And I agree with this. Being mean for the sake of being mean helps no one. I don't believe in guilt by association, but I recognize that on the trans-in-sports issue, my position, which I've tried my best to think through carefully and apply my decades of experience in life and as a high school coach to, ends up being facially similar to the position held by extremist haters and bigots who see trans people and immediately oppose them on any issue without further thought. That requires me to very carefully spell out exactly what I think, in full nuance, without ever taking the easy road and upvoting or saying "this!" to a post by a hater or bigot, instead I must take the time to say what I fully think. I have to say that I think X when it comes to sports, but Y in regard to work, at school, etc. etc. etc., whereas the haters think X in all things.
I appreciate the effort it takes to try and clearly state the position you hold this issue. I can see how someone in your situation would not want to be lumped in with the extreme views of those opposed to trans inclusion in sport.
It just seems so strange to me that your position exists. It just seems like such an odd line to hold. Is that the only area of life that you think they should be considered by their birth sex? How about changing rooms? Locker rooms? Hiring discrimination?
what would you say to a transgender youth who is not very good at their sport but wants to do it? Like a 7:30 1600m runner? Would you tell them it would be unfair to let them run with other girls?
In some ways, I almost respect the outright bigots more in their convictions. At least they are consistent.
Well, as someone explained on another thread, a legally disabled person may not be eligible for any para category. That does not deny ther person's disability status.
Another example is the change of allegiance in sports. FIBA allows only one player per team who swtiched nationality after the 17th birthday. So if one naturalized player makes the national team, another player has to be kicked out. That does not deny the natinality of that naturalized athlete.
I see this issue in the same way. I don't think it has to be contradiction to say some women are not eligible to compete in the women's sports.
I appreciate the effort it takes to try and clearly state the position you hold this issue. I can see how someone in your situation would not want to be lumped in with the extreme views of those opposed to trans inclusion in sport.
It just seems so strange to me that your position exists. It just seems like such an odd line to hold. Is that the only area of life that you think they should be considered by their birth sex? How about changing rooms? Locker rooms? Hiring discrimination?
what would you say to a transgender youth who is not very good at their sport but wants to do it? Like a 7:30 1600m runner? Would you tell them it would be unfair to let them run with other girls?
In some ways, I almost respect the outright bigots more in their convictions. At least they are consistent.
Well, as someone explained on another thread, a legally disabled person may not be eligible for any para category. That does not deny ther person's disability status.
Another example is the change of allegiance in sports. FIBA allows only one player per team who swtiched nationality after the 17th birthday. So if one naturalized player makes the national team, another player has to be kicked out. That does not deny the natinality of that naturalized athlete.
I see this issue in the same way. I don't think it has to be contradiction to say some women are not eligible to compete in the women's sports.
The USA women's football team were convincingly beaten by a team of adolescents in a embarrassing defeat for the world champions. They lost 5-2 against Dallas Under-15s.
So if Usain Bolt had chil rearing hips he would still run 9.58? You cuc! Do you actually think real Madrid would lose to a women's team if they transitioned?
Rapinoe is not the only elite female athletes with these views, in fact, there are many. Others include Candace Parker or Billie Jean King, for example. It’s pretty lame to label them all deluded narcissists or simply spewing “woke garbage.” You may not agree, but the point of view is one that is echoed by many women athletes. Not all certainly, but not just Rapinoe.
The labeling of opposing views with demeaning terms is a big issue in the world today. People who don’t think trans should compete in girls sports are labeled “bigots”, while those in support are “woke” or “libtards”. Chris Evans fell into this ahead of the new lightyear movie by attacking people opposed to the lesbian kiss scene.
Except that calling someone a bigot is an insult.
when you call someone “woke,” you are saying “that person thinks for themselves and doesn’t just believe everything the media (Fox News, Facebook, etc.) tells them.” It literally means that they are woke up to all the realities of and bullsh1t in the world.
Despite your strange denial, Rapinoe said, " They are committing suicide, because they are being told that they’re gross and different and evil and sinful and they can’t play sports with their friends that they grew up with."
Even with an "and" in the sentence, to doubt that she is implying a connection of suicide and not being able to play girls supports is intellectually indefensible. And that connection means that girls sports do matter, and is very important to them. Therefore, fairness in competition is worth defending.
Again, as someone who is much smarter than you, if I said “they are committing suicide, because they are being told they’re gross and different and evil and sinful and they cannot vote,” as an argument for civil rights, you would not not assume that the vote is the MAIN reason for the suicide. How stupid are folks?
Your response proves that your position is intellectually indefensible. I didn't say it it was the MAIN reason, but that she is implying a CONNECTION, strong enough to be mentioned in her argument. You keep repeating your only defense that it was not said to be the main reason, but that is obviously not a relevant defense, and it doesn't address the fact that she is implying a connection to not participating in girls sports and suicide. Which means girls sports are important.
Since I am not taking any position on the larger issue, just noting what she said, I think we have spent enough time discussing what one person said (who is not a decision maker) and what that actually means. It won't change anything. Better to focus on the simpler issue, which is in sports that are designed to be "for girls", what is more important, fairness of competition or inclusivity, and is there a level where fairness "isn't important" and others where it is paramount?
