This thread was deleted by a volunteer moderator. I certainly don't want a thread this big deleted so I've restored. THat being said, this thread has served it's purpose. I've closed it to new posts.
We have a new 2024 vaccine thread here. New people don't need to try to wade through 20,000 posts to figure out what is going on.
A preprint study so not peer-reviewed, but who cares?
Everybody can see what's happening with their own eyes. There's a reason most ppl stopped getting shots, they just won't admit it. All the people I know who have caught covid multiple times are 'fully vaccinated.' Many of them also look like sh*t to be honest.
it's clear the shots are doing something to some people's immune systems.
to be fair, most people I know who got the jabs seem fine, but how would I know? it's not like they're going to just come out and tell me they have some new health problem, especially when they know where I stand and don't want to think it's the shots.
basically you just have a buncha scared wimps beginning to have it dawn on them, and then you have denial-forever clowns like the ones on this thread.
time for another boostie
Correct!
It's a credible study from a group of respected scientists - but it seems like a perfunctory observational assessment - it basically says "some people report (241 in the study) report feeling tired and anxious after they got the vaccine," no controls, no evidence these symptoms didnt exist before vaccination, etc.
if this same study was about long COVID you would be laughing.
It's a credible study from a group of respected scientists - but it seems like a perfunctory observational assessment - it basically says "some people report (241 in the study) report feeling tired and anxious after they got the vaccine," no controls, no evidence these symptoms didnt exist before vaccination, etc.
if this same study was about long COVID you would be laughing.
ironic.
the only thing "perfunctory" is your observation of the evidence.
It's a credible study from a group of respected scientists - but it seems like a perfunctory observational assessment - it basically says "some people report (241 in the study) report feeling tired and anxious after they got the vaccine," no controls, no evidence these symptoms didnt exist before vaccination, etc.
if this same study was about long COVID you would be laughing.
ironic.
the only thing "perfunctory" is your observation of the evidence.
There are 241 people that claim to have fatigue from vaccination.
In your mind that outweighs the millions dead from COVID and tens of millions saved from COVID vaccines.
On the first day of a two-day closed-door interview before the U.S. House of Representatives Select Subcommittee on the Coronavirus Pandemic Monday, Dr. Anthony Fauci, former director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Disease (NIAID), frequently evaded questions about gain-of-function research and the government’s handling of the COVID-19 pandemic. Chairman Brad Wenstrup (R-Ohio), in a statement following Monday’s interview, said, “Dr. Fauci’s testimony today uncovered drastic and systemic failures in America’s public health systems” and that Fauci “had no idea what was happening under his own jurisdiction at NIAID.” According to The Hill, Fauci offered “his expertise on preparing for potential outbreaks in the future.” But according to The Washington Times, he “couldn’t remember many details about his advocacy of lockdowns, his flip-flopping on mask mandates and his decision to allow government funding of gain-of-function research in China that might have led to the pandemic.” Fauci “claimed he ‘did not recall’ pertinent COVID-19 information or conversations more than 100 times,” and “profusely defended his previous congressional testimony where he stated the National Institutes of Health (NIH) did not fund gain-of-function research in Wuhan,” according to the subcommittee statement. Fauci also “repeatedly played semantics with the definition of gain-of-function in an attempt to avoid conceding that NIH funded potentially dangerous research in China,” the subcommittee stated. Responding to Monday’s testimony, Rutgers University molecular biologist Richard Ebright, Ph.D., a frequent critic of gain-of-function research, told The Defender: “Fauci repeatedly and flagrantly violated U.S. government policies implemented to protect the public from lab-generated pandemics. He lied — brazenly — to Congress about his policy violations in three Senate hearings in 2021-2022. He lied — brazenly — to Congress about his policy violations again yesterday.”
Joe Rogan on the New Study Which Claims Hydroxychloroquine Caused 17,000 Deaths During COVID "I asked Robert Kennedy Jr. about this and he sent me the actual study, and he sent me what the results were and here's what was wrong with them. First of all, they administered it to people that were already in the hospital for COVID. You're supposed to give it to people within the first 10-14 days. That's when it's effective. After that, it's not effective. After the infection has reached a certain level. Second of all, there is a level that you would give these people and this was far above that level, and they were giving it to people who are already dying. He was like, they're essentially overdosing them while they're already dying with hydroxychloroquine and saying this contributed to 17,000 deaths."
