I few things not quite true. First, Tulsa did not respond to requests. Second, aid does not track endowment amount. You can check a school like Grinnell which has an endowment that dwarfs Tulsu but students pay a higher net price. Third, the NCAA does not permit schools to provide any merit or need based aid to athletes that is different than what equivalent non-athletes receive.
Your daughter has decent times/academics, however, I don't think the academics w/test scores will help get her much academic $, so I'd encourage her to look at non-D1 programs. I'd also have her retake the SAT/ACT to see if the score can be bettered.
Went through the process with our daughter who was a sub-5/sub 10:30 16/32 and 1400++ SAT now running in a major D1 program, but found that the competition for the academic $ side is high--runners are a smart bunch!
Yes, they typically are very smart, and driven.
I think some of the posters on here maybe misunderstand. Nobody is looking for a full ride or half ride. I know some elite girls get that, but that’s not my game. I simply want my daughter to get the equivalent of in state tuition. Surely some coaches have the ability to get a kid admitted w tuition reciprocity, no? Or a private or D2 school gives enough of a tuition haircut to get close. In some cases, maybe the arrangement is a waiver of OOS tuition for a year while the kid summers there and gets residency.
The challenge for us is she can’t get into the in-state flagship school, and the state school is too competitive. Surely there are some coaches who can do something for a 5:00, 10:30, 17:00 kid who is not only going to contribute in xc but also in track? But maybe I’m wrong.
Has anyone ever worked through this?
Why don't you move to the state you want your daughter to get in-state tuition from? Seems fair.
Odd recommendation when many of us have been stating that girls are not getting responses from coaches. So if we can't get our current state school to respond, why would we move our jib and sell our house just to get a non-response in another state?
I would move to another state if it meant getting a roster spot but nobody seems to have a recommendation of a coach who is receptive to getting a 5 minute miler.
Odd recommendation when many of us have been stating that girls are not getting responses from coaches. So if we can't get our current state school to respond, why would we move our jib and sell our house just to get a non-response in another state?
Yes, and then you can walk-on and earn a scholarship. Our oldest did that (we did not sell our house, however, to be fair, but our goal wasn't in-state tuition) as she went to the school of her choosing, was not recruited, but showed up and joined the team after being cleared for workouts, long runs, etc. and just progressed. I'm just saying there are a lot of options out there are not every good distance runner gets noticed and/or a roster spot immediately.
I think some of the posters on here maybe misunderstand. Nobody is looking for a full ride or half ride. I know some elite girls get that, but that’s not my game. I simply want my daughter to get the equivalent of in state tuition. Surely some coaches have the ability to get a kid admitted w tuition reciprocity, no? Or a private or D2 school gives enough of a tuition haircut to get close. In some cases, maybe the arrangement is a waiver of OOS tuition for a year while the kid summers there and gets residency.
The challenge for us is she can’t get into the in-state flagship school, and the state school is too competitive. Surely there are some coaches who can do something for a 5:00, 10:30, 17:00 kid who is not only going to contribute in xc but also in track? But maybe I’m wrong.
Has anyone ever worked through this?
Why don't you move to the state you want your daughter to get in-state tuition from? Seems fair.
First of all, job constraints. Secondly, we’ve considered it, but you know how ridiculous that sounds? Move a high school girl in the middle of her junior year? Unfortunately, our state just doesn’t have a lot of reciprocity like so many others.
At the end of the day, you are right though… walk on and earn a roster spot & possibly a scholarship. She likely will just walk on at the state school, which is another school’s loss, ultimately.
Most posters in this thread are trying to walk-on. It is frustrating that posters keep coming back telling them to just walk-on like it is the kid's choice. This has all changed after Covid. Kids are sticking around and coaches realized that they get paid whether they work or not.
Yes. We contacted 50 schools and git responses from 3 even though she would be one of the fastest on 1/2 of the teams. Other girls from the state are doing the same thing. Most of our too girls from the state are uncommitted because they can't find a spot. Looks like some will just attend the state school and hang up the spikes.
Yes. We contacted 50 schools and git responses from 3 even though she would be one of the fastest on 1/2 of the teams. Other girls from the state are doing the same thing. Most of our too girls from the state are uncommitted because they can't find a spot. Looks like some will just attend the state school and hang up the spikes.
I don't find that to be the case that some hang up the spikes. In my experience, they give it a great shot. Remember, coaches are also graded on roster size as roster size = tuition thus revenue for the school. So a good runner with talent and times will be given an opportunity at 95% of schools... 100% of D2 and D3s. I think the real issue here is the girl is probably a 5:20 miler and not a 5:02, just not being honest here.
Expecting a lot of replies for a non-standout junior probably isn’t reasonable. She might get more after junior track season. Even these days most track athletes haven’t decided where they’ll end up before senior spring (the better ones have for the most part, but most haven’t).
I haven’t read the whole thread but keep in mind that the extra Covid year has made a bunch of fifth and sixth year runners available to coaches. If I were a coach I’d spend most of my time there as those are proven college runners. Coaches are bombarded with emails these days. They just can’t answer everyone.
I don’t know about athletic money for that level of athlete but there probably are schools in Utah, Idaho, Montana that could get close to your in-state rate with various scholarships. Otherwise, what runners in these situations usually do is look regionally at schools where they can get in and have running as an option. Utah has some state schools where you can get residency after year one, for example, and expenses can be very low at a place like Utah State.
