2 tempos a week in base?

This is a great way to do it. I have been doing the same thing. I've been surprised at how often I feel good enough to make easy runs a progression run, and it keeps you from burning out because you only do it when you feel strong and it's only for a portion of the run.

halpthisboii,

Are you in HS or college?

If HS, maybe critical velocity intervals one a week and VO2max intervals (varying interval time and recovery time from week to week can accomplish this without hammering long intervals every week) once a week, and skip the tempos.

If college and you run the 10k, alternate 2 workouts a week from among tempo, critical velocity, and VO2max workouts.

This recent article explains why it's beneficial to alternate intensity and distance training.

Adaptations of skeletal muscle mitochondria to exercise training

Exp Physiol 101.1 (2016) pp 17–22

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1113/EP085319/abstract

mad scientist wrote:

halpthisboii,

Are you in HS or college?

If HS, maybe critical velocity intervals one a week and VO2max intervals (varying interval time and recovery time from week to week can accomplish this without hammering long intervals every week) once a week, and skip the tempos.

If college and you run the 10k, alternate 2 workouts a week from among tempo, critical velocity, and VO2max workouts.

This recent article explains why it's beneficial to alternate intensity and distance training.

Adaptations of skeletal muscle mitochondria to exercise training

Exp Physiol 101.1 (2016) pp 17–22

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1113/EP085319/abstract

Just read the whole article. In summary: Traditional endurance training (not defined by the author but perhaps LSD type training) increases VO2 by increasing O2 transport and total volume of mitochondria, while High Intensity Training (Defined as 1 minute bouts at VO2 max) produced gains by way of increasing mitochondrial ability to utilize O2.

While interesting, the article doesn't, by itself make a strong case for mixing multiple types of training during base. For instance, what if an athlete were to first maximize O2 transport and mitochondrial volume through pure endurance training THEN embark on a period of higher intensity training? The article linked above does not answer that question.

I would think 2 tempos a week would be a great plan. just dont over run them. Here is a great case study showing how an elite female runner went from 9:23 for 3000m to 8:37 for 3000m with a decreasing VO2 Max. instead, their lactate threshold improved dramatically.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1756052/pdf/v032p00039.pdf

Getting ready for track you'd be better off having hills replace one of those tempos. Run medium pace for 3 or 4 miles before and/or after if you're worried about not getting enough aerobic work in.

The hills will better prep you for the faster track work necessary later on.

Assuming you ignore this advice, at least do one of the tempos over a hilly course.

CWRP wrote:

Early season base training in college we would do one longer formal tempo run of 6-12 miles.

I guess we kids did others informally. Usually the last 3 miles always cut down pretty quick of our 7-10 milers. Usually sub 6, 5:30-45 and low 5 to 5 flat on the last one. It was a flat run from school and you could really move.

But why not do something like that. Why do 2 tempos a week? What's the point?

Well by doing one long run a week and two tempos you get optimal aerobic development for base training. If you just do easy mileage then you will only aerobically develop your slow twitch muscles and completly ignore your intermediate twitch muscles aerobic development. Also by doing two tempos you are able to increase your lactate threshold and your stamina. Easy long mileage increases endurance, the ability to run for extended amounts of time, but will not optimally develop stamina, the ability to run at a high percentage of your vo2max for extended amounts of time. So by doing easy mileage and 1 long run you will optimally develop your endurance by doing the two tempos a week you will optimally develop your stamina. The steady state progression run is a good way of going harder longer as it is your aerobic threshold or the pace in which your breathing starts getting a lot harder because your intermediate muscles are starting to get recruited finally and the maximum amount of slow twitch muscles are being recruited. The LT run is the optimal way of increasing your lactate threshold which is a key physiological factor in increasing stamina and is a very good way to aerobically develop intermediate muscle fibers. The tempo intervals are probably the best type of workout to develop your intermediate twitch muscles aerobically and also increases vo2max and lactate threshold. So more basically more stamina.

Now for the type of workouts you are doing.

Those fast finish runs you described. These will certainly work! But they are not optimal.

One of the key things you will here from successful coaches and athletes saying is make your hard days hard and your easy days easy.

I'm not sure if all your runs are fast finish or not. If they are then you are probably not getting enough rest and performing as well as you could during workouts because you are not related enough and you are risking injury. Also the uptempo section of your run is not optimally developing your aerobic system because you are getting a limited amount of stimuli. So if I would increase the amount of time you spend at steady state and if you want to finish with a fast mile like you did I would finish at at your LT pace.

Just my thoughts again yours would work but it is not optimal

halpthisboii wrote:

The issue would be if I ran them too fast right? So if I make sure they are all on pace, it shouldn't be bad?

To a large extent yeah it is all about running too fast. Personally I would go

a) 20-40 min temp at HM-MP pace.

b) 3-4x1.5 miles at 10k pace

Throw in a couple of 400ms at then end of one of the workouts at ~1500m pace and you are have a decent base for starting track in a couple of months.

The issue is that it is way to easy to run fast (I ran 5:30 for 4 miles last week, why not try for 5:25 this week) and burn yourself out. You counter act that by upping volume rather than pace. Going from 20mins to 40 mins of work over 3-4 weeks helps prevent that.

here's the best advice i can offer - 2 tempos a week is fine, but don't be a slave to the schedule. and err on the side of slower pace than fast

If you only do 1 some week, it's COMPLETELY FINE. If you feel sh*tty, skip the tempo. You should be feeling bouncy and good in base phase, not trying to hit your weekly wrkt quota

my best races have been using this format (i'm surprised it has gotten me to sub 1:13 HM, but it indicates i probably run too hard on easy days) about 45-55 mpw:

mon - easy

tuesday - moderate, 7-10 mi, strides

Wed - 6-8 mi steady state / progression run or 4-5 mi tempo

Thur - easy (like 8:00-30 min/mi+)

Fri - Off or easy, strides

Sat - easy long (12-15)

Sun - easy

mon - easy

Tues -V02 max (6 x 2:00 @ 5k, 1:00 jog rest) or 3 x mile @ 5k

Wednes - easy

Thurs - 10-13 on trails, easy

Fri - Off or easy

Sat - easy

Sun - long, finish last 2-4 miles at HMP-MP

i've also had really good success with only one hard effort per week. It was with some guys and we'd do a 10 miler. Mile 1 was 6:30-7, 2-4 were 6:30, 5-7 were 6:00 and last 3 trying to go around 5:30. obviously, we didn't start hitting 5:30's, but when we could do that controlled, we were fit

Oheo wrote:

Getting ready for track you'd be better off having hills replace one of those tempos. Run medium pace for 3 or 4 miles before and/or after if you're worried about not getting enough aerobic work in.

The hills will better prep you for the faster track work necessary later on.

Assuming you ignore this advice, at least do one of the tempos over a hilly course.

Hey- thanks for all the advice.

Here are my take aways from this:

Weekly schedule

M- Easy, strides

T- Tempo (3-5 miles steady)

W- Easy, strides

Th- Easy, strides

F- Hills (3 mile warm up and cool down and 10-12 x 200 hard uphills)

S- Super easy, recover

Sun- Progression long run (10-12 miles) Starting at an easy pace and dropping 40 seconds every 3-4 miles to get to tempo pace

That way I can develop speed (hills), improve lactic threshold (tempo and progression run)

Maybe every few weeks ill do 6-8 x 400s on hills instead of 200s

I would make the volume of the tempo 8 miles with 3-5 miles steady. Yeah that sounds pretty good! If you want to include hill repeats I would build up to 400m uphill and keep it there. But that seems pretty solid. The best training plan is a simple one