Joe Rogan on the New Study Which Claims Hydroxychloroquine Caused 17,000 Deaths During COVID "I asked Robert Kennedy Jr. about this and he sent me the actual study, and he sent me what the results were and here's what was wrong with them. First of all, they administered it to people that were already in the hospital for COVID. You're supposed to give it to people within the first 10-14 days. That's when it's effective. After that, it's not effective. After the infection has reached a certain level. Second of all, there is a level that you would give these people and this was far above that level, and they were giving it to people who are already dying. He was like, they're essentially overdosing them while they're already dying with hydroxychloroquine and saying this contributed to 17,000 deaths."
HCQ ... nice ... you know theres nothing left when this is Newname's post.
Joe Rogan on the New Study Which Claims Hydroxychloroquine Caused 17,000 Deaths During COVID "I asked Robert Kennedy Jr. about this and he sent me the actual study, and he sent me what the results were and here's what was wrong with them. First of all, they administered it to people that were already in the hospital for COVID. You're supposed to give it to people within the first 10-14 days. That's when it's effective. After that, it's not effective. After the infection has reached a certain level. Second of all, there is a level that you would give these people and this was far above that level, and they were giving it to people who are already dying. He was like, they're essentially overdosing them while they're already dying with hydroxychloroquine and saying this contributed to 17,000 deaths."
HCQ ... nice ... you know theres nothing left when this is Newname's post.
Huh?
Just showing how Big Pharma shills cheat to discredit treatments for Covid....since effective treatments do exist, they should not have gotten their emergency use authorization which allowed them to skip all the usual protocols before using a vaccine on people
This post was edited 7 minutes after it was posted.
Yup, and thanks to the vaccines the Omicron wave had a very limited effect comparatively.
So it's best to say: the vaccines ended the pandemic (it was over before Omicron)
Not really. Delta and the first wave of Omicron had similar death rates as measured by deaths/population (Omicron was slightly higher). When the second Omicron wave hit, death rates for Delta and Omicron1 were 4x higher compared to that wave. Omicron quickly provided immunity/protection to a large percentage of the population who were unvaccinated and conferred greater immunity/protection to those already vaccinated. Unfortunately, there was a huge cost to Omicron, but that is not the point being discussed. Omicron was responsible for ending the pandemic. There's really little debate about it at this point.
Joe Rogan on the New Study Which Claims Hydroxychloroquine Caused 17,000 Deaths During COVID "I asked Robert Kennedy Jr. about this and he sent me the actual study, and he sent me what the results were and here's what was wrong with them. First of all, they administered it to people that were already in the hospital for COVID. You're supposed to give it to people within the first 10-14 days. That's when it's effective. After that, it's not effective. After the infection has reached a certain level. Second of all, there is a level that you would give these people and this was far above that level, and they were giving it to people who are already dying. He was like, they're essentially overdosing them while they're already dying with hydroxychloroquine and saying this contributed to 17,000 deaths."
HCQ ... nice ... you know theres nothing left when this is Newname's post.
Yup, and thanks to the vaccines the Omicron wave had a very limited effect comparatively.
So it's best to say: the vaccines ended the pandemic (it was over before Omicron)
Not really. Delta and the first wave of Omicron had similar death rates as measured by deaths/population (Omicron was slightly higher). When the second Omicron wave hit, death rates for Delta and Omicron1 were 4x higher compared to that wave. Omicron quickly provided immunity/protection to a large percentage of the population who were unvaccinated and conferred greater immunity/protection to those already vaccinated. Unfortunately, there was a huge cost to Omicron, but that is not the point being discussed. Omicron was responsible for ending the pandemic. There's really little debate about it at this point.
Omicron infected way, way more people than Delta did so your numbers are consistent with the vaccine being essential at preventing death. Almost everyone was eventually going to get COVID. Thankfully vaccines allows this to happen without killing another million + Americans.
The pandemic was over before Omicron, we just didn't know it yet :)
It's a credible study from a group of respected scientists - but it seems like a perfunctory observational assessment - it basically says "some people report (241 in the study) report feeling tired and anxious after they got the vaccine," no controls, no evidence these symptoms didnt exist before vaccination, etc.
if this same study was about long COVID you would be laughing.
This is the problem. You massage the data to say what you want it to say, when it’s convenient.
Exercise intolerance, excessive fatigue, brain fog, neuropathy? I think it’s safe to say most of these symptoms didn’t exist before vaccination and people reporting them would know otherwise.
