BigMango,
I and probably most other folks who have run marathons would like to "fall apart" as badly as you did! To run 2:46, place 5th overall, but not win the 50+ age group seems like really bad luck. Congrats on an excellent effort!
BigMango,
I and probably most other folks who have run marathons would like to "fall apart" as badly as you did! To run 2:46, place 5th overall, but not win the 50+ age group seems like really bad luck. Congrats on an excellent effort!
BigMango wrote:Went out at 2:42 pace and fell apart the last 12k. Finished 2:46:40 chip time.
Still an incredible run. Congrats. I love the impromptu context -- much to be said for just enjoying being fit enough to make last-minute racing decisions.
Amk - Happy solstice to you too, I like this salutation. As a right brain/left handed artistic type, it appeals. Sorry to hear the dystonia is acting up, but happily your motivation keeps you rolling through the week in any case.
8k, I like the report on the New Balance shoe, and I may budget for a pair of them. I've always liked NB shoes, and my Next % probably have one more marathon in them before they are done (Honestly, at $250+, the shoe holds up for about a dollar per mile, no more.)
Big Mango -- congratulations! Sometimes a great run includes hitting the wall a bit. My 880 yard PR from 1976 is 1:58.0, but the last 220 was 32.1-- aka "running backwards."
Interestingly, I always felt half way in the marathon was 19 miles. The fatigue is compounding. First third of the race comfortably hard miles.
“There is a reason we use a pole and basket at our home.”
We had 30 foot fifty year old avocado tree in our backyard while growing up. The fruit was at the very top of the tree. We used a long pole with blade and coffee tin to catch the fruit. I paid $13.96 for four avocados today.
Ghost of Igloi wrote:
Interestingly, I always felt half way in the marathon was 19 miles. The fatigue is compounding. First third of the race comfortably hard miles.
Agreed Mr. Igy...entirely.
Getting out easy is key.
In my own personal experience, I managed 2:26 (5:35 average pace) off of a crazy slow 6:30 first mile, yet just 2:25 (5:33 pace) off of a brisk 5:15 opener.
Do you recall how fast you went out when running sub 2:20 to qualify for the Olympic Trials 26.2 miler???
Mike F,
I was typically out at 5:10-5:15, hitting 10 miles in ~52:00 and 20 miles at ~ 1:45. So about 5:25-5:30 those last miles. That is my recollection anyhow. probably not unlike Big Mango’s differential. At the 1976 Trials I went out sub 5:00 ~24:50 at 5 miles, already slowing down at ~50:50 10 miles, rigor mortis at 20 miles, crawling in to finish ~2:28. Not pretty. Stupid really, nothing I had trained for.
igy
MikevF,
I was generally a poor record keeper. The only splits I have is for the 1973 Western Hemisphere Marathon (aka Culver City) 2;20;06. Very windy. Problem my best effort against some good Americans, and 2nd to a Finn. Splits listed as 26:00 5 mile, 51:13 10 mile, 1:17:50 15 mile, 1:42:00 20 mile, 2:13:54 25 mile, 2:20:06 26.2 mile. At the time I knew the 20 mile split was not correct, like 1:45-ish.
Igy
^apologies for poor editing above, typing on my phone after taking photo
Big Mango, awesome effort!
You moved my belief in what is possible and what not.
BR
Holiday greetings from the M63, all--and especially to you young whippersnapperish 50-somethings. I join you once again to bring tales of my unforseeable, seemingly impossible return to running after throwing in the towel back in February, disgusted and depressed after what felt like a final fragmenting of my L5 after some ill-advised evening stretches. I've been a cyclist all year. More than once I've mourned, sincerely with realistically, the fact that I would never run again. And then.....
After an exploratory, abortive one-mile toddle on 6/19 (11:20 pace) that left my IT band sore for three days, another one-mile jog in early August (11:56 pace), and then a final test totter on 10/13 (2 miles @ 13:08) and 10/19 (1.5 @ 11:42), the last two while my bike was in the shop, I commenced to drag myself out of the slough of despond.
For the next three weeks I ran and cycled:
9 jog / 40 bike
15 jog / 42 bike
13 jog / 48 bike
What made this resurrection possible was the simple addition of tossing a 6-lb medicine ball back and forth from hand to hand for about 3 minutes in the AM and 3 minutes in the PM. That's all. That tiny adjustment to my daily routine. It seems to have activated my long strappy back muscles and given my various back ailments some precisely targeted help.
On 11/15, I kicked my bike to the curb. I haven't ridden it since. I've had five weeks of trouble-free running, My back has been fine, basically. Mileage over the past five weeks: 27, 30, 32, 24 (cutback week), and, this past week, 34.
This past week:
3.4 w/3 x 80 second steep hills
2.5 v. slow (11:54)
6 @ 10:13 (last 2 @ 9:33, 9:25 w/HR @ 85%)
3 v. slow (11:47)
7 @ 10:08 (last 3 @ 9:43, 9:41, 9:44)
3 v. slo (11:39)
9 (10:08) (last 3 @9:35, 9:27, 9:08)
Yesterday's nine-miler was my longest run since 8/9/20. It was a gift from on high. The back was fine, nothing else hurt, and those last three miles were--well, what qualifies as "rolling" right now. I'm a Garmin nerd and have been tracking my HR for 15+ years, so: mile 7 was at that 85% notch of about 157/158, a percentage I've always thought of as marathon pace; mile 8 was slowly rising into the high 80%, towards half marathon pace; and that final mile was at a HR of 169-170, which is 90/91%....something like 10K pace.
