DiscoGary wrote:
This the guy who made the case for impeachment. Democrats are in no position to question the credibility of people making accusations.
https://thefederalist.com/2019/09/26/adam-schiff-makes-up-his-own-transcript-of-call-between-trump-and-ukraine-president/
This doesn't make that other guy credible. You know that.
Dairyland wrote:
I just want to ask...
What’s the proof of election fraud? Besides “my friend told me this” or “I saw on Twitter that”
What counts as proof? Eye witnesses say they saw thousands of mail in ballots with no creases. They couldn’t have been mailed. Is that proof? How can it be if it isn’t investigated.
Right now there is the accusation that there were more votes than voters in PA. Dems are saying the data is incomplete, which isn’t the same as showing the claim is wrong. Who’s looking into this? Where is the 24/7 hyperventilating news cycle demanding to get to the bottom of this NOW.
There are a lot of issues like this.
The problem is that we are busy persecuting anyone who asks these questions instead of doing everything possible to investigate. It may be possible to get proof without being able to subpoena people and put them under oath but that’s really hard. I don’t see any of the Dems who threw out Rep election judges being brought in for questioning. Why aren’t they being squeezed the way Trump officials were to tell us why they did that and what else was going on.
On a higher level, any election where millions of unsecured ballots are spread around the country is a farce, can never be properly monitored or verified, and can never be considered legit no matter who wins.
DiscoGary wrote:
Right now there is the false accusation that there were more votes than voters in PA.
FTFY
Wow, folks are still talking about all of this imaginary election fraud?
That is hilarious.
And sad.
Let me be clearer on this.
We have the infamous Georgia suitcases under the table with no Rep watchers present. Dems say “prove that fraud occurred!”. Well if you can’t question those who did it under oath, then you can’t find out why they did it. They broke the law saying that poll watchers had to be there.
Now let’s switch the parties and imagine what would have happened if Trump had won and the video of magic ballots appearing from under a table in the middle of the night after Dem watchers had been sent home surfaced. The mind reels.
This is what would have happened.
The Reps who did that would have been “made famous”. Their lives as they knew it would be over. State or Federal attorneys would threaten them with maximum sentences if they refused to reveal who told them to do it. Then they would move up the food chain until they found who gave the order and why, and who else was involved and what were they doing.
We would know why the voting stopped in many states at the same time. Who gave the order? Why?
This would be repeated for every minor infraction. Dominion voting systems networked? Massive investigation. Etc
To save the republic this should have been done.
1101 wrote:
Wow, folks are still talking about all of this imaginary election fraud?
That is hilarious.
And sad.
It’s gonna be a lot sadder when all this talk is forcibly shut down.
DiscoGary wrote:
Dairyland wrote:
I just want to ask...
What’s the proof of election fraud? Besides “my friend told me this” or “I saw on Twitter that”
What counts as proof? Eye witnesses say they saw thousands of mail in ballots with no creases. They couldn’t have been mailed. Is that proof? How can it be if it isn’t investigated.
Right now there is the accusation that there were more votes than voters in PA. Dems are saying the data is incomplete, which isn’t the same as showing the claim is wrong. Who’s looking into this? Where is the 24/7 hyperventilating news cycle demanding to get to the bottom of this NOW.
There are a lot of issues like this.
The problem is that we are busy persecuting anyone who asks these questions instead of doing everything possible to investigate. It may be possible to get proof without being able to subpoena people and put them under oath but that’s really hard. I don’t see any of the Dems who threw out Rep election judges being brought in for questioning. Why aren’t they being squeezed the way Trump officials were to tell us why they did that and what else was going on.
On a higher level, any election where millions of unsecured ballots are spread around the country is a farce, can never be properly monitored or verified, and can never be considered legit no matter who wins.
Gary, it's all been investigated. You really think you're finding the smoking gun that Trump's legal team missed? Come on man.
In the early days after the election I was worried that maybe there was fraud because there was such an outcry. But it's all been shot down. The Benford's law, the dead voters, the suitcases of ballots, the Kraken. It's all turned out to be garbage which we learned once attorneys entered courtrooms and were forced to admit to judges that they were not bringing fraud cases.
From the George Secretary of State who is a Republican:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Eq6dxVzW8AA4UFk.jpgDiscoGary wrote:
Let me be clearer on this.