Almost sounds POTS-like, like a post-viral syndrome. But it’s not. It could be related to mRNA spike hanging around when it’s not supposed to, in theory.
Joe Rogan on the New Study Which Claims Hydroxychloroquine Caused 17,000 Deaths During COVID "I asked Robert Kennedy Jr. about this and he sent me the actual study, and he sent me what the results were and here's what was wrong with them. First of all, they administered it to people that were already in the hospital for COVID. You're supposed to give it to people within the first 10-14 days. That's when it's effective. After that, it's not effective. After the infection has reached a certain level. Second of all, there is a level that you would give these people and this was far above that level, and they were giving it to people who are already dying. He was like, they're essentially overdosing them while they're already dying with hydroxychloroquine and saying this contributed to 17,000 deaths."
HCQ ... nice ... you know theres nothing left when this is Newname's post.
The way I read this isn’t he’s advocating hydroxychloroquine, he’s simply saying the study (data collation) that hard core vaxxers here have promoted isn’t credible. It’s not. That’s not the same thing as saying hydroxychloroquine is helpful.
HCQ ... nice ... you know theres nothing left when this is Newname's post.
The way I read this isn’t he’s advocating hydroxychloroquine, he’s simply saying the study (data collation) that hard core vaxxers here have promoted isn’t credible. It’s not. That’s not the same thing as saying hydroxychloroquine is helpful.
Not really. Delta and the first wave of Omicron had similar death rates as measured by deaths/population (Omicron was slightly higher). When the second Omicron wave hit, death rates for Delta and Omicron1 were 4x higher compared to that wave. Omicron quickly provided immunity/protection to a large percentage of the population who were unvaccinated and conferred greater immunity/protection to those already vaccinated. Unfortunately, there was a huge cost to Omicron, but that is not the point being discussed. Omicron was responsible for ending the pandemic. There's really little debate about it at this point.
Omicron infected way, way more people than Delta did so your numbers are consistent with the vaccine being essential at preventing death. Almost everyone was eventually going to get COVID. Thankfully vaccines allows this to happen without killing another million + Americans.
The pandemic was over before Omicron, we just didn't know it yet :)
Yes. Omicron infected way more people than Delta and spread a lot faster. A high percentage of people were infected and had therefore been conferred a level of immunity/protection at the same time in the same location. In simple terms, this is what the vaccine was intended to do - confer immunity/protection to high percentage of a population at the same time. For several reasons, vaccine hesitancy, inadequate supplies, logistical issues, supply chain issues, etc., vaccination programs failed to deliver what Omicron did. Sure. The vaccines may have eventually ended the pandemic, but we don't know this for sure. The much slower delivery system for disease protection may have allowed other deadly Covid variants to develop and prolong the pandemic. A lot of things could have happened in the extended period of time that it took vaccination programs to end the pandemic (if they even would have).
We don't know if the vaccines would have eventually ended the pandemic. What we do know is that Omicron did end the pandemic.
Omicron infected way, way more people than Delta did so your numbers are consistent with the vaccine being essential at preventing death. Almost everyone was eventually going to get COVID. Thankfully vaccines allows this to happen without killing another million + Americans.
The pandemic was over before Omicron, we just didn't know it yet :)
Yes. Omicron infected way more people than Delta and spread a lot faster. A high percentage of people were infected and had therefore been conferred a level of immunity/protection at the same time in the same location. In simple terms, this is what the vaccine was intended to do - confer immunity/protection to high percentage of a population at the same time. For several reasons, vaccine hesitancy, inadequate supplies, logistical issues, supply chain issues, etc., vaccination programs failed to deliver what Omicron did. Sure. The vaccines may have eventually ended the pandemic, but we don't know this for sure. The much slower delivery system for disease protection may have allowed other deadly Covid variants to develop and prolong the pandemic. A lot of things could have happened in the extended period of time that it took vaccination programs to end the pandemic (if they even would have).
We don't know if the vaccines would have eventually ended the pandemic. What we do know is that Omicron did end the pandemic.
Better yet, in the very few studies that bothered to look, natural immunity after one infection was shown to be just as good two vaccines. Even better actually. Then, two vaccines wasn’t good enough so we needed a booster and a bivalent booster. A mild Omicron infection would’ve been better than a third and fourth vaccine but nobody bothered to look.