This bag of brittle bones can't believe I just pulled off 9-mile fast finish run after the year I've just been through, but there IS a Santa Claus, Virginia, and he came early this year. More surprising, I've woken this next morning and I don't feel the slightest bit torn up.
Of course the paces aren't fast enough relative to HR, but I've only been back in the saddle for five weeks, with one nothingburger of a hill workout.
I'll stop by from time to time with an update. I AM planning to race again, by G-d. (last race was April of 2019). Unless, of course, everything comes crashing down again. But I'm immensely grateful for this one last one last one last one last one last one last one last.....
Mike Lundgren wrote:
Congrats to all that are still upright and moving! :)
Have not had much to post of late, still walk/runs that total 40 to 45 miles weekly, weight is now around 145, hope to keep it there with the holidays coming. My wife and I are back from a week in AZ, so facing winter again.
Exciting news for me is that yesterday I was able to run non-stop for a 5 km in 28:47 and it wound up winning the 70+ age group. Course might be a couple hundreths short, but I can take the victory, as rare as they are when this pace. Last mile was the fastest, too, (9:46 first vs. 8:46 last). Hip was not so sore, but not much warm-up, now need to build up the aerobic base with more and longer runs. OK, not much more here except our stores are converting to Fleet Feet ownership next week, something new to experience and learn!
That's an inspiration to this youngster, Mike. 8:46 is a pace I haven't yet touched this time around, but I'll think of you when I do.
Yesterday, btw, I called out to the ghost of Caballo Blanco as I was rolling homeward, around seven miles, and got very emotional. "Take a ride with me, Caballo," I murmured. It was a voudou moment: calling the spirit and letting it/him ride. The heart opens. Very empowering. I plan to do more of that in the future, when the spirit is on me. Micah True, the OG wildman, lives on....
Take the wins where you find them.
congratulations! Incredible race, and more so after such a short build-up. The icing on the cake is the quick bounce-back from what sounds like a very painful fall. I'd likely have cancelled out of the next 6 months of life if I fell out of a tree. You earned infinite toughness points -- enjoy the recovery
--Dave
Nice marathon Big Mango. 2:46 at 50+ is really good!
Orient, you mentioned the depth of the 60+ race last weekend. It had to have been one of the deepest fields we've seen for XC or road. You see the cluster of runners from 4th to 15th or so, because they all went out with the leaders. Our team hung back ( 15th-20th over the first km) and moved up through the field. We put on 25-30 seconds on everyone (except King who was way out front) over the final 2K.
Recovery week, just 20 miles (4 days) some light cycling (1 hour total) and finally enough snow to XC ski (90 minutes).
Nice Race Big Mango! Marathon age graded scores are usually lower for most. Heck my AGP for the marathon is ZERO! I would contemplate finishing a 50 miler but no way in hell racing a marathon.
A 2:46 marathon at ANY age is a good time...but at 50+? Very impressive Mr. Mango...well done.
Kudzu, nice to hear that you're back in action...I may have to follow your sage insight re: medicine ball for the back...thanks for the tip.
your pal,
MF
BigMango, congratulations on your outstanding effort and awesome result!
Losing a few minutes vs. your plan during the last 10K or so seems not an issue to worry about. Great accomplishment of the year, bravo!
I too am planning on Jan 1 being a return to structured training. I like to start things on memorable days.
Been camping the last few days and away from Letsrun. Thanks for all the congrats and it was a wonderful experience. Even hitting the wall was not a big deal. It wasn’t painful and only resulted in a slower pace. With not running fast (MP and under) for a year other than 3 mile and under ints I was lucky to run the time. Expected I would not come close to my goal time. It confirmed my belief that you don’t need to hammer intervals and fast distance runs to be just below the elite AG runners. My training I hope gets me to 70+ healthy and have some ideas how to even approve upon it. I love running and sadly few of my fellow runners here are even a shadow of the runners they were ten years ago. Maybe a 5 year training cycle with measurable stats along the way is more pleasurable than redlining and ultimately hitting many valleys.
Amkelley - thanks and yes I am grateful. My falling apart was expected and it should have been worse. I was lucky!
Allen1959 - 55 AG next week and agree there is something soothing to always being fit. So much easier to ramp up but in the past I have extended the ramp up for 6-12 months and that will always end badly. Performance is addictive and hard to let go IMO.
Ghost of Igloi - My first marathon was in 2017 and this is my fourth. I need to take fueling more seriously. Think liquids weren’t an issue other than sodium which I forgot but 3 bags of oreos ( 9 cookies ) wasn’t sufficient. Hard to digest and spit out 40%.
Newbi - Thanks and I think there was a good amount of good fortune in the result.
Dhaaga- Thanks andI do feel lucky. I started the buildup very fit - just not running fit.
Coyote Montane- Hoping to run your times at 60+ or at minimum still running without pain.
Charlie- Thanks and I find the shorter distances harder. Not as many variables as a marathon but more painful. Doing a 50 miler would even be easier IMO. As the miles go up, your noggin becomes much more important over tallent.
MikeF. - Thanks and it pales in comparison to your comeback from foot reconstruction.
Orient - Thanks and yes not a major concern considering it was expected. Not in my delusional states but in reality my actual time was better than expected.