Anyway, I wouldn’t get too worried yet. I’d see how track season goes and keep reaching out this spring and summer.
You are incorrect. I have several seniors right now who are considering doing just that. They are 5 minute milers. They have been pursuing this for a year and have been unsuccessful. Time is running out to accept some regular admissions offers.
pretty sure I already posted here on this but it was many pages back.... I think you can still get good deals $$ wise if you are persistent... My daughter is a true Freshman. her sophomore/ junior years of HS was part of the Covid mess... She ran out of state Junior indoor broke 11:00 in 2 mile.. that spring low 10:50's and sub 5:00 in 1600.. also sub 2:18 in 800..We did a lot of reaching out. she is a top student but was NOT looking at crazy high end academic schools like Ivy etc as she has always wanted to be an elementary school teacher when she is done running/college. Sometimes I think if you are real strong academically and you apply to a slightly lower academic school you may get more $$ as you are a "catch" for that school.
Looked at conferences like CAA, MAC, America East very hard.. looked briefly at some bigger schools and conferences but wanted to NOT go to a huge program.. wanted to contribute right away. Between academic and merit scholarships at her three final choices, she got at least 85 % paid for. With more than half of that being athletic. This was when she narrowed stuff down and she committed early ( Late September senior year I think). So I know that there are schools and money out there.. At least there was money available for this years freshman girls.
Just browsed through some of the thread so maybe I missed some details. I’m wondering if proper targeting is an issue for some of these athletes. 5 min 1600 isn’t what it used to be and isn’t going to contribute at any P5 conference meet, but I saw mention of P5. Are these girls looking at tfrrs to identify *conferences* where they could contribute, then filtering schools for academics, and finally making sure that these schools are even looking for distance kids?
I’ve talked to kids who think if they’d be the fastest miler on the team it must mean they’ll get athletic money, not realizing they’re looking at throw or sprint focused programs who don’t want distance recruits. Or who blast emails out across the country because the stats say they could be top 10 XC runner at that school. But look, if I’m coaching Oregon state or even western oregon state, I’m not going to get into a conversation with a non-impact athlete from Alabama when I know the chances of her being willing to move that far and pay out of state rates is close to zero, and I can get a comparable athlete from my own region.
Yes. I have been coaching for 10 years and have had many girls run D1. Somehthing drastically changed recently. A 10:45 3200 runner can contact 25 coaches who had only 3 or 4 women break 10 minutes for 3000 last year which means the girl is top 5 right now. Girls can run 4:58 in the 1600 and contact coaches who had only 3 women break 5 minutes in the mile last year which means the girl would be top 5 right now. The girls write nice messages and complete questionairres making it clear that they merely want a roster spot. 90% of coaches do not respond and the few who do typically merely than them for their interest and tell them to keep them informed as they improve.
But being top 5 on a team where the top runner can’t score in the conference doesn’t mean much. That’s my point. Are they contacting schools that is recruiting distance kids, and would they have fit among last year’s distance recruits? And if they want money can they expect to contribute conference points? That’s what I’d look at.
Then if there’s no reply they need to figure out the next level down and/or apply to schools of interest and contact the coaches after they’re admitted. If they’d fit on the team the chances are good they’d be able to walk on. They might not hear from the coach until admitted though.
Sure, things have changed because of the Covid extra years. Coaches have an entire extra class or two of proven college runners to look at.
Being top 5 doesn't mean much? There are 14 schools in the B10. Each team has about 20 distance runners. That's 280 rosters spots. About 100 of them will compete at the conference XC meet. Of the 280 women, maybe 20 will score at the conference track meet between the 1500, 5000, 10,000, SC. So less than 10% score but you are telling girls that they are in the wrong place if they can't score. And telling people to look where coaches are recruiting is great advice. How again does anyone know that other thatn to blast out emails to every coach in the country where the girl is faster than preicous recruits. That is what the posters are telling you that they are doing but nobody is responding. The coaches are literally waiting for girls to knock on their doors and wake them up. The fewer athetes the coach has to manage, the more nap time they have.
Being top 5 on a team in a single event is meaningless without knowing what it takes to score in that conference and whether the team prioritizes other events. That’s basic recruiting. No coach is prioritizing improving their #5 miler if their #1 miler can’t score at conference, especially if they’re stacking 10k runners or throwers.
The fact that you mention B1G makes me think perhaps you’re targeting the wrong conferences for these runners. They might be able to end up on one of those rosters, but it likely would be after admission and letting the coach know they’ll be on campus and would like to walk on. If they’re true milers with poor 400/800 speed it’s not the right fit. More likely to get responses from state directionals than B1G programs imo.
You missed the point that 100 runners compete at the Big 10 meet in XC and these girls would be number 1 runner on a few teams in the B10 right now and would be top 7 on every team. But your advice is not to look at that conference.
Seems like you’re intentionally missing my point about track times. But yes, if it’s true that these runners would be top 7 in XC right now or best on the team, and there’s track data to support that then I’d think they’d be getting a few replies. I’d look again at the emails they’re sending, make sure relevant marks are in the subject line, fill out the forms again and follow up with an email asking to learn more about the program. Make sure they’re emailing the right person/people. If they’d rather dm on IG and the coach posts there (not the team account which is handled by social media, but a coach account) they can try that.