bw, I thought you were still trying to run under 2:30?
"The message I got today was that the list is not finalized, and won't be until next week. I just ran a 1:10:49 on Saturday (and have a 2:34 marathon best) and I got the impression that I'm on the bubble."
I never even came close to 30 minutes for 10K, however I ran a 2:23 Marathon when I was working 40+ hours per week.
Here is a typical week of training:
Sunday: 20-23 miles on bike path, starting out at 7 minute pace and working the pace down to 5:40-5:45 over the last 6-7 miles.
Monday: easy 8-10 miles on golf course.
Tuesday: Three mile warmup, 5 X 1000m in 3:15, 200m recovery, Four mile cooldown.
Wednesday: 90 minutes on trails easy, usually 12-13 miles.
Thursday: Three mile warmup, 4-5 X Mile in 5:10, 400m recovery, Four mile cooldown.
Friday: 10 miles easy on trails.
Saturday: 10-12 miles on trails, with 10 X 1 minute hard/easy in the middle of the workout.
Famous last words. Hope you get it but sub 2:30, especially on a course like New York's, is far easier said than done.
So you're not "Sub 2:30".
ghost wrote:
Best times: 3 miles (indoor) 14:42, 10.000 track 32:22, 10 miles road - 51:20, 20 miles road 1:50.49, marathon - 2:30.47
This is from my best years in 1978-1981
Monday - 8 miles steady run, after work in 56 minutes
Tuesday - 8 miles, with some fartlek in the middle
Wednesday - 12 miles run home from work in about 1.30 minutes
Thursday - 8 miles steady in around 56 minutes
Friday - 5 miles steady
Saturday - short race or cross country (5 miles) and warmup and warmdown, total 10 miles
Sunday - 15 - 20 miles run, steady pace over country or roads.
Basically no speed work, except for races. The most important thing was consistency in training.
From 1978-1980 in England, with Hercules Wimbledon A.C. - home to Dave Clarke (13:222, 27:56, 2:13) and Bob Holt 97:59, 13:48, 28:39, 2:16) and then when running for Mansfield State College (PSAC Division 11) under coach Winrow.
But I always did my own kind of training, and just ran mileage and tempo.
Ghost in Saudi Arabia
Once Upon A time wrote:
No such thing.
Da Real BQer wrote:someone with a 40-hour/week job and social life post their 2:30 schedule
Sure there is...
http://timothybudic.blogspot.com/I read this guys blog from time to time. He travels, has a kid, a wife, and a social life!
ghost wrote:
Best times: 3 miles (indoor) 14:42, 10.000 track 32:22, 10 miles road - 51:20, 20 miles road 1:50.49, marathon - 2:30.47
This is from my best years in 1978-1981
Monday - 8 miles steady run, after work in 56 minutes
Tuesday - 8 miles, with some fartlek in the middle
Wednesday - 12 miles run home from work in about 1.30 minutes
Thursday - 8 miles steady in around 56 minutes
Friday - 5 miles steady
Saturday - short race or cross country (5 miles) and warmup and warmdown, total 10 miles
Sunday - 15 - 20 miles run, steady pace over country or roads.
Basically no speed work, except for races. The most important thing was consistency in training.
From 1978-1980 in England, with Hercules Wimbledon A.C. - home to Dave Clarke (13:222, 27:56, 2:13) and Bob Holt 97:59, 13:48, 28:39, 2:16) and then when running for Mansfield State College (PSAC Division 11) under coach Winrow.
But I always did my own kind of training, and just ran mileage and tempo.
Ghost in Saudi Arabia
That is a great post! What kind of mileage did you reach? How old were you when you ran those times?
All my best times, including 15:17 for 5000 outdoors on a cinder track in 1978 (Wimbledon) were done on just straight runs without ever stepping on a track for 'speedwork.' I loved my running too much, to do speedwork. Yes, it might have helped me, but I chose to enjoy the experience.
Most of my mileage during my best years was around the 50-60 miles per week range. My top mileage ever was 80 miles per week, during my first year at Mansfield State, but improvement was only small on that increase.
I was between the ages of 22 when I ran my best time for 20 miles road (Finchley '20' England/1978) and 24 years old when running at Mansfield State in 1980-81 as an atypical 'older' freshman. I ran 14:42 indoors for 3 miles, a Mansfield State record, at the Bucknell indoor invitation, February 1981. During that winter in North Central Pennslyvania, Mansfield had been receiving tons of snowfalls, and I was doing most of my runs on snow covered country roads. But I was racing every week indoors, and that was the only 'speedwork' I was doing. The week before Bucknell, I had run 8:57 for 3000 indoors at the Rochester indoor invitational.
I was always very slow, and only had best times of 2:10/80 and 4:19 for 1500. But I think if I had persisted with the marathon, based on my other distance times - I would have reached between 2:22 - 2:25 for the classic distance. My 1:50.49 for the Finchley '20' in 1978 felt good, and I never suffered in that race. A few weeks before that Finchley race, I had run my debut race for 20 miles in the Stafford '20' in Stafford, recording a time of 1:57. I knew I could do better than that.
Ghost in Saudi
If anyone wishes to apply to this University, send an e-mail. M.A. in Linguistics or related field preferred.
bw and cmonnow, I'm impressed you have a somewhat "normal" life! Good job on keeping up the mileage as well as the career, and keeping the lady warm. You'll break 2:30 at NYC, bw. Hell, I was thinking of going to spectate, maybe I'll hold up a sign that says "BW IS DA REAL SHIT" or something similarly distinguishable.
Alacrity wrote:
The sub 30:00 10k thread, which popped up in another thread recently, got me craving specifics from people who have gone sub 2:30.
How do you set up your training?
I do all my runs naked. I swear it works.
These are some key workouts I've done: (2:20 goal time target)...adjust times to fit 2:30 pace.
The Long Run:
20-22 miles, start off at about 6:30 pace...run the last 10 miles in sub 58 min(or as fast as possible).
OR 23 miles steady...like 6:30-6:00 pace all the way.
OR 18 miles, first 10 miles at about 6:30 pace...last 8 miles at 5:20 pace or faster.(practice drinking your race fluid on some of these
I think real long runs should be done every 10-12 days ideally.
The Threshold:
10 by 1000m at 3:05 with a 1 min rest jog between reps.
OR 2 by 8k at 25:45 each with a 5 min rest between reps.
OR 6-8 mile Tempo Run at 5:20 to 5:05 per mile pace.
OR 3-4 by 3200m at 10:30-10:00 with a 2-3 min rest between reps.
Aerobic Capacity / Vo2max: (only need a couple of these, about 2-4 weeks out from race day)
5-6 by 1 mile at 4:55 to 4:45 with a 2-3 min rest between reps.
OR 10 by 800m at 2:20 to 2:16 with a 2 min rest between reps.
Economy and Raw "Speed" (don't need much of this, just use as a transition to faster tempo workouts early on)
16 to 20 by 400m at 70 to 67 each with a 1:30 rest between reps.
16 by 6 to 8 second all-out (can be up steep hills) with a full-recovery rest between reps. (after doing strides for several weeks). These are Canova style hills to build leg strength and trigger all muscle fibres.
The long run is most important. High weekly mileage for a period of years is important...probably go about as high as you can (ie 100mpw +) or whatever you have time for.
M - Beer/donuts, jog a mile
T - Same
W - Same
Th - Same
F - Same
S - Same
Sun - Get on letsrun and tell people I ran 1145 minutes this week.