We have the infamous Georgia suitcases under the table with no Rep watchers present. Dems say “prove that fraud occurred!”. Well if you can’t question those who did it under oath, then you can’t find out why they did it. They broke the law saying that poll watchers had to be there.
Now let’s switch the parties and imagine what would have happened if Trump had won and the video of magic ballots appearing from under a table in the middle of the night after Dem watchers had been sent home surfaced. The mind reels.
This is what would have happened.
The Reps who did that would have been “made famous”. Their lives as they knew it would be over. State or Federal attorneys would threaten them with maximum sentences if they refused to reveal who told them to do it. Then they would move up the food chain until they found who gave the order and why, and who else was involved and what were they doing.
We would know why the voting stopped in many states at the same time. Who gave the order? Why?
This would be repeated for every minor infraction. Dominion voting systems networked? Massive investigation. Etc
To save the republic this should have been done.
After Trump is sent packing, the republic will be just fine.
Conservatives love to make up fantasy scenarios and tell you with their certainty what WOULD have happened, because the facts in reality don’t support them so they have to argue in make believe and avoid reality.
Gary just followed the conservative playbook to the T.
DiscoGary wrote:
1101 wrote:
Wow, folks are still talking about all of this imaginary election fraud?
That is hilarious.
And sad.
It’s gonna be a lot sadder when all this talk is forcibly shut down.
I'll agree with you here. I still have no idea why Trump was banned from Twitter. Here is Twitter's explanation, this requires some serious mental gymnastics to assert he was inciting violence. Oh yes he riled up his base for two months but that could just as easily lead to protests not necessarily violence. I don't put the Capital violence on him as much as I hate the guy.
https://blog.twitter.com/en_us/topics/company/2020/suspension.htmlDiscoGary wrote:
1101 wrote:
Wow, folks are still talking about all of this imaginary election fraud?
That is hilarious.
And sad.
It’s gonna be a lot sadder when all this talk is forcibly shut down.
You can talk all you want, dude. All I am saying is that it is very sad that your mind isn't working well. Very sad.
I hope you can pull yourself out of that dark place.
I would recommend at least trying to eat well (avoid sugars where possible), sleep 8+ hours every night, and get some consistent good, hard workouts in. It won't hurt. And it might really help you.
Praying for you.
Anyone who believes a 'treasure hunter' over GOP state governments certifying the results, the electoral college, the house and senate certifying results, 50+ court cases, and a GOP controlled Supreme Court will be unable to ever believe Trump lost.
Not even a treasure hunter like the Oak Island guys. He was searching for the Arc of the Covenant!
Lies about election fraud, that didn't happen, have led to the insurrection, the biggest crisis in American democracy since the Civil War. The insurrection isn't over. Yet Letsrun maintains this thread giving credence to false claims. Letsrun is apparently in favour of the insurrection.
Raggedman wrote:
Not even a treasure hunter like the Oak Island guys. He was searching for the Arc of the Covenant!
There actually does appear to be some Oak Island connection but I don't know what that is so I can't comment further. To his credit he did find a magic sword, and then eventually deleted his blog posts about it because he provided no proof:
https://www.andywhiteanthropology.com/blog/not-only-is-the-sword-roman-its-magical-tooAlso something about finding Hercules's sword?
And further, this fun summary:
He has also peddled He has also peddled magic crystals, planted fake historical artifacts, and claims Mark Cuban is responsible for his divorce.
https://www.andytheargumentativearchaeologist.com/hutton-pulitzer.htmlFinally:
"He's doing it by backing up his theory with lies. He's just basically committing fraud any way he can. Like...just making all these fake bulls*** claims that have no actual hinge on reality."
"He gets on Facebook and tells them to 'fight for the truth' even though he's spreading lies and bulls***. He still somehow convinces these people they should fight for the truth and they should help him. "
"He's getting his minions to do his dirty work."
"This guy is shady as hell." -Review of Mr. "Pulitzer" in 2016.
https://youtu.be/WcvEp9DhifcYep...sounds like someone else I know.
Gary, the issue is that folks like you are assuming that fraud happened that affected the election and then seeking the evidence that proves that point.
