National championships aren't international events. He couldn't win the national championships in the event for which he was Olympic champion. That has been consistent with his losing record in the 1500 since Paris last year. Then he gets DQed because he doesn't know the basics of the rules. Fortunately for Hocker lightning strikes once a year - or no one would know who he is.
You're unaware that free speech, which this place stands for, is not a popularity contest. You need to join a cult.
I mean you’re free to say whatever ya like but if it’s completely braindead then people’s responses are gonna reflect that.
Also, an athlete not being universally dominant every time he sets foot on the track just means his event is super competitive. That is objectively a good thing — makes the sport more interesting for viewers, less predictable, etc. If you’re actually a track fan, you should want competitive races.
Being "universally dominant" isn't anywhere in the picture. The guy loses most times he steps on the track at international level. He couldn't even win his national championships in his main event.
If it wasn't for the Olympics and now the WC no one would know who he is. If his record throughout the season was being compared with Ingebrigtsen you would be saying the Norwegian is finished. He's another Ramzi or Katir.
National championships aren't international events. He couldn't win the national championships in the event for which he was Olympic champion. That has been consistent with his losing record in the 1500 since Paris last year. Then he gets DQed because he doesn't know the basics of the rules. Fortunately for Hocker lightning strikes once a year - or no one would know who he is.
Cope, baby, cope. Someday you might even threaten Harambe about Djokovic as the GOAT coper.
He couldn't win the national championships in his main event, the 1500. The race didn't include international competition. He won the national 5k in a pedestrian 13:26. No athlete in an international race couldn't better that time.
Take away two races in his career and he's a journeyman, a nobody.
I don't think I've ever seen people going on this much about peaking and how the only race that matters is a race that's ran less than once a year outside of American runners. Being the best means being able to perform more than once a year. The best runners are the runners who can both run fast times on the circuit and win global medals.
All this talk about how Hocker is the best peaker ever and the best American distance runner and it's referring to a guy who's not even had a better season than Jimmy Gressier.
On this we agree.
Hilarious how many downvotes I'm getting for pointing out that the best runners win both the major and minor races, not just one of the two.
It must be a purely American perspective, because I've never seen any other group of people take offense at such a basic statement.
Take away two races in his career and he's a journeyman, a nobody.
LOL. Why "take away" those 2 wins? It's not like they were wins in some obscure race in some backwater of the world. You know what they call a guy who wins those 2 races? Olympic champion and world champion. His name is forever etched in history...and he may have more global wins in his future.
Hilarious how many downvotes I'm getting for pointing out that the best runners win both the major and minor races, not just one of the two.
It must be a purely American perspective, because I've never seen any other group of people take offense at such a basic statement.
I like Hocker, and although I agree with your general narrative here, I think you are a little harsh:
1. After his OG win he stayed in/ went back to Europe, and competed against Jakob et co, despite being somewhat uncharged after his tremendous win.
2. He has never claimed that he is the best in the world, as far as I know.
3. He is clearly working on his general fitness, in stead of only being a one time hitter.
I don't have any problems with Hocker, two global golds in two different events at his age is a huge achievement.
I have a problem with his crazy American fans who overrate him and talk about how nothing but the Olympics and Worlds matter, races that are ran less than once a year.
I don't have any problems with Hocker, two global golds in two different events at his age is a huge achievement.
I have a problem with his crazy American fans who overrate him and talk about how nothing but the Olympics and Worlds matter, races that are ran less than once a year.
As I said I agree with your overall narrative. But how do you think you would have reacted if Almgren had won an event he never had done anything good in on the global stage!? F.x the steeple -I think you to would be pretty high and up there too..?
I don't have any problems with Hocker, two global golds in two different events at his age is a huge achievement.
I have a problem with his crazy American fans who overrate him and talk about how nothing but the Olympics and Worlds matter, races that are ran less than once a year.
As I said I agree with your overall narrative. But how do you think you would have reacted if Almgren had won an event he never had done anything good in on the global stage!? F.x the steeple -I think you to would be pretty high and up there too..?
Trust me, I'm more stoked about Almgrens bronze than most American are about Hockers gold, since Sweden doesn't have any runners who can medal on a global stage at any distance other than Almgren.