I'll leave that problem to the people who have a much larger vested interest than me.
Again, as someone who is much smarter than you, if I said “they are committing suicide, because they are being told they’re gross and different and evil and sinful and they cannot vote,” as an argument for civil rights, you would not not assume that the vote is the MAIN reason for the suicide. How stupid are folks?
Your response proves that your position is intellectually indefensible. I didn't say it it was the MAIN reason, but that she is implying a CONNECTION, strong enough to be mentioned in her argument. You keep repeating your only defense that it was not said to be the main reason, but that is obviously not a relevant defense, and it doesn't address the fact that she is implying a connection to not participating in girls sports and suicide. Which means girls sports are important.
Since I am not taking any position on the larger issue, just noting what she said, I think we have spent enough time discussing what one person said (who is not a decision maker) and what that actually means. It won't change anything. Better to focus on the simpler issue, which is in sports that are designed to be "for girls", what is more important, fairness of competition or inclusivity, and is there a level where fairness "isn't important" and others where it is paramount?
I'll leave that problem to the people who have a much larger vested interest than me.
When she implied that HS sports are not important, she was NOT saying they have no value to the participant. She was saying that the outcome is NOT important, and that instead of ostracizing transgenders, it makes more sense to include them in relatively meaningless sporting events. That other poster has a great point because for those of us who have excelled in athletics beyond HS, HS sports outcomes now appear rather meaningless, although granted they feel somewhat meaningful at the time to the participants. I too have no investment in this his subject EXCEPT I do enjoy calling bigots out, although I grant you that you may not be one of them, and one is not necessarily a bigot if they are against transgender participation, BUT there are bigots posting in this thread.
What an @sshole. I wonder how she would feel if someone told her that her team isn't that important.
She made a career on a women's sport that doesn't allow men, but sorry you're not important enough for that privilege
She’s not wrong on the part about your kids’ volleyball team. At least if it were my kids, I might possibly feel slightly differently. But your kids? Who cares?
Rapinoe sucks, probably would be cut from the Dallas U-15 boys team that beat her at her peak. Yep, she could try to join the 14-year old boy’s elite team from Dallas, only she wouldn’t survive. I guess they shouldn’t play at all then.
All of this equity and fairness and inclusion has been taken to extremes. Life is a cut sport. Can’t mandate equality, especially when it comes to physical attributes. Can’t not hurt feelings. Hurt feelings are a part of life and learning and fukking growing and maturing.
She did NOT say that. See above. Plus your argument that “fairness has been taken to extremes” is also an argument to permit the transgenders to compete.
What is actually not important is this bizarre need to humor someone's mental illness like it is some moral imperative. Who cares about some boy who thinks he is a girl? Why is their mental illness conferred special treatment? They are simply not that important.
What is actually not important is this bizarre need to humor someone's mental illness like it is some moral imperative. Who cares about some boy who thinks he is a girl? Why is their mental illness conferred special treatment? They are simply not that important.
Exactly, nothing is important, including your post and this entire thread, so let’s just go home.
She is right in a number of ways. We take high school sports way too seriously in the US. It is no wonder that there are so many problems with athlete burnout and suicide in college. Kids are training like pros from the time they are in middle school. It is ruining scholastic sports which are really supposed to be able building character and learning about teamwork. Instead, every kid goes through some variation of a Bela Karolyi system for their sport. It is then no wonder that parents and students completely lose it at the idea of a trans girl competing on a girl's team. Being inclusive of trans girls is way more important than whether Brittany's softball team makes it to state.
No, she's not. She's simply pushing her own personal agenda. She's a bigot, she hates white people. She's wrong gumbo and so are you.
What is actually not important is this bizarre need to humor someone's mental illness like it is some moral imperative. Who cares about some boy who thinks he is a girl? Why is their mental illness conferred special treatment? They are simply not that important.
Exactly, nothing is important, including your post and this entire thread, so let’s just go home.
She is right in a number of ways. We take high school sports way too seriously in the US. It is no wonder that there are so many problems with athlete burnout and suicide in college. Kids are training like pros from the time they are in middle school. It is ruining scholastic sports which are really supposed to be able building character and learning about teamwork. Instead, every kid goes through some variation of a Bela Karolyi system for their sport. It is then no wonder that parents and students completely lose it at the idea of a trans girl competing on a girl's team. Being inclusive of trans girls is way more important than whether Brittany's softball team makes it to state.
No, she's not. She's simply pushing her own personal agenda. She's a bigot, she hates white people. She's wrong gumbo and so are you.
She is right in a number of ways. We take high school sports way too seriously in the US. It is no wonder that there are so many problems with athlete burnout and suicide in college. Kids are training like pros from the time they are in middle school. It is ruining scholastic sports which are really supposed to be able building character and learning about teamwork. Instead, every kid goes through some variation of a Bela Karolyi system for their sport. It is then no wonder that parents and students completely lose it at the idea of a trans girl competing on a girl's team. Being inclusive of trans girls is way more important than whether Brittany's softball team makes it to state.