That's not a reasonable way to go about things. You should not start from the assumption that there was fraud, because it is near impossible to prove definitively that there was no fraud. You will always have someone saying "I saw XYZ that was suspicious" that will plant the seed of doubt that makes it impossible to definitively prove that there was no fraud.
It is akin to saying "prove that there is no God". It's impossible. There will always be some small possibility that there is a God. The best we can do is say there is no definitive evidence for God and leave it at that.
Patriot Dad wrote:
Gary, the issue is that folks like you are assuming that fraud happened that affected the election and then seeking the evidence that proves that point.
That's not a reasonable way to go about things. You should not start from the assumption that there was fraud, because it is near impossible to prove definitively that there was no fraud. You will always have someone saying "I saw XYZ that was suspicious" that will plant the seed of doubt that makes it impossible to definitively prove that there was no fraud.
It is akin to saying "prove that there is no God". It's impossible. There will always be some small possibility that there is a God. The best we can do is say there is no definitive evidence for God and leave it at that.
I understand what everyone is saying. But do you trust the results of an election where millions of unsecured ballots are sent out?
If so, then tell me how you monitor it and make sure fraud is not happening.
If not, then why are we arguing? We should agree the election was a farce and all look for ways to secure it in the future. No one's doing are they?
I'll go back to my first point in saying that if fraud occurred at the level Trump claims, then it ought to show up in the numbers somewhere. In my first example you showed that the way we broadcast election results is ridiculous (please tell the world, people should know). OK, I'm going to keep looking into the other reports of strange numbers to see if there is convincing evidence of fraud. There are a LOT of strange numbers.
To my mind, if we don't do a Russian collusion style investigation, then I will always believe the election was stolen. There's already enough circumstantial evidence combined with eye witness testimony to draw that conclusion. We are not gathering all the data, and I say that's intentional. One thing I do have proof of though, we do not have equal protection under the law, and that really bothers me. Does it bother you?
DiscoGary wrote:
There are a LOT of strange numbers.
TRUE!
80085
2318008
22378008
473
1234567890987654321
2222222222222222222222222222222222222222
666
69
One might say there are potentially an infinite number of strange numbers out there.
When you approach the subject from a preconceived decision that the election couldn’t be legitimate and there had to be widespread fraud, you’ve already admitted that you can’t be convinced of anything. It is intellectual laziness at its worst.
DiscoGary wrote:
Patriot Dad wrote:
Gary, the issue is that folks like you are assuming that fraud happened that affected the election and then seeking the evidence that proves that point.
That's not a reasonable way to go about things. You should not start from the assumption that there was fraud, because it is near impossible to prove definitively that there was no fraud. You will always have someone saying "I saw XYZ that was suspicious" that will plant the seed of doubt that makes it impossible to definitively prove that there was no fraud.
It is akin to saying "prove that there is no God". It's impossible. There will always be some small possibility that there is a God. The best we can do is say there is no definitive evidence for God and leave it at that.
I understand what everyone is saying. But do you trust the results of an election where millions of unsecured ballots are sent out?
If so, then tell me how you monitor it and make sure fraud is not happening.
If not, then why are we arguing? We should agree the election was a farce and all look for ways to secure it in the future. No one's doing are they?
I'll go back to my first point in saying that if fraud occurred at the level Trump claims, then it ought to show up in the numbers somewhere. In my first example you showed that the way we broadcast election results is ridiculous (please tell the world, people should know). OK, I'm going to keep looking into the other reports of strange numbers to see if there is convincing evidence of fraud. There are a LOT of strange numbers.
To my mind, if we don't do a Russian collusion style investigation, then I will always believe the election was stolen. There's already enough circumstantial evidence combined with eye witness testimony to draw that conclusion. We are not gathering all the data, and I say that's intentional. One thing I do have proof of though, we do not have equal protection under the law, and that really bothers me. Does it bother you?
Yes, you trust them, but have an open mind. For each postal ballot there is a barcode and a signature that is verified iirc. Sure it's possible somehow someone masterminded copying millions of signatures from somewhere, hacking the system to find out what barcode was used in the process and tying them all up, and then sending them all out, without anyone twigging why there weren't loads of duplicates. Is it reasonable to assume that without any evidence ? Not really, but if there is evidence you investigate.
The curious thing is the prior polls all had Biden in a clear lead, so it's even more baffling why people think they were robbed, as though something unexpected happened.