It's the constant comments about how only the Olympics and Worlds matter that irks me the most. I expect those kinds of comments from people who don't consider themselves fans of the sport at all, not people who are engaged enough with the sport to comment about it on a website like this.
This is an American board discussing American runners. Objectivity goes out the window.
You're also correct. We expect the best runners to win more than once a year.
His indoor 3000m, and the way he did it, and his time (second best ever, in a time worth more than Kerr’s 2 mile wr) is as good as almost every win.
It was indoors, in a non championship distance, and he finished behind a runner who was lackluster in these world championships. It may have looked like a positive blip on his screen but it was still just another loss, which he has specialised in for all but virtually one race a year in the last two years.
What would you say if this was Ingebrigtsen's competitive record over a year (barring injury)? That he was probably finished?
Great md runners in the past - Ovett, Coe, Cram, Morceli, El G, Bekele, Farah etc - dominated at their peak. They didn't just turn out one winning performance in a year. He simply looks like another Ramzi or Katir.
Take away two races in his career and he's a journeyman, a nobody.
LOL. Why "take away" those 2 wins? It's not like they were wins in some obscure race in some backwater of the world. You know what they call a guy who wins those 2 races? Olympic champion and world champion. His name is forever etched in history...and he may have more global wins in his future.
I don't presume to take those wins off him or discount them. I am pointing out the clear incongruity that without those two races his competitive record over the full year each year is that of a relative mediocrity, a journeyman, that no one would have heard of if it wasn't for just two races in two years. That isn't what we have seen with the great md runners of the past.
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It was indoors, in a non championship distance, and he finished behind a runner who was lackluster in these world championships. It may have looked like a positive blip on his screen but it was still just another loss, which he has specialised in for all but virtually one race a year in the last two years.
What would you say if this was Ingebrigtsen's competitive record over a year (barring injury)? That he was probably finished?
Great md runners in the past - Ovett, Coe, Cram, Morceli, El G, Bekele, Farah etc - dominated at their peak. They didn't just turn out one winning performance in a year. He simply looks like another Ramzi or Katir.
I disagree. -Sometimes times matter way more than a win. In a way it’s fair to say that Hocker voluntarily gave away the win in that 3000m in order to make it faster (he could maybe have stayed behind Fisher and thus outperformed him. But he chose honesty and a contribution to a new WR.)
Jakob did by the way the same in his 3000m in 2020 against Kiplimo. -He skipped the draft he had in the last lap to try to break the European record, and didn’t care that the Ugandaen thus easier could win. Honesty, getting what is inside out in times is far more important in most races than winning.
You are mentioning among others Ovett. But he prioritised racing against athletes (like Wessinghage and Scott) he knew he had an edge on. And he let them do all the work. The problem with that (among a lot of things) is that you might end up with a lot of wins and bad times. And although I am an outlier when it comes to appreciating times I’m not totally alone -just see how Mo Farah and yes, Ovett, have been left in a sort of shadow compared to guys whose merits are both wins and times…
To be fair to Ovett he broke some WR’s. But they were weak. F.x his 2mile record after letting Rono drafting him the whole race. -What about contributing a little, and not being so god damn afraid of losing. Clearly Ovett could have run faster that day. And kickers like him, but also our fellow hero Snell (in his 1500m OG win) can be considered failures in that respect that they had a kick (they shouldn’t have had it if they had portion out their resources correctly) -who knows what Snell’s time could have been if he hadn’t saved himself for that unnecessary and “stupid” kick..!?
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I don't presume to take those wins off him or discount them. I am pointing out the clear incongruity that without those two races his competitive record over the full year each year is that of a relative mediocrity, a journeyman, that no one would have heard of if it wasn't for just two races in two years. That isn't what we have seen with the great md runners of the past.
Not fair to call Hocker “a relatively mediocrity” between his two global wins when one knows about the extreme high level of competition that year.
Cole was ranked #3 in the world (by WA) in 2024 I believe. -Therefore one cannot expect a favourable count against the two best. But tag 4 (Kerr) he clearly had the upside of also post OG (not a nobody -WC gold 2023, indoors WC gold, silver in OG). And the ranked #1 in the world (Nuguse) just before the WC, he beat in the National trials 2025. And tag 2 (Jakob) in the WC heats.
Lastly: He was fair and square DQ’ed in the semis. But everyone could see that this was a 1500m runner with